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stake's for 27 man Sit n Go's

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stake's for 27 man Sit n Go's - Wed Mar 16, 2011, 08:55 AM
(#1)
EA2USN's Avatar
Since: Jul 2010
Posts: 176
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With all the staking that has been going on the last couple of weeks, I just came up with an idea for some of you to think about.

lets build and inverter pool like we did for the 50/50's it would have to be at least 100 buy ins for selected tournament.

My idea is we attack the Battle of the Planets leader board we find maybe two highly qualified players and we let them play 20 or more tourneys and we try to get some one to hit the weekly and monthly tournament board leaders the prizes are fairly sizable for top 10 finishes.

the low orbit qualifies at 20 games and the hit orbit is 100 games

I think the best approach would be to play the 27 man tourneys as this is the highest point earning tournament. with 80 pts for a 1st and the top 5 receive pts.

Looking maybe to start this at beginning of April and run it for the month. Hopefully with the right horse we can hit the hi orbit monthly leader board and a couple of lo orbits on the way.

let me know if there is any interest the mars* division the lowest one would be $1.10 27 man games 100 buy ins would be $110

10 investors at $11 each


JT paid $11.00
EA2USN paid $11.00
Panic is interested buy not paid


Still need several more backers or I'm gonna have to scrub this mission



THIS PROJECT HAS BEEN ABORTED DUE TO LACK OF INTREST. ALL FUNDS RETURNED TO BACKERS

Last edited by EA2USN; Mon Mar 21, 2011 at 08:15 AM.. Reason: update
 
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Wed Mar 16, 2011, 12:17 PM
(#2)
Mmmm Fish's Avatar
Since: Oct 2010
Posts: 705
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Quote:
Originally Posted by EA2USN View Post
With all the staking that has been going on the last couple of weeks, I just came up with an idea for some of you to think about.

lets build and inverter pool like we did for the 50/50's it would have to be at least 100 buy ins for selected tournament.

My idea is we attack the Battle of the Planets leader board we find maybe two highly qualified players and we let them play 20 or more tourneys and we try to get some one to hit the weekly and monthly tournament board leaders the prizes are fairly sizable for top 10 finishes.

the low orbit qualifies at 20 games and the hit orbit is 100 games

I think the best approach would be to play the 27 man tourneys as this is the highest point earning tournament. with 80 pts for a 1st and the top 5 receive pts.

Looking maybe to start this at beginning of April and run it for the month. Hopefully with the right horse we can hit the hi orbit monthly leader board and a couple of lo orbits on the way.

let me know if there is any interest the mars division the lowest one would be $1.10 27 man games 100 buy ins would be $110

10 investors at $11 each
After my debacle earlier this month, I'm going to stay away from the BOP for a while.

http://www.pokerschoolonline.com/for...’m-a-Martian

If you make it over to Mars, could you take a look for my wallet. It's probably some where in the wreckage I left scattered all over the planet.
 
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Wed Mar 16, 2011, 12:22 PM
(#3)
JT_Sooooted's Avatar
Since: Aug 2010
Posts: 1,407
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In......of course.

JT
 
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Wed Mar 16, 2011, 12:31 PM
(#4)
JDean's Avatar
Since: Aug 2010
Posts: 3,145
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I'm banging BoP myself now...

I dinked and dunked in the 27's as soon as I "discovered" the BoP, thinking those would be worth more pts...

Well my first "orbit", made up of like 18 x single tables and 2 x 27 man's got me like 220 pts (way far away from the leader board!). As soon as I saw the BoP, I switched to those 2 x 27 man's...

My next orbit, in all 27 man's, only got me like 120 or something off 3 x 4ths and 1 x 1st. :-(

I am right now on my 5th and 6th games of my 3rd orbit, and already have 72 pts playing ONLY 9 man's.

So for me at least, 9 man's, my main game anyway, look to be the way to go.

So my 3rd orbit BoP "plan" is this:

Start off in my main game, and rack up points in the field size more conducive to frequent cashes.
Play 9 man's until I either have A) 400 pts or B) have played 15 games.
THEN switch to 27 man's.

By my figuring, it is going to take at least 450 to make the t100, and a BoP payday.

My "plan" will either give a good solid START toward that, thus making 27 man play a "value choice" to move higher up the leader board...

OR...

Turn the last 5 events, all 27 man's, into a sort of "make up" pool for points.

5 x 27 man 1st places gives the potential of adding 400 pts, so while that would be EXTREME, it SHOULD give you a shot at making the leader board (albeit a SMALL one) even after a horrendous start.

See?

But there is more point POTENTIAL, especially initial point building potential, in 9 man's.

The way I view it is this:
1) You only get BoP pts for a cash
2) If you are EQUAL in skill to the field, your cash frequency should be a function of field size / places paid.

This means 9 man's should see a cash 1 time in 3, while 27 man's should yeild about 1 cash in 5.4 events.
This equates to roughly 6.67 cashes in 9 man's (per 20 events), and 3.7 cashes in 20 x 27 man's.

27 man's yeild an AVERAGE of 43.2 pts per cash (average of the 5 paid places).
9 man's yeild an AVERAGE of 30 pts per cash.

43.2 x 3.7 = 159.84 AVG pt "potential" in 27 man's
and...
30 x 6.67 = 200.1 AVG pt "potential" in 9 man's.

So...

I will be BUILDING pts in 9 man's, and moving UP in points from the 27 man's.

Last edited by JDean; Wed Mar 16, 2011 at 01:04 PM..
 
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Wed Mar 16, 2011, 12:37 PM
(#5)
Mmmm Fish's Avatar
Since: Oct 2010
Posts: 705
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Back in the day, I did the BOP thing for a while. I made it into the monthly tourney two or three times. That's where the real money is at by the way. JDean is right. The people who are on the leaderboard month in and month out are doing it on the nine-man S&Gs.
 
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Wed Mar 16, 2011, 12:59 PM
(#6)
Sandtrap777's Avatar
Since: Jun 2010
Posts: 3,310
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mmmm Fish View Post
Back in the day, I did the BOP thing for a while. I made it into the monthly tourney two or three times. That's where the real money is at by the way. JDean is right. The people who are on the leaderboard month in and month out are doing it on the nine-man S&Gs.

Turbo or regular?
 
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Wed Mar 16, 2011, 01:19 PM
(#7)
Mmmm Fish's Avatar
Since: Oct 2010
Posts: 705
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sandtrap777 View Post
Turbo or regular?
Both yeild the same points. Assuming equal skill level in both, you can get more tubos is in a shorter period of time. I played turbos. Back then, I would start early Sunday morning with 3 $27s, 3 $16s, and 3 $6.50s. From there I would go wherever varience led me.

Usually I would end up with at least one first place and another cash in at least one of the orbits. So, if I had one or two good orbits started, I would finish the string. If I posted a good low orbit, I would go for a high orbit. If I knocked myself out on all of them, sometimes I would go to the $1.75 18-man or the $60s.

If I were you JDean, I would do the reverse of what you are doing. If you are comfortable multing nine at a time, I would start with three $1.20s, three $3.40s and three $5.50s. If you can get at least an 80 point start with 17 to play, switch to 9-man for the next 14 or so. If you are competitive after 17, figurer out your best equity play. Sometimes it will be another 9-man. Sometimes you will need 80 points and your best play will be a 27-player.

Anyway, JDean sounds like you might have some backing support in this thread if you need it.
 
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Wed Mar 16, 2011, 01:46 PM
(#8)
EA2USN's Avatar
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Posts: 176
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Interesting JD. Lets kick this around for the rest of the month and see if we can get a horse to run in April. JD you will be in the mix for horse if you'd like.

JT i assume the extra $11 you sent me is for this?

Im open to a combination of 9 man and 27 man games.

another Idea was thinking possibly 9 investors and a horse each would recieve 10% of any profit but the horse does not put any money in just plays so the investors split the $110 9 ways or about $12.22 each?

Open for ideas on this

Last edited by EA2USN; Wed Mar 16, 2011 at 01:51 PM.. Reason: additional info added
 
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Wed Mar 16, 2011, 02:25 PM
(#9)
JDean's Avatar
Since: Aug 2010
Posts: 3,145
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mmmm Fish View Post
Both yeild the same points. Assuming equal skill level in both, you can get more tubos is in a shorter period of time. I played turbos. Back then, I would start early Sunday morning with 3 $27s, 3 $16s, and 3 $6.50s. From there I would go wherever varience led me.

Usually I would end up with at least one first place and another cash in at least one of the orbits. So, if I had one or two good orbits started, I would finish the string. If I posted a good low orbit, I would go for a high orbit. If I knocked myself out on all of them, sometimes I would go to the $1.75 18-man or the $60s.

If I were you JDean, I would do the reverse of what you are doing. If you are comfortable multing nine at a time, I would start with three $1.20s, three $3.40s and three $5.50s. If you can get at least an 80 point start with 17 to play, switch to 9-man for the next 14 or so. If you are competitive after 17, figurer out your best equity play. Sometimes it will be another 9-man. Sometimes you will need 80 points and your best play will be a 27-player.

Anyway, JDean sounds like you might have some backing support in this thread if you need it.
mmmmmFish:

I'm playin on jsut $20, so I cannot afford more than $1.20 games. I am even pretty under-funded for that!

I started like 5 days ago on that $20, and have been as high as $27.13, and as low as $10 and change. right now, I am just coming off another down streak, and am at $18.93...

My little "foray" into the 27 man's actually COST me a bit of cash, despite cashing 4 times in 18 events! Luckily it was only about an 80c "hit"...

My current down swing is not really a case of the "run bads", but is more attributable to continued play of the 27 mans. I went for like 7 more of 'em (after the 18 in my "orbit"). I didn't cash any of those. So while I was very near my "expected" cash rate, I just hadn't binked enough deep wins to maintain profitability in 27 man's, and my BR size "demanded" I move back to the less variance events to re-coup a bit. I made the move back to 9 man's with a bit over $15 left, and have increased that nicely...



So MmmmmmFish, for me it is not jsut the BoP I have to be concerned with, but also the hassles of variance banging HARD on a sub-optimal BR.

I KNOW if I kept up the 27 man's, I WOULD hit some wins or 2nds to move firmly out of the small negative, but I just didn't have BR ROOM to risk it...

I am close to back to where I started tho, so it is all good!



...and EA...

I would definately like to be considered as a "horse" if you go with this stake.

My actual $1.20 Single Table "run" results (thus far):


9 man SNG Running Results:
(each line below is 1 "session")

6 x $1.20 9 man SNG, 2 x 1st, 1 x 3rd
14 x $1.20 Single Table SNG, 1 x 1st, 2 x 2nd, 1 x 3rd
7 x $1.20 Single Table SNG, 1 x 2nd, 1 x 3rd
6 x $1.20 Single Table SNG, 2 x 1st
8 x $1.20 Single Table SNG, 3 x 1st, 1 x 2nd
5 x $1.20 Single Table SNG, 2 x 1st, 1 x 3rd
8 x $1.20 Single Table SNG, 1 x 3rd
4 x $1.20 Single Table SNG, NO CASHES

7 x $1.20 Single Table SNG, 2 x 1st, 1 x 2nd

<current, on going session>

4 x $1.20 Single Table SNG, 1 x 2nd...

69 x $1.20 single Table SNG
23 Cashes, or EXACTLY 1 in 3
BUT...
Rather than 1/3rd 1st's, 1/3rd 2nd's, and 1/3rd 3rd's, I am running:
52% 1st's (12 of 23), 26% 2nd's (6 of 23), and 22% 3rd's (5 of 23)

Not TOO Shabby really...

and thanks for any consideration!

:-)

Last edited by JDean; Wed Mar 16, 2011 at 03:03 PM..
 
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Wed Mar 16, 2011, 05:41 PM
(#10)
JT_Sooooted's Avatar
Since: Aug 2010
Posts: 1,407
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Quote:
Originally Posted by EA2USN View Post
Interesting JD. Lets kick this around for the rest of the month and see if we can get a horse to run in April. JD you will be in the mix for horse if you'd like.

JT i assume the extra $11 you sent me is for this?

Im open to a combination of 9 man and 27 man games.

another Idea was thinking possibly 9 investors and a horse each would recieve 10% of any profit but the horse does not put any money in just plays so the investors split the $110 9 ways or about $12.22 each?

Open for ideas on this
Yep, I vote 27 man's only.

JT
 
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Thu Mar 17, 2011, 02:10 AM
(#11)
JDean's Avatar
Since: Aug 2010
Posts: 3,145
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JT_Sooooted View Post
Yep, I vote 27 man's only.

JT
27 mans vs 9 mans really depends on the "goals" of the stakers...

If it is pure PROFIT, all 27 mans may be better. One of the benefits of larger field events is that the win potential is some much greater. The draw back is the variance will tend to sap BR's if a big score isnt made early.

In a staking situation, the risk of variance is spread across a group, thus the available BRis (nominally) LARGER, so why not go for the greater potential return of MTT SNG's?

But I was under the assumption that this thread started as a way to bang out BoP points...

If that is the case, 9 man events are CLEARLY the better option.

so it kinda boils down to whether the stakers want to derive profit simply form game play, or want to get it from a posible return off the leader board...

It is going to take between 650 an 675 to score $150 off the low orbit board at the mercury level.
that is an AVERAGE of at least 32.5 pts across all 20 events in single tables. so you essentially would have to average a cash in EVERY event (for 9 mans), AND exceed the average distribution of 1st, 2nds, and 3rd to expect to "win" the mercury low orbit! Accumulating that score in 27 mans is even harder...

Even just a t100 placing will take around 450 pts, and would require 22.5 pts per event on average. Chasing THAT only nets $3 though (and the free roll ticket), so is that really a "valid" goal for a stake run?

My thoughts (for what they are worth): A hi finish in the BoP will be TOUGH. A lo finish is not worth the time to "chase" $3 or $5 for a "group", altho a BI to the $50k free roll could be a nice sweetener if that could be binked for a good score...

So JT may be on the "right track": go for 27 man's and book greater potential return off the variance cushion that a spead staking set up gives. Just because you are not playing OPTIMAL BoP games does not mean it is impossible to get to the BoP t100, and the 50k ticket.

the overall PROFIT is the key, that and the BoP TICKET.

27 man's do not preclude ticket potential, and do carry greater profit potential, albeit with a bit more "risk" of dipping deeper into the stake money to score profit.
 
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Thu Mar 17, 2011, 03:02 AM
(#12)
PanickyPoker's Avatar
Since: Sep 2010
Posts: 3,168
I'm interested in staking, but since Fish's attempt (and my own attempts before that), I am extremely skeptical of getting anything from the BoP. I've never even heard of somebody scoring a BoP cash. This would essentially be a very simple staking operation in a very specific game type, and I think a BoP cash would be an unlikely windfall. If someone's confident they could do it, then that would give me some hope, but the fact that nobody here has mentioned (in my memory) a BoP cash does lead me to believe that it might not be as close a target as we might think.
 
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Thu Mar 17, 2011, 07:11 AM
(#13)
roomik17's Avatar
Since: Aug 2010
Posts: 4,556
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you need massive quantity to get on the bop, I think Dasensfan has been on it a few times
 
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Thu Mar 17, 2011, 09:27 AM
(#14)
xxAPCxx's Avatar
Since: Jul 2010
Posts: 37
sitting in 7th with 521 atm for merc div.
mostly 9 mans and a couple 18s ,hope it holds for top 10



[IMG] Uploaded with ImageShack.us[/IMG]
 
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Thu Mar 17, 2011, 10:40 AM
(#15)
EA2USN's Avatar
Since: Jul 2010
Posts: 176
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Great job APC.

maybe as APC and JD attest the 9 mans or mix of 18 and 27 may be the better option

would you like your name entered into the player pool APC?
 
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Fri Mar 18, 2011, 03:40 PM
(#16)
JT_Sooooted's Avatar
Since: Aug 2010
Posts: 1,407
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Quote:
Originally Posted by EA2USN View Post
With all the staking that has been going on the last couple of weeks, I just came up with an idea for some of you to think about.

lets build and inverter pool like we did for the 50/50's it would have to be at least 100 buy ins for selected tournament.

My idea is we attack the Battle of the Planets leader board we find maybe two highly qualified players and we let them play 20 or more tourneys and we try to get some one to hit the weekly and monthly tournament board leaders the prizes are fairly sizable for top 10 finishes.

the low orbit qualifies at 20 games and the hit orbit is 100 games

I think the best approach would be to play the 27 man tourneys as this is the highest point earning tournament. with 80 pts for a 1st and the top 5 receive pts.

Looking maybe to start this at beginning of April and run it for the month. Hopefully with the right horse we can hit the hi orbit monthly leader board and a couple of lo orbits on the way.

let me know if there is any interest the mars* division the lowest one would be $1.10 27 man games 100 buy ins would be $110

10 investors at $11 each


JT paid $11.00
EA2USN paid $11.00
Panic is interested buy not paid


Still need several more backers or I'm gonna have to scrub this mission
You and I can run this and show the benefits. I don't care how many we got. Let's take a shot next week at the BOP's.

Come up with something.

JT
 
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Fri Mar 18, 2011, 06:47 PM
(#17)
Dewski68's Avatar
Since: Aug 2010
Posts: 170
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Where can one find these battle of the planet games?
 
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Fri Mar 18, 2011, 07:07 PM
(#18)
JT_Sooooted's Avatar
Since: Aug 2010
Posts: 1,407
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dewski68 View Post
Where can one find these battle of the planet games?
It's a bonus for SnG runner's. Look at Pokerstars.com homepage. Promotions maybe???

JT
 
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Fri Mar 18, 2011, 07:17 PM
(#19)
Dewski68's Avatar
Since: Aug 2010
Posts: 170
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I found it on pokerstars.com & it states it for all 27 man or under games, I guess.
 
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Fri Mar 18, 2011, 07:28 PM
(#20)
JT_Sooooted's Avatar
Since: Aug 2010
Posts: 1,407
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dewski68 View Post
I found it on pokerstars.com & it states it for all 27 man or under games, I guess.
Correct

JT
 

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