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Pocket ACEs....I give up!

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Pocket ACEs....I give up! - Mon Feb 07, 2011, 03:51 PM
(#1)
Pompous_Mike's Avatar
Since: Nov 2010
Posts: 25
Help my PS friends. I'm here again to ask for advice on what i'm doing wrong with these darn pocket Aces. Several months back I made a thread about pocket aces and getting sucked out. I gave some examples and asked for advice. I used to play pocket Aces hard. basicly going all in with them. Getting call and getting sucked out. The majority said I should not go all in but place big bets 3-5 times the BB. (basicly as you already know to weed out the crap hands) If I feel like Im beat then abandon the hand. But to the most apart I was told it is hard to give advice without seeing the situation and the seeing the full betting sequence, stack sizes, etc..... Well, Im back..... Followed the advice of many and still failed. I kid you not... in the past 24 hours I lost 4 sets of pocket ACEs, one pocket kings and one pocket queens. The latter I can handle but the pocket aces. 4 times ...wow....So I pulled up the last two (all I could get was the last 100 hands) and I will paste for you to read and give me advice. Thanks to all who read and respond. I love this game and want to improve so please give serious advice. And, heck what is the cheapest way to get a coach? I will take advice on that as well.....
Thanks
Mike
Pompous_Mike: posts small blind 10
cribrules: posts big blind 20
*** HOLE CARDS ***
Dealt to Pompous_Mike [Ad Ac]
jeneary316: folds
rocky195111: calls 20
Cmother: folds
zexzeeman: calls 20
Chris.5X: folds
oooooH WORD: calls 20
BHauser22: folds
Pompous_Mike: raises 100 to 120
cribrules: folds
rocky195111: calls 100
zexzeeman: folds
oooooH WORD: calls 100
*** FLOP *** [8c Ks Td]
Pompous_Mike: bets 200
rocky195111: folds
oooooH WORD: calls 200
*** TURN *** [8c Ks Td] [6d]
Pompous_Mike: bets 400
oooooH WORD: raises 400 to 800
Pompous_Mike: raises 360 to 1160 and is all-in
oooooH WORD: calls 360
*** RIVER *** [8c Ks Td 6d] [8s]
oooooH WORD said, "gg"
*** SHOW DOWN ***
Pompous_Mike: shows [Ad Ac] (two pair, Aces and Eights)
oooooH WORD: shows [9c 7d] (a straight, Six to Ten)
oooooH WORD collected 3120 from pot
Pompous_Mike finished the tournament in 1225th place

PokerStars Game #57248394759: Tournament #360452984, Freeroll Hold'em No Limit - Level I (10/20) - 2011/02/06 22:08:06 ET
Table '360452984 9' 9-max Seat #7 is the button
Seat 2: bunny.tigger (1400 in chips) is sitting out
Seat 3: getmoney2435 (1240 in chips)
Seat 4: Zacchini (1410 in chips)
Seat 5: Miester646 (2030 in chips)
Seat 6: ogsf (1650 in chips)
Seat 7: DS_Sultan (1330 in chips)
Seat 8: fishyfranky (1440 in chips)
Seat 9: Pompous_Mike (1500 in chips)
fishyfranky: posts small blind 10
Pompous_Mike: posts big blind 20
*** HOLE CARDS ***
Dealt to Pompous_Mike [Ad Ah]
bunny.tigger: folds
gerronamoe1 is connected
getmoney2435: folds
Zacchini: calls 20
Miester646: calls 20
ogsf: folds
DS_Sultan: calls 20
fishyfranky: calls 10
Pompous_Mike: raises 60 to 80
Zacchini: calls 60
Miester646: calls 60
DS_Sultan: calls 60
fishyfranky: folds
*** FLOP *** [7c Qs Jc]
Pompous_Mike: bets 120
Zacchini: folds
Miester646: raises 120 to 240
DS_Sultan: folds
Pompous_Mike: calls 120
*** TURN *** [7c Qs Jc] [4s]
Pompous_Mike: bets 120
Miester646: raises 120 to 240
Pompous_Mike: raises 240 to 480
Miester646: raises 240 to 720
Pompous_Mike: raises 240 to 960
Miester646: raises 240 to 1200
Pompous_Mike: calls 220 and is all-in
Uncalled bet (20) returned to Miester646
*** RIVER *** [7c Qs Jc 4s] [3d]
*** SHOW DOWN ***
Pompous_Mike: shows [Ad Ah] (a pair of Aces)
Miester646: shows [Qh Jd] (two pair, Queens and Jacks)
Miester646 collected 3180 from pot
Pompous_Mike finished the tournament in 1081st place
 
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Mon Feb 07, 2011, 04:27 PM
(#2)
donksrule001's Avatar
Since: Jul 2010
Posts: 247
BronzeStar
the first thing ur doing wrong is expecting it to win everytime
 
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Mon Feb 07, 2011, 04:34 PM
(#3)
RockerguyAA's Avatar
Since: Feb 2011
Posts: 1,089
BronzeStar
Well, my 2 cents would be: A lot of the players in freerolls are extremely loose at the beginning of the tournament. Due to this, you can either make the bet size like you did, or make it very excessive like 800 to all-in. While it is really really obvious you have a big hand with that extreme of a raise, theres actually a decent chance you will get called by 1-2 people. You can choose to make the more reasonable bet like you did, but there were a lot of mistakes the way you handled that.

First, you were out of position. That made it a lot harder to play your aces post flop. You do not have the opportunity to gather any information before you act. Second, even though your raise was strong, you should expect a lot of the limpers to call that much more anyways. It's a PSO freeroll.... That said, you can still allow a lot of callers, but plan on improving your hand before committing a lot more chips. If you hit a set on the flop, your usually extremely likely to gain a lot of chips in that situation since so many people saw the flop. If you don't hit your set, 1 pair is rarely going to hold up to the river against several callers.

Next time you get AA in the first 10 minutes of the tournament, make the 100chip raise when in position if there aren't a lot of limpers. If there are a lot of limpers or you are out of position, push all-in, especially if one or more of the limpers has already pushed/called all their chips with mediocre or trash hands. After the first 10 minutes or so most of the crazy players will have busted or doubled up so this will no longer be accurate advice.
 
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Mon Feb 07, 2011, 04:57 PM
(#4)
hemetdennis's Avatar
Since: Oct 2010
Posts: 2,019
BronzeStar
I WIN 91% OF THE TIME I HAVE AA

 
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Mon Feb 07, 2011, 06:55 PM
(#5)
1_ STR8RZR's Avatar
Since: Dec 2010
Posts: 76
BronzeStar
Quote:
Originally Posted by hemetdennis View Post
I WIN 91% OF THE TIME I HAVE AA


Well dont be shy, tell us how its done!
 
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thx - Mon Feb 07, 2011, 07:06 PM
(#6)
Pompous_Mike's Avatar
Since: Nov 2010
Posts: 25
Thx rocker!
 
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Mon Feb 07, 2011, 07:42 PM
(#7)
autodafe20's Avatar
Since: Jan 2011
Posts: 142
BronzeStar
Quote:
Originally Posted by 1_ STR8RZR View Post
Well dont be shy, tell us how its done!
My guess is all-in to push everyone out and pick up the blinds. Expected outcome head to head with pocket aces is only 80%.

It could also be he's had pocket aces only a handful of times in a short poker playing career and probability hasn't caught up with him yet.

Last edited by autodafe20; Mon Feb 07, 2011 at 07:45 PM..
 
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Mon Feb 07, 2011, 08:06 PM
(#8)
hemetdennis's Avatar
Since: Oct 2010
Posts: 2,019
BronzeStar
Quote:
Originally Posted by autodafe20 View Post
My guess is all-in to push everyone out and pick up the blinds. Expected outcome head to head with pocket aces is only 80%.

It could also be he's had pocket aces only a handful of times in a short poker playing career and probability hasn't caught up with him yet.

71times from 16500 hands 90.14% wins

 
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LMAO it just happened again! make that the last 5 pocket Aces - Mon Feb 07, 2011, 08:44 PM
(#9)
Pompous_Mike's Avatar
Since: Nov 2010
Posts: 25
PokerStars Game #57300087808: Tournament #358317034, $0.10+$0.00 USD Hold'em No Limit - Level IV (50/100) - 2011/02/07 20:37:11 ET
Table '358317034 39' 9-max Seat #9 is the button
Seat 2: riverj96 (1600 in chips)
Seat 3: BLUEAGLE1677 (6155 in chips)
Seat 4: Brasso72 (1145 in chips)
Seat 5: Pompous_Mike (3050 in chips)
Seat 6: BullyCrusher (1245 in chips) is sitting out
Seat 7: dirtypack (3140 in chips)
Seat 8: soerin1971 (6085 in chips)
Seat 9: Rozee1965 (4965 in chips)
riverj96: posts small blind 50
BLUEAGLE1677: posts big blind 100
*** HOLE CARDS ***
Dealt to Pompous_Mike [Ah Ac]
Brasso72: calls 100
Pompous_Mike: raises 700 to 800
BullyCrusher: folds
dirtypack: folds
soerin1971: folds
Rozee1965: folds
riverj96: folds
daokta05 is connected
BLUEAGLE1677: folds
Brasso72: raises 345 to 1145 and is all-in
Pompous_Mike: calls 345
*** FLOP *** [4d 8d 5s]
*** TURN *** [4d 8d 5s] [2h]
*** RIVER *** [4d 8d 5s 2h] [Kd]
*** SHOW DOWN ***
Brasso72: shows [8h 8c] (three of a kind, Eights)
Pompous_Mike: shows [Ah Ac] (a pair of Aces)
Brasso72 collected 2440 from pot
*** SUMMARY ***
Total pot 2440 | Rake 0
Board [4d 8d 5s 2h Kd]
Seat 2: riverj96 (small blind) folded before Flop
Seat 3: BLUEAGLE1677 (big blind) folded before Flop
Seat 4: Brasso72 showed [8h 8c] and won (2440) with three of a kind, Eights
Seat 5: Pompous_Mike showed [Ah Ac] and lost with a pair of Aces
Seat 6: BullyCrusher folded before Flop (didn't bet)
Seat 7: dirtypack folded before Flop (didn't bet)
Seat 8: soerin1971 folded before Flop (didn't bet)
Seat 9: Rozee1965 (button) folded be
 
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Mon Feb 07, 2011, 08:47 PM
(#10)
shirshot's Avatar
Since: Jul 2010
Posts: 665
Pocket A's against a random hand win 85 % of the time
Pocket A's against 9 7 hand win 83% of the time.
pokerstove is a great tool.
 
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Mon Feb 07, 2011, 08:56 PM
(#11)
Cyis's Avatar
Since: Jul 2010
Posts: 193
BronzeStar
Here was my loser from this weekend... I had Aces, Kings, Queens, Jacks and Suited AK cracked...


PokerStars No-Limit Hold'em, 0 Tournament, 75/150 Blinds (9 handed) - PokerStars Converter Tool from FlopTurnRiver.com



saw flop

MP1 (t4945)
MP2 (t2261)
MP3 (t430)
CO (t1060)
Button (t2376)
Hero (SB) (t2609)
BB (t1271)
UTG (t1510)
UTG+1 (t2188)

Hero's M: 11.60

Preflop: Hero is SB with A, A
1 fold, UTG+1 calls t150, 5 folds, Hero bets t600, BB calls t450, 1 fold

Flop: (t1350) 8, 10, J (2 players)
Hero bets t670, BB raises to t671 (All-In), Hero calls t1

Turn: (t2692) 4 (2 players, 1 all-in)

River: (t2692) 3 (2 players, 1 all-in)

Total pot: t2692
 
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Mon Feb 07, 2011, 09:00 PM
(#12)
19honu62's Avatar
Since: Jul 2010
Posts: 1,770
Mike,

1st thing we need to remember is that AA is only 1 pr and although it looks real pretty and does win 80% + of the time you are going to lose with it. Many times we get blinded by our aces when the flops come as they do in the 1st 2 examples. 3rd example is just well pso right.
With AA and KK we are trying to extract value from others. Many PSO players dont even know the value of their hands so when you see a flop that comes connected and misses your AA as it will many times we have to proceed with caution.
Many psoer's are going to chase flush and str8 draws becasue they have seen them hit. In the 1st hand he basically told you with the re raise that you were beat.

AA and KK will lose you more money in the long run than AK becasue we can lay AK down! Just food for thought.
 
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thats my pont my friends................. - Mon Feb 07, 2011, 09:16 PM
(#13)
Pompous_Mike's Avatar
Since: Nov 2010
Posts: 25
80+ percent to win heads up. all have been heads up after the flop. Im 0 for my last five. That calculates to 0% not close to 80. lol. see my frustration. I just have to vent. I agree this is not normal and in due time i will win a lot with them but at this time i am a fraid to put value in them.... thx yall
 
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19.... - Mon Feb 07, 2011, 09:26 PM
(#14)
Pompous_Mike's Avatar
Since: Nov 2010
Posts: 25
I understand, but how is it possible to lay down AA when the high card on the board is Q and only other possiblity is a flush draw or he/she may have hit trips.... I seen and have done my self a re raise when I hit the top pair on flop and I feel the other person may have missed and I want to make the value bad for them to continue?
thx again
 
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Mon Feb 07, 2011, 10:06 PM
(#15)
hemetdennis's Avatar
Since: Oct 2010
Posts: 2,019
BronzeStar
Quote:
Originally Posted by Pompous_Mike View Post
I understand, but how is it possible to lay down AA when the high card on the board is Q and only other possiblity is a flush draw or he/she may have hit trips.... I seen and have done my self a re raise when I hit the top pair on flop and I feel the other person may have missed and I want to make the value bad for them to continue?
thx again

PokerStars Game #57303122033: Tournament #360452985, Freeroll Hold'em No Limit - Level I (10/20) - 2011/02/07 19:00:03 PT [2011/02/07 22:00:03 ET]
Table '360452985 137' 9-max Seat #1 is the button
Seat 1: polombo251 (1500 in chips)
Seat 2: EDWARDSURBER (1500 in chips)
Seat 3: Faynne (1500 in chips)
Seat 4: jaread1956 (1500 in chips)
Seat 5: koble5 (1500 in chips)
Seat 6: hemetdennis (1500 in chips)
Seat 7: BlazerCA (1500 in chips)
Seat 8: LadyRoyal (1500 in chips)
Seat 9: slammer379 (1500 in chips)
EDWARDSURBER: posts small blind 10
Faynne: posts big blind 20
*** HOLE CARDS ***
Dealt to hemetdennis [Kd Ks]
jaread1956: calls 20
koble5: calls 20
hemetdennis: raises 100 to 120
BlazerCA: folds
LadyRoyal: folds
slammer379: folds
polombo251: calls 120
EDWARDSURBER: folds
Faynne: raises 180 to 300
jaread1956: calls 280
koble5: calls 280
hemetdennis: raises 1200 to 1500 and is all-in
polombo251: folds
Faynne: calls 1200 and is all-in
jaread1956: calls 1200 and is all-in
koble5: folds
*** FLOP *** [8d Jh 8c]
*** TURN *** [8d Jh 8c] [3d]
*** RIVER *** [8d Jh 8c 3d] [Js]
*** SHOW DOWN ***
Faynne: shows [Ac Ad] (two pair, Aces and Jacks)
jaread1956: shows [6h 2h] (two pair, Jacks and Eights)
hemetdennis: shows [Kd Ks] (two pair, Kings and Jacks)
Faynne collected 4930 from pot
jaread1956 finished the tournament in 1294th place
hemetdennis finished the tournament in 1294th place
*** SUMMARY ***
Total pot 4930 | Rake 0
Board [8d Jh 8c 3d Js]
Seat 1: polombo251 (button) folded before Flop
Seat 2: EDWARDSURBER (small blind) folded before Flop
Seat 3: Faynne (big blind) showed [Ac Ad] and won (4930) with two pair, Aces and Jacks
Seat 4: jaread1956 showed [6h 2h] and lost with two pair, Jacks and Eights
Seat 5: koble5 folded before Flop
Seat 6: hemetdennis showed [Kd Ks] and lost with two pair, Kings and Jacks
Seat 7: BlazerCA folded before Flop (didn't bet)
Seat 8: LadyRoyal folded before Flop (didn't bet)
Seat 9: slammer379 folded before Flop (didn't bet)


see
 
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my point... - Mon Feb 07, 2011, 10:33 PM
(#16)
Pompous_Mike's Avatar
Since: Nov 2010
Posts: 25
hard to let go!
 
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Mon Feb 07, 2011, 11:15 PM
(#17)
hemetdennis's Avatar
Since: Oct 2010
Posts: 2,019
BronzeStar
see just cuz i believed you that aa never wins

now i know you lie try not to lie anymore

 
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Tue Feb 08, 2011, 04:13 PM
(#18)
jjmaze's Avatar
Since: Jul 2010
Posts: 18
Quote:
Originally Posted by Pompous_Mike View Post
I understand, but how is it possible to lay down AA when the high card on the board is Q and only other possiblity is a flush draw or he/she may have hit trips.... I seen and have done my self a re raise when I hit the top pair on flop and I feel the other person may have missed and I want to make the value bad for them to continue?
thx again
I think in that hand you made a mistake and overvalued your AA. The other 2 hands you didn't do anthing wrong it was just bad luck. But when QJx flopped and you were raised 100% you should have slowed down. You should have suspected two pair or trips if you were raised after your bet. You rule out a draw because he would have just checked. Then let him lead. knowing your raises and bets and if he continued to bet big you needed to lay it down and figure yourself beat. He put you on a pair of Queens or pocket pair and was not afraid.
 
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Tue Feb 08, 2011, 06:06 PM
(#19)
deezer_dee's Avatar
Since: Nov 2010
Posts: 139
BronzeStar
Play more FL and you'll see the value of AA. Always sweeter to have that hand in the BB so you can get all the money in pre-flop in a tourney. Don't see that you did anything wrong there; I may have made the flop bet a little bigger but his re-raise on the turn would have been tough for anyone to get away from. I would have thought of the straight or perhaps being up against a set - the min raise is always something to be feared in NL . Don't expect too much from AA.
 
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Tue Feb 08, 2011, 06:40 PM
(#20)
oriholic's Avatar
Since: Oct 2010
Posts: 751
BronzeStar
Proof that aces don't always lose:

(Also, checking to induce a bluff--and what a bluff!)


PokerStars No-Limit Hold'em, $0.05 BB (9 handed) - PokerStars Converter Tool from FlopTurnRiver.com



MP3 ($1.88)
CO ($3.48)
Button ($4.96)
SB ($1.90)
BB ($3.42)
UTG ($5.04)
UTG+1 ($14.87)
oriholic (MP1) ($3.21)
MP2 ($1.90)

Preflop: oriholic is MP1 with A, A
2 folds, oriholic calls $0.05, 3 folds, Button bets $0.10, 2 folds, oriholic raises to $0.25, Button calls $0.15

Flop: ($0.57) 2, 7, K (2 players)
oriholic checks, Button bets $4.71 (All-In), oriholic calls $2.96 (All-In)

Turn: ($6.49) 4 (2 players, 2 all-in)

River: ($6.49) A (2 players, 2 all-in)

Total pot: $6.49 | Rake: $0.32
 

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