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PSO System is flawed!!

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PSO System is flawed!! - Thu Feb 17, 2011, 08:00 PM
(#1)
ericnnancy's Avatar
Since: Aug 2010
Posts: 977
BronzeStar
IF you:

a) Don't understand it.
b) Don't use it
c) Need an excuse as to why you can't make it into the money at the end of the month

I hear people all the time talking about how PSO enciurages bad play, wrong play, and how PSO play can never be used to make the money in a "REAL" tournament.

Well, so far this month, in "real" tournaments I have made a $55 bankroll using the same play I do in PSO and another example of this just happened:

I was playing in a PCA Mega Path 10+Rebuy FPP tournament. There were 91 players and I used the same strategy I use in PSO to play. I never made a rebuy, of course I did use the add-on, and I faced the same donks and shove monkeys that we all see in PSO. As a matter of fact one guy had $17k in chips as the re-buy period ended and he went all-in on the last hand and lost, so had to make 2 rre-buys and the add-on.

The largest stack I ever had was $12k in the whole tournment and as we got down to the ITM (15 entries plus 16th place 50FPP and 17th place 30FPP) I had $6k in chips and was sitting in 16th place. The blinds hit me and I was down to $1200 in chips with 18 people left. All of a sudden, while watching the other table 2 guys went all-in, both over $20k in chips. One guy had a J6 and the other a 52. Then my table had 2 all-ins, an A8 vs 45, again both guys well over
$20k in chips. I folded an AK and watched as the tournament ended and me gaining an entry into the 200 FPP Round 2 tournament.

So, if you think this system is flawed, try using it and you might find out it's not as flawed as you think.
 
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Thu Feb 17, 2011, 09:08 PM
(#2)
hobojim11247's Avatar
Since: Jun 2010
Posts: 1,388
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I agree with you and have the same results as you have had.
The skills that one has to learn to be successsful in PSO translate directly to success in real world play.
 
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Thu Feb 17, 2011, 09:16 PM
(#3)
antlovesang1's Avatar
Since: May 2010
Posts: 931
if i hear anyone say they dont learn anything from pso in the 'real world' need shooting!!!

from the pso league my game has improved hugely

believe me when i 1st started playing pstars with no BR and for fun i would be donking everyday
but when you come to pso and learn to play the game there is huge potential to earm a BR from zreo BR
 
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Thu Feb 17, 2011, 10:07 PM
(#4)
Deleted user
Short term?Yes it works and is great for new players.
Long term we need to work on it and encorporate a mentoring program.
Get the old schoolers back participating and bringing substance to the forum.
Make the forum more info based than facebook based.
 
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Thu Feb 17, 2011, 10:24 PM
(#5)
joker41673's Avatar
Since: Aug 2010
Posts: 1,850
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dirtyrubberz View Post
Short term?Yes it works and is great for new players.
Long term we need to work on it and encorporate a mentoring program.
Get the old schoolers back participating and bringing substance to the forum.
Make the forum more info based than facebook based.
couldn't agree more
if the was more substance in the forum maybe i would stop making flames everywhere

 
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Yes Sir! - Thu Feb 17, 2011, 10:33 PM
(#6)
BUDA505's Avatar
Since: Jun 2010
Posts: 350
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dirtyrubberz View Post
Short term?Yes it works and is great for new players.
Long term we need to work on it and encorporate a mentoring program.
Get the old schoolers back participating and bringing substance to the forum.
Make the forum more info based than facebook based.

Yes sir that is a fact. Maybe bring back the mentor program. Takes a comunity to raise a new player. Many want to learn. Just need more outlets.

Have to say hats off to PSO though they have added a lot to the site. We can all ways do more though.

Last edited by BUDA505; Fri Feb 18, 2011 at 02:03 AM..
 
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Thu Feb 17, 2011, 11:15 PM
(#7)
JWK24's Avatar
Since: Jun 2010
Posts: 24,787
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BronzeStar
it's helped my online play and live play.
 
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Thu Feb 17, 2011, 11:58 PM
(#8)
wherethesoda's Avatar
Since: Jul 2010
Posts: 39
i think the pso rewards solid play. thats all u have to be doing in the pso and u will make money in it. play solidly and u will be rewarded.

tonight i was in a tournament and a pre flop shover was at my table, and he got a big stack by shoving, and he kept doing it. after the first hour i was the only one left of the original 8 that sat down with this guy, and i was up to 4k in chips, i think it happened bc i played more solid then the others.
actually there might of been 1 or 2 sit outs
 
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Fri Feb 18, 2011, 12:30 AM
(#9)
CreekRVRat's Avatar
Since: Feb 2011
Posts: 9
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Well I'll tell you why I think it's flawed.

The start of the month everybody is equal and actually trying to play Poker.
As the month progresses the leaders tighten up their game and for the most part only play premium hands against aggrotards.

I was playing tonight with a guy that was ranked somewhere around 300th, we had some "friendly" banter on the tables but then he started calling us morons and telling us to shuttup because we were ranked lower. The guy has played 40 tournaments this month.
I don't consider him a more skillful player, just a player ,with alot more time on his hands than most.

So the leaders will be the ones that play few hands, use the clock and play 70-80 tournaments this month.

I don't see the skill!
 
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Fri Feb 18, 2011, 02:23 AM
(#10)
bogweed1964's Avatar
Since: Jan 2010
Posts: 774
Quote:
Originally Posted by CreekRVRat View Post

Snip

The start of the month everybody is equal and actually trying to play Poker.
As the month progresses the leaders tighten up their game and for the most part only play premium hands against aggrotards.

Snip
Creek, I would suggest that any text book ever written on poker would advocate this and I think you'll find it applys from day 1 of the month to the end and not just to PSO, its standard across the board. Anyone going head on at an "aggrotard" with anything but a premium hand is asking for one thing, the rail.

Without writing at length the fundamentals that are necessary to be succesful in the PSO League and should therefore be being learned are.

Hand selection - knowing what hands can be played from where taking into consideration position and previous betting
Playing position - knowing when to be able to play a sub-standard hand and seeing opportunity to exploit weak players behind you
Reading players - knowing who is likely to fold to a raise and who is likely to push back at you, not getting involved too much in the early part of the tournament until you have a good read on the players at the table
Survival - knowing when to fold

All these attributes, and yes you can throw in timer management too, can be applied equally to any other MTT or SnG you are likely to play and they all require one thing, patience.

Sure the negative points aspect of the PSO League may make players tighter and more passive in the early stages, it may reduce their range of starting hands but it is all part of Survival strategy.

Winning 10BB on the 100th hand is far more important than winning 10BB on the 1st but to do that you've still got to be in the tournament to do so.
 
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Fri Feb 18, 2011, 04:22 AM
(#11)
antlovesang1's Avatar
Since: May 2010
Posts: 931
@ creek sir may i ask you to try reach the top of the leader board and stay there because my lord it is so so hard i am rank 13th today i was rank 31st yesterday had a great 1st pso came 20th moved upto 15th 2nd pso i was to cocky tried to steal the blinds with bb sat out and commiting my 4 bb with k8 suited SB turns over AK minus 11 dropped to 22nd 3rd pso i made itm back upto 13th
 
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only thing - Fri Feb 18, 2011, 07:46 AM
(#12)
lasthippie12's Avatar
Since: Jul 2010
Posts: 75
BronzeStar
Quote:
Originally Posted by antlovesang1 View Post
@ creek sir may i ask you to try reach the top of the leader board and stay there because my lord it is so so hard i am rank 13th today i was rank 31st yesterday had a great 1st pso came 20th moved upto 15th 2nd pso i was to cocky tried to steal the blinds with bb sat out and commiting my 4 bb with k8 suited SB turns over AK minus 11 dropped to 22nd 3rd pso i made itm back upto 13th
the only comparable thing to getting and staying up at the top ( something I have yet to do) is walking blindfolded through a minefield , repeatedly. Though in all truth, does it not mean way more since it is so darn tough to do? Heck, it felt like christmas today when I saw I made it to 112 (or there abouts) Good luck everyone and have a good one!! Lasthippie
 
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Fri Feb 18, 2011, 10:02 AM
(#13)
antlovesang1's Avatar
Since: May 2010
Posts: 931
just so many times i hear people complain of the amounts of games people have played.

if you put your mind to it and the cards help you out you could start the pso get 10 str8 ITMS and be in the top 10
 
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Fri Feb 18, 2011, 11:01 AM
(#14)
bogweed1964's Avatar
Since: Jan 2010
Posts: 774
Quote:
Originally Posted by lasthippie12 View Post
the only comparable thing to getting and staying up at the top ( something I have yet to do) is walking blindfolded through a minefield , repeatedly. Though in all truth, does it not mean way more since it is so darn tough to do? Heck, it felt like christmas today when I saw I made it to 112 (or there abouts) Good luck everyone and have a good one!! Lasthippie
A better analogy would be to remove the blindfold have the mines on timers, do it in the dark with a dodgy torch and an iffy mine detector !!! Oh and don't forget somebody throwing rocks at random intervals around you
 
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Fri Feb 18, 2011, 11:03 AM
(#15)
CreekRVRat's Avatar
Since: Feb 2011
Posts: 9
BronzeStar
I think you missed the point I was trying to make.
My argument is that the format is all wrong. Antlovesang1 you make a good point, it is hard to stay up there with the leaders and you have had to play well over 40 tournaments this month in order to hang with them.
Yes, it's possible to get high up in the rankings by playing a few tournaments and playing them well, but that makes you as skillfull as somebody who has played 40+ tournaments with an average finish of 400+
I would suggest a format where there is a cap on the number of tournaments you can play. If we could only play 20 per month then it would encourage better action on the tables and less sitting on the clock.

Last edited by CreekRVRat; Fri Feb 18, 2011 at 11:20 AM..
 
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Too Longggggg - Fri Feb 18, 2011, 11:53 AM
(#16)
Celtic Mikey's Avatar
Since: Dec 2010
Posts: 31
WhiteStar

The biggest problem I see, is that the Skill league tournies are too slow.
Players running out their time bank, taking forever to fold in the early levels.
4 Hours for this tournament is too long. The 3 PM Skill tourney in which I finished 9th was close to 4 hours when I busted. I loved every minute of it, but it is still too long .
I believe that doing something about the time bank or even making the Skill tourny a TURBO event might help. I believe it would solve some of the frustration caused by newer players.
 
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Fri Feb 18, 2011, 12:05 PM
(#17)
ericnnancy's Avatar
Since: Aug 2010
Posts: 977
BronzeStar
Quote:
Originally Posted by Celtic Mikey View Post
The biggest problem I see, is that the Skill league tournies are too slow.
Players running out their time bank, taking forever to fold in the early levels.
4 Hours for this tournament is too long. The 3 PM Skill tourney in which I finished 9th was close to 4 hours when I busted. I loved every minute of it, but it is still too long .
I believe that doing something about the time bank or even making the Skill tourny a TURBO event might help. I believe it would solve some of the frustration caused by newer players.
I love this complaint. Do you realize that PSO is training you to play in these long tournaments? How do you expect to sit for 14 hours a day in a live tourney if you can't handle a 4 hour tournament? I played in a $2.20 Satellite to the Sunday 1/4 million this morning. There were only 81 players and it took 2 hours to get down to 15 and the money. The clock gets used in every tournament, whether PSO or not, and if you think 4 hours to get rid of over 1000 players is bad, how about 2 hours to get rid of 66? If you can't handle PSO, then you can't handle a big tourney.
 
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Fri Feb 18, 2011, 12:27 PM
(#18)
bogweed1964's Avatar
Since: Jan 2010
Posts: 774
Quote:
Originally Posted by CreekRVRat View Post
I think you missed the point I was trying to make.
My argument is that the format is all wrong. Antlovesang1 you make a good point, it is hard to stay up there with the leaders and you have had to play well over 40 tournaments this month in order to hang with them.
Yes, it's possible to get high up in the rankings by playing a few tournaments and playing them well, but that makes you as skillfull as somebody who has played 40+ tournaments with an average finish of 400+
I would suggest a format where there is a cap on the number of tournaments you can play. If we could only play 20 per month then it would encourage better action on the tables and less sitting on the clock.
I'd agree that a cap on the number of games each player could play each month would make it a more level playing field and a truer comparison of player results.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Celtic Mikey View Post
The biggest problem I see, is that the Skill league tournies are too slow.
Players running out their time bank, taking forever to fold in the early levels.
4 Hours for this tournament is too long. The 3 PM Skill tourney in which I finished 9th was close to 4 hours when I busted. I loved every minute of it, but it is still too long .
I believe that doing something about the time bank or even making the Skill tourny a TURBO event might help. I believe it would solve some of the frustration caused by newer players.
Don't agree with the Turbo idea, the PSO's already are virtually turbos and if people are truly honest they are too fast at present to be a true reflection of poker ability, making them faster would vastly increase the luck element and turn them into even greater shove fests.


The excessive passive play that everyone complains about is a direct result of the scoring system, until that is overhauled rather than tinkered with then players will continue to play as they do.

Playing the system as well as opponents is all part and parcel of playing any poker tournament, I'm sure that any modification to the League format or tournaments will just result in modified systems of play being developed which I'm sure in turn would fill the Forum with threads of disgruntlement.
 
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Fri Feb 18, 2011, 01:06 PM
(#19)
antlovesang1's Avatar
Since: May 2010
Posts: 931
i agree on a cap number of tourneys allowed by each player to give an even playing field
some have more time or there hands than others but in all honesty i dont see any of the top uys playing all 6 everday tbf lol
 

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