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In Support of US Players - The Tower That Ate People

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In Support of US Players - The Tower That Ate People - Sun Apr 17, 2011, 11:58 AM
(#1)
bogweed1964's Avatar
Since: Jan 2010
Posts: 774
As most will know I'm not adverse to critising either PS or PSO when I feel it warranted, and whilst I've seen a few posts trying to seperate the 2 the truth is PSO is part of PS, if PS goes down so does the PSO, end of.

In all this furor the one thing that has saddened me most is the complete lack of input from PSO Staff. Whilst I appreciate they truly may be in the dark as to what is going on and what the potential implications are for all a simple statement to that effect would not go amiss. For most PSO Staff are the link to PS, or do they carry that badge on their avatars in breach of copyright?

It appears they are content to let Joe, Too & Eric deal with the increasing morass of discontent and frustration that is naturally being posted.

I know from US friends that they have received no email or contact from PS to explain the situation or attempt to calm their concerns as to what is the potential consequence in all this to their money that PS are currently holding, frozen or not.

My main gripe with PS and PSO has always been its poor communication skills which in turn is a reflection of its poor customer care and relations, the current situation emphasises fully how poor those skills are.

For me their handling of this entire situation is leaving more than a nasty taste in my mouth an reeks of contempt and distain for the people who pay their wages or fund their FPP's.

Until this matter is resolved I am prepared to stick around and see what the outcome is but should it be found that PS has indeed been acting illegally and that US players get "shafted" of their bankrolls as a result I as a non-US player will be immediately withdrawing from any association with the site, I leave it to the morals and conscience of other to do as they see fit.
 
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Sun Apr 17, 2011, 12:12 PM
(#2)
TheLangolier's Avatar
Since: Jun 2010
Posts: 13,476
(Head Trainer)
Quote:
Originally Posted by bogweed1964 View Post
In all this furor the one thing that has saddened me most is the complete lack of input from PSO Staff. Whilst I appreciate they truly may be in the dark as to what is going on and what the potential implications are for all a simple statement to that effect would not go amiss.
And yet, it does go amiss.


Quote:
Originally Posted by PSO-Staff View Post
There is no official word yet. As soon as there is it will be posted in the sticky thread just created in the general forum.
 
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Sun Apr 17, 2011, 12:27 PM
(#3)
Sandtrap777's Avatar
Since: Jun 2010
Posts: 3,310
Was going to say the same
Some people can't read, some can't comprehend, some don't realize it's the weekend and some just like to whine and complain


I feel the pain of my American neighbors, I barely played as it's no longer the same, seems the fun is no longer there.
 
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Sun Apr 17, 2011, 12:30 PM
(#4)
bogweed1964's Avatar
Since: Jan 2010
Posts: 774
Dave, c'mon that statement was made a couple of hours after it broke, we're now nearly 48 hours on and no further word of any kind?, I appreciate your position but I know you to be a man of intelligence and reason and that outside of the PS/PSO party line you must be thinking that they could do better.
 
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Sun Apr 17, 2011, 12:34 PM
(#5)
roomik17's Avatar
Since: Aug 2010
Posts: 4,556
BronzeStar
Imho Dave is probably awaiting word more than most of us... he probably has more $ frozen here and on the other site than most of us would care to imagine.... my guess is that the lawyers are dealing with getting the big wigs either out of jail and on bail, or somehow trying to reach a deal with the Justice dept.... the Pso and the low rollers are hardly on their radar
 
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Sun Apr 17, 2011, 01:00 PM
(#6)
BULLSeyeCoA's Avatar
Since: Dec 2010
Posts: 250
I agree with bogweed on this...a simple e-mail would be nice.
What does the weekend have anything to do with the matter ?
It certainly hasn't been an issue before.
Thanks to all non-americans that are showing support.

BULLS
 
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Sun Apr 17, 2011, 01:09 PM
(#7)
bogweed1964's Avatar
Since: Jan 2010
Posts: 774
Quote:
Originally Posted by roomik17 View Post
Imho Dave is probably awaiting word more than most of us... he probably has more $ frozen here and on the other site than most of us would care to imagine.... my guess is that the lawyers are dealing with getting the big wigs either out of jail and on bail, or somehow trying to reach a deal with the Justice dept.... the Pso and the low rollers are hardly on their radar

Mike but would not a bit of honesty and a statement to that effect deflect a lot of the speculation and crap that is flying about ?

All this "Secret Squirrel" chit is no good for anyone.
 
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Sun Apr 17, 2011, 01:13 PM
(#8)
ericnnancy's Avatar
Since: Aug 2010
Posts: 977
BronzeStar
Quote:
Originally Posted by BULLSeyeCoA View Post
I agree with bogweed on this...a simple e-mail would be nice.
What does the weekend have anything to do with the matter ?
It certainly hasn't been an issue before.
Thanks to all non-americans that are showing support.

BULLS

OK...plain and simple...

I guarantee that they did this on a Friday to disrupt the weekend rake that the site would take, seeing as how noone could appear in court until Monday, and therefore shutting out American dollars would be lost for at least 72 hours.
 
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Sun Apr 17, 2011, 01:17 PM
(#9)
roomik17's Avatar
Since: Aug 2010
Posts: 4,556
BronzeStar
Quote:
Originally Posted by bogweed1964 View Post
Mike but would not a bit of honesty and a statement to that effect deflect a lot of the speculation and crap that is flying about ?

All this "Secret Squirrel" chit is no good for anyone.
I dont disagree, I see staff is online reading posts... but if he knows nothing, than it wont help to add his opinion... maybe a I still have no info...
 
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Sun Apr 17, 2011, 01:17 PM
(#10)
XXChris123's Avatar
Since: Jul 2010
Posts: 1,512
BronzeStar
how would you like to answer 1 million e mails
you know every thing they know any way
its all out there on the net
 
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Sun Apr 17, 2011, 01:24 PM
(#11)
TheLangolier's Avatar
Since: Jun 2010
Posts: 13,476
(Head Trainer)
So basically what you're saying bog, is that PSO staff is lying? Yes he made a statement early on that he had no official word from Stars, and "as soon as there is" it will be posted. There isn't yet. Did you want additional posts stating the same? How often? I mean yeah, Staff could come on here Saturday and again Sunday and say the same thing, but honestly that won't do any good. I've been around long enough to see how that works. He'll get attacked for not saying anything new, accused of hiding or covering things up, etc. All while only making a redundant statement.

The lack of additional info is at Star's door, not PSO Staffs. And do not fault Stars for that, they are not being slack or blowing it off or doing anything shady... I'm sure they have their legal experts looking at everything in great detail and when they have more than their preliminary statement (beyond what you get when you log into the client) they will put it out there. When Staff gets more direction on the state of affairs for the skill league and pso in general, he will put it out there. When I get more direction on the state of affairs for the future of Live Training here, I will put it out there (if Staff doesn't first). I have been in email contact with Staff regarding live training, for now it is business as usual while we await word on how this will proceed.

I know this is a difficult and frustrating time for everyone. Believe me I share in that frustration. Like Roomik said, I have a big personal vested interest in how this plays out as well. But running around pointing fingers and issuing demands isn't going to change anything, and it certainly isn't going to help anything. Answers will come, and we may or may not like them when they do. And although we will not have those answers insantaneously, I do believe we will have them once they are available to be had.

And yes, THIS SITUATION SUCKS. Believe me, I'm right there with you. But please don't take it out on PSO Staff or the mods (or the live trainer lol)... we're all just waiting for the direction this is going to go, just like everyone else.

Dave
 
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Sun Apr 17, 2011, 01:38 PM
(#12)
TheLangolier's Avatar
Since: Jun 2010
Posts: 13,476
(Head Trainer)
Quote:
Originally Posted by ericnnancy View Post
OK...plain and simple...

I guarantee that they did this on a Friday to disrupt the weekend rake that the site would take, seeing as how noone could appear in court until Monday, and therefore shutting out American dollars would be lost for at least 72 hours.
Absolutely.
 
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Sun Apr 17, 2011, 01:51 PM
(#13)
shirshot's Avatar
Since: Jul 2010
Posts: 665
What info are you looking for ? All seems black and white to me.

US goverment going after pokerstars and associates for breaking the law,
(allowing american players to deposit money )

Pokerstars stops allowing american players to play for real money to protect the poker site
from further issues.

No pokerstars will not be shut down by the US goverment because its not on US soil. Pokerstars will not shut down its self because its a business still making lots of money.
The world does not revolve around the USA.

PSO is just a website that runs some private games on pokerstars. They can not tell you anything unless pokerstars gives them information to give to you.

No this will not be solved on monday. Have you ever seen a fraud / money laundring case
solved on a monday? ( excluding TV )

Pokerstars should have worked within the US laws in the first place. Also US player broke
the law by depositing but goverment can't go after millions of americans.

In the end pokerstars will most likely have to turn over all records involving US players money
tranfers in and out to able to continue allowing americans to play on their site.
Hope you have declared your winnings!
 
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Poker Sites - Sun Apr 17, 2011, 01:57 PM
(#14)
joy7108's Avatar
Since: Jul 2010
Posts: 2,284
The current situation is very unsettled, but I have a question that no one seems to have addressed. Has no one noticed that only the three largest sites have been charged?? Bodog, a Canadian site, has been accepting American deposits, as have many others.

There's a truism in investigating that says "Follow the money". I have no idea whether the charges are true or false, but I personally do not believe that the American government has the right to control Internet commerce, or to impose their morality on the rest of the world.

I realize that I'm probably going to get flamed, but there's more going on here than we are currently aware of. The US government is seeking 3 billion in damages, follow the money.
 
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Sun Apr 17, 2011, 02:07 PM
(#15)
bogweed1964's Avatar
Since: Jan 2010
Posts: 774
Quote:
Originally Posted by TheLangolier View Post
So basically what you're saying bog, is that PSO staff is lying?
Snip

Dave I put you above the word twisters and mis-readers that abound in this forum, but obviously I was misatken.

I have never once said PSO Staff are lying, all I have said is that there is a lack of information forthcoming from people who should, in reality, have more information on the PS stand point than we the general populace have, and should for the good of this community be making statements on the situation.

If you wish to twist words and hide behind a blanket then fine, I for one believe that the membership here deserve better.
 
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Sun Apr 17, 2011, 02:17 PM
(#16)
shirshot's Avatar
Since: Jul 2010
Posts: 665
Quote:
Originally Posted by joy7108 View Post
The current situation is very unsettled, but I have a question that no one seems to have addressed. Has no one noticed that only the three largest sites have been charged?? Bodog, a Canadian site, has been accepting American deposits, as have many others.

There's a truism in investigating that says "Follow the money". I have no idea whether the charges are true or false, but I personally do not believe that the American government has the right to control Internet commerce, or to impose their morality on the rest of the world.

I realize that I'm probably going to get flamed, but there's more going on here than we are currently aware of. The US government is seeking 3 billion in damages, follow the money.
Has no one noticed that only the three largest sites have been charged??

Is this the question? If so yes i've noticed
But if your question is why has bodog not been charged it's most likely because they are so
small in their volume.
I would bet if a bunch of US players started playing there because they can't play anywhere
else they would be charged too.
 
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Sun Apr 17, 2011, 02:36 PM
(#17)
joy7108's Avatar
Since: Jul 2010
Posts: 2,284
They were charged and paid a fine, and have continued accepting American deposits. This happened a few years ago, their ownership then changed. Bodog is currently owned by a Canadian Indian reservation.

The following is a quote from the Vancouver Sun, April 23, 2008:

For years, Bodog, the online gambling firm run by part-time Vancouver resident Calvin Ayre, has run its business through servers owned and operated by Mohawk Internet Technologies, which is located on the reserve.

MIT services hundreds of gambling websites, and processes more than half the world's online gambling traffic.

Last September, Bodog announced it would licence its North American operations to the Morris Mohawk Gaming Group, which is also located on the reserve.


This would seem to indicate that they are not quite as small as you think.
 
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Sun Apr 17, 2011, 02:58 PM
(#18)
shirshot's Avatar
Since: Jul 2010
Posts: 665
Quote:
Originally Posted by joy7108 View Post
They were charged and paid a fine, and have continued accepting American deposits. This happened a few years ago, their ownership then changed. Bodog is currently owned by a Canadian Indian reservation.

The following is a quote from the Vancouver Sun, April 23, 2008:

For years, Bodog, the online gambling firm run by part-time Vancouver resident Calvin Ayre, has run its business through servers owned and operated by Mohawk Internet Technologies, which is located on the reserve.

MIT services hundreds of gambling websites, and processes more than half the world's online gambling traffic.

Last September, Bodog announced it would licence its North American operations to the Morris Mohawk Gaming Group, which is also located on the reserve.


This would seem to indicate that they are not quite as small as you think.
Mohawk gaming is not small but bodog is. Log on and see how many players are on there.
More than usual right now because a few Americans just started playing there.
 
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Mon Apr 18, 2011, 04:03 AM
(#19)
BOWLINGNINJA's Avatar
Since: Jun 2010
Posts: 76
BronzeStar
I used to do customer service on the phone and part of what we did as far as customer service goes: If we had to like say put them on hold for any length of time and we were gone for more than 2 minutes then we go back to them let them know that we are still here and that there is no answer yet, or that we haven't quite found the answer to their question etc... I think part of what is being asked by some of us wanting to know from PSO or PS, is that even if they are here to tell us that they still have not heard anything to let us know that, that way they are letting all of us know that they are doing everything that they possibly can or that we believe that anyway. Just part of good customer service to let the customer(s) know what they know.
 
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... - Mon Apr 18, 2011, 08:15 AM
(#20)
belterlike's Avatar
Since: Aug 2010
Posts: 85
BronzeStar
Who cares about the americans pokerstars will be british only ahahah
 

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