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6-Max Cash: Profitable Line w/ ATs?

 
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6-Max Cash: Profitable Line w/ ATs? - Sat Feb 19, 2011, 08:06 AM
(#1)
PanickyPoker's Avatar
Since: Sep 2010
Posts: 3,168
I was pretty new at this table, with no relevant reads on any of the involved players. In this hand, I decided to limp (edit: I actually flatted a raise, I didn't limp) my small blind. When I flopped top pair with an okay kicker, I decided to check it and see what the action would look like. The flop was round-checked and I turned a nut flush draw. Combined with top pair, I felt I should bet it because I might have had the best hand here, and if I didn't, I had about 8 outs to the nuts.

I was actually raised on the turn, but the hadn't actually changed much. No draws were completed, and AK was still ahead of me, so unless the big blind turned two pair (more likely in retrospect than I gave it credit for at the time), I didn't put them on a hand that the turn had improved. I felt as though I was likely to be behind here, but I might have implied odds if I managed to river the flush. I (very) roughly ranged my opponent in my head, and I figured that holdings that would fit the behaviour up to this point included: Ax (stronger aces being more likely than weaker ones, but A2 was possible), 66, 99, possibly KK or AA (I counted them out, though), and two pair. There were bluffs and semi-bluffs, too, but I didn't give them any real thought. I called with the intent to probably bet/fold the river if a club didn't come.

When the club did come, I really thought that betting out would make it look as though I had the flush, and I wouldn't get paid off no matter what. I believed that checking with the intent to raise was the only viable option at this point.

Overall, how do you like the way I played the hand? I'm most interested in whether or not this line is profitable, and as always, if I made some heinous error , please point it out. Thank you!


PokerStars No-Limit Hold'em, $0.10 BB (5 handed) - PokerStars Converter Tool from FlopTurnRiver.com

BB ($18.64)
UTG ($11.41)
MP ($10)
Button ($10)
Panicky (SB) ($9.11)

Preflop: Panicky is SB with 10, A
1 fold, MP bets $0.25, Button calls $0.25, Panicky calls $0.20, BB calls $0.15

Flop: ($1) A, 9, 6 (4 players)
Panicky checks, BB checks, MP checks, Button checks

Turn: ($1) K (4 players)
Panicky bets $0.55, BB raises to $1.90, 2 folds, Panicky calls $1.35

River: ($4.80) 2 (2 players)
Panicky checks, BB bets $2.80, Panicky raises to $6.96 (All-In)

Last edited by PanickyPoker; Sun Feb 20, 2011 at 04:25 PM..
 
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Sat Feb 19, 2011, 08:57 AM
(#2)
JT_Sooooted's Avatar
Since: Aug 2010
Posts: 1,407
BronzeStar
Quote:
Originally Posted by PanickyPoker View Post
I was pretty new at this table, with no relevant reads on any of the involved players. In this hand, I decided to limp my small blind. When I flopped top pair with an okay kicker, I decided to check it and see what the action would look like. The flop was round-checked and I turned a nut flush draw. Combined with top pair, I felt I should bet it because I might have had the best hand here, and if I didn't, I had about 8 outs to the nuts.

I was actually raised on the turn, but the hadn't actually changed much. No draws were completed, and AK was still ahead of me, so unless the big blind turned two pair (more likely in retrospect than I gave it credit for at the time), I didn't put them on a hand that the turn had improved. I felt as though I was likely to be behind here, but I might have implied odds if I managed to river the flush. I (very) roughly ranged my opponent in my head, and I figured that holdings that would fit the behaviour up to this point included: Ax (stronger aces being more likely than weaker ones, but A2 was possible), 66, 99, possibly KK or AA (I counted them out, though), and two pair. There were bluffs and semi-bluffs, too, but I didn't give them any real thought. I called with the intent to probably bet/fold the river if a club didn't come.

When the club did come, I really thought that betting out would make it look as though I had the flush, and I wouldn't get paid off no matter what. I believed that checking with the intent to raise was the only viable option at this point.

Overall, how do you like the way I played the hand? I'm most interested in whether or not this line is profitable, and as always, if I made some heinous error , please point it out. Thank you!


PokerStars No-Limit Hold'em, $0.10 BB (5 handed) - PokerStars Converter Tool from FlopTurnRiver.com

BB ($18.64)
UTG ($11.41)
MP ($10)
Button ($10)
Panicky (SB) ($9.11)

Preflop: Panicky is SB with 10, A
1 fold, MP bets $0.25, Button calls $0.25, Panicky calls $0.20, BB calls $0.15

Flop: ($1) A, 9, 6 (4 players)
Panicky checks, BB checks, MP checks, Button checks

Turn: ($1) K (4 players)
Panicky bets $0.55, BB raises to $1.90, 2 folds, Panicky calls $1.35

River: ($4.80) 2 (2 players)
Panicky checks, BB bets $2.80, Panicky raises to $6.96 (All-In)
I would have lead out the flop to see what was up. I would rather two pair or flush not get me by checking. Was your intent to check/call the entire way? What if you didn't get there? How do you know where you are in this hand really?

JT
 
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Sat Feb 19, 2011, 09:03 AM
(#3)
PanickyPoker's Avatar
Since: Sep 2010
Posts: 3,168
I wasn't chasing a flush. I flopped top pair, and I checked it because I recognized that I was very possibly outkicked. If nobody bet their top pair higher kicker, then on the turn I figured there might not be a top pair higher kicker out there and my top pair might be good. If the action went check-bet-raise, I was dropping ATs like a rock. It was only when the turn hit that I modified my plan to address the possibility of me hitting a flush.
 
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Sat Feb 19, 2011, 11:12 PM
(#4)
PanickyPoker's Avatar
Since: Sep 2010
Posts: 3,168
I'll bump this one time, in case there are any more comments out there, that really want to get posted in this thread.

 
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Sun Feb 20, 2011, 01:11 PM
(#5)
TheLangolier's Avatar
Since: Jun 2010
Posts: 13,517
(Head Trainer)
You confused me at first when you said you decided to limp in your small blind, my first thought was raise for value over 2 limpers with AT would be ok, but looking at the history you didn't limp, you called a raise. This is probably fine without reads, ATs is strong enough but will often be difficult to play post flop out of position. If you had reads this might be a fold or even a 3b.

Flop check is good. If you bet is it for value or as a bluff? Not a bluff, no better hands will fold ever. For value, it's marginal. Will worse call? A-rag calls, but they're not going to have a worse ace very often. Flush draw calls, but that's also a small part of their range. Leading lets a lot of worse hands off the hook. If the preflop raiser was passive and not a habitual c-bettor then leading has more merit, but readless it's ok to let him c-bet.

Definitely like the turn lead. After the flop checks through, it seems you might have the best hand and have picked up equity with your draw to the nuts, and you can get called by worse draws, Kx, or even A-rag still if the other preflop caller has an ace. When the preflop raiser raises the turn, you are usually beat. AK doesn't make a lot of sense as he checked the flop, most players would bet top/top on a 2 flush board. But he can have KK, or K9s. His raise is repping a really small range, but it's the only thing that makes any sense. I doubt a random micro player is creative enough to bluff this way by design. He might by accident though, but most likely he's got you. You're calling 1.35 into 3.45, not enough odds to call for just a flush draw. The situation is murky though. You have some implied odds if his line is the strength it represents. But implied odds are harder to realize out of position. But, you may have additional outs to an ace or ten (do not vs. KK, do vs K9). Again with reads it would be clearer perhaps. As is the call is marginal at best, and folding wouldn't be wrong necessarily.

On the river I think going for a check/raise is ok. If he was truly strong he'll probably grit his teeth and bet for value once checked to. On the off chance he opened with some suited connector and was semi-bluffing a draw (not likely with this line, but not impossible), you give him a chance to bluff busted hearts, and he'll bet clubs for value, and probably commit vs. your stack. Any marginal made hand that opted to take this line like AQ, will probably check down the river but would possibly fold to a lead bet anyway, so you're not losing much value from those types of hands.

Curious if he paid you off? When you c/r jam the river you're going to have the flush here pretty much every time, I'd guess KK pays you because it's so hard to fold a set on this board, but K9 can get away.
 
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Sun Feb 20, 2011, 03:41 PM
(#6)
PanickyPoker's Avatar
Since: Sep 2010
Posts: 3,168
Thanks for that, Dave. There's always more detail to any hand than that which I see, so reading this definitely helps. He actually did pay me off with pocket sixes. He called pretty quickly, and I assumed he only did it because he had committed so much to the pot already, which was basically what I was hoping for.
 
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Sun Feb 20, 2011, 04:11 PM
(#7)
JDean's Avatar
Since: Aug 2010
Posts: 3,145
BronzeStar
I gotta say I like Panicky's posts on the HH forum.

They do not always contain really "flashy" hands, but they tend to illustrate a lot of the IMPORTANT thought processes that will be the difference between being a long term winner and jsut a break even player. This one is a perfect example...

Keep 'em up Panicky.
 
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Sun Feb 20, 2011, 04:42 PM
(#8)
PanickyPoker's Avatar
Since: Sep 2010
Posts: 3,168
Thanks, J. I'm sure many of my posts also illustrate a lack of important thought processes too , but I know I'm improving and I appreciate all the feedback I get from you guys.

And I definitely will keep posting!
 

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