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Bad beat or bad play?

Bad beat or bad play? edited- new. - Fri Apr 22, 2011, 08:11 AM
andrei17731's Avatar
Since: Aug 2010
Posts: 160
I think that I did everything accordingly and that this is a bad beat. Any alternative plays, please feel free write.

PokerStars Game #61156651563: Tournament #417010215, $1.00+$0.10 USD Hold'em No Limit - Level VII (125/250) - 2011/04/22 4:50:52 PT [2011/04/22 7:50:52 ET]
Table '417010215 119' 9-max Seat #3 is the button
Seat 1: tasek77 (10376 in chips)
Seat 2: Mihalich3125 (4025 in chips)
Seat 3: gadge111 (11805 in chips)
Seat 4: DCorreia666 (9365 in chips)
Seat 5: andrei17731 (10275 in chips)
Seat 6: joeycbcfc (11190 in chips)
Seat 7: gel3007 (7865 in chips)
Seat 8: Knuxz (9305 in chips)
Seat 9: krylinho03 (14925 in chips)
tasek77: posts the ante 25
Mihalich3125: posts the ante 25
gadge111: posts the ante 25
DCorreia666: posts the ante 25
andrei17731: posts the ante 25
joeycbcfc: posts the ante 25
gel3007: posts the ante 25
Knuxz: posts the ante 25
krylinho03: posts the ante 25
DCorreia666: posts small blind 125
andrei17731: posts big blind 250
*** HOLE CARDS ***
Dealt to andrei17731 [5d 5s]
joeycbcfc: folds
gel3007: folds
Knuxz: raises 375 to 625
krylinho03: folds
tasek77: calls 625
Mihalich3125 has timed out
Mihalich3125: folds
Mihalich3125 is sitting out
gadge111: folds
DCorreia666: folds
andrei17731: calls 375
*** FLOP *** [5c Ad Ac]
andrei17731: checks
Knuxz: bets 750
tasek77: folds
andrei17731: calls 750
*** TURN *** [5c Ad Ac] [6s]
andrei17731: checks
Knuxz: checks
*** RIVER *** [5c Ad Ac 6s] [Qc]
andrei17731: bets 1750
Knuxz: raises 2250 to 4000
andrei17731: raises 4875 to 8875 and is all-in
Knuxz: calls 3905 and is all-in
Uncalled bet (970) returned to andrei17731
*** SHOW DOWN ***

Last edited by andrei17731; Sat Apr 23, 2011 at 04:46 AM..
Fri Apr 22, 2011, 08:19 AM
JWK24's Avatar
Since: Jun 2010
Posts: 24,801
Is this the correct hand? This is neither a bad beat, nor a bad play. You played it correctly.

Your opponent is going to push almost anything decent with 10BB left. Since they pushed from UTG, it is probably going to be a hand on the better end of their card range. You had a marginal hand (small pkt pair). Best case scenario, you'd be in a race. Worst case, they have an overpair and you have 2 outs.

With 40+BB left, it's not worth 1/4 your stack to be in a situation that best case, you're in a 50-50 coin flip. You have plenty of chips to be able to wait for a better situation.
Fri Apr 22, 2011, 02:28 PM
TheLangolier's Avatar
Since: Jun 2010
Posts: 13,481
(Head Trainer)
Must not be the right hand, but good one to look at none the less.

You have to call 2720 to win 3320, 1.22-1 on your money, so you need 45% equity to break even on a call.

If we range the villain on about 30% of starting hands including any pair and any ace, our equity is about 52%, This is obviously arbitrary based on how we range the villain, but with no reads other than he's got a 10bb stack and assuming a reasonable player (not a nit and not a wild player) I think that's a fairly reasonable range.

If we knock his range down to around 20% our equity is still 48%.

If we closed the action, this is a call I would make vs. a wide range. If the player is tight and especially if I thought they wouldn't adjust to their stack size by opening up their shoving range before blinding off, I would fold.

As is, we don't close the action, there are still 4 players still to act behind us, so I think that swings it to a fold for me.
Sat Apr 23, 2011, 02:30 AM
andrei17731's Avatar
Since: Aug 2010
Posts: 160
sorry, here's the one i was talking about.
Sat Apr 23, 2011, 04:10 AM
PanickyPoker's Avatar
Since: Sep 2010
Posts: 3,168
I think that given the number of very possible hands that were beating you (AA, AQ, QQ, 66, and possibly A6 and A5 depending on the villains involved), and given that action on the river went bet-raise, you should have clued into the fact that you might be beat. The raise should send off some alarm bells. Reads would really help you here, but against a lot of opponents, I would just flat call the river. I might even consider folding. Of course, some villains will be getting it in here with KQ or 56, but unless you have reads saying that that's likely, you should consider erring on the side of caution.

And since you got your money in bad and weren't outdrawn, this is technically not a bad beat.

Last edited by PanickyPoker; Sat Apr 23, 2011 at 04:35 PM..
Sat Apr 23, 2011, 09:01 AM
JWK24's Avatar
Since: Jun 2010
Posts: 24,801
There are a few things you could have done differently.
I'd have made a bet on the flop. With two aces out there, if you bet and get it called, it's almost a given that your opponent has A something.
I'd have also bet the turn. If your opponent has an A, then you have to make it cost him something to draw at a higher full house.
I like your bet on the river, but when raised, I would have just called it because it's really possible that they could have had AQ and had a higher full house. They could only have a set of aces, but a full house is definitely a possibility.

If you bet on both the flop and the turn, then I'd rule out them having QQ or 66, because both of those should have been folded on the flop. That leaves AA or AQ or A5 or A6 as the only hands to worry about and if they have anything other than AQ...... they'll probably raise/push on the flop or turn.... which means you can fold and save your chips.

It's not really a bad beat because the chips didn't go in until all the cards were shown (and since you put your chips in then... you were behind when your chips went in). To be a bad beat, you have to be ahead and a huge favorite to win the hand... then lose.
Sat Apr 23, 2011, 12:26 PM
archide's Avatar
Since: Oct 2010
Posts: 229
I'd flat the raise on the river.

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