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Coren's Tournament Advice from Madrid

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Coren's Tournament Advice from Madrid - Wed May 18, 2011, 11:36 AM
(#1)
PStarsJen's Avatar
Since: Apr 2011
Posts: 33
WhiteStar
Team PokerStars Pro Vicky Coren is a talented writer with a regular column in the UK's Guardian. This week, she used that space to relay an incident from the PokerStars Women Live event at EPT Madrid that involved some advice to a fellow player who eventually finished fourth in the tournament.

Click here to read the entire column.

Excerpt:

Last week at the EPT Grand Final in Madrid, I gave some advice to an opponent on the final table of the €500 women-only tournament. She was a likable young Greek player who had won her seat in a satellite on the PokerStars website and I suspected she hadn't played many live events. It's probably wrong to offer uninvited advice, at the poker table or off it, but as a sponsored representative of PokerStars in this warm-hearted and friendly tournament, I meant it nicely and hope she took it as such....
 
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Wed May 18, 2011, 07:21 PM
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topthecat's Avatar
Since: Nov 2007
Posts: 1,962
I remember Vicky Coren on the Late Night Poker show in the UK in the late nineties. She was the biggest nit imaginable and only played the very top hands. She actually won one show where all her premium hands held and the commentators raved about how good she was (maybe because she was one of the few females competing) but she never progressed beyond that stage.

I have watched her subsequently and her game has developed definitely and she is a much more well rounded player now.

However,and this is the reason I am posting this here, why do we have women only tournaments at all? There is no physical or cerebral reason why women should not be as good as men at poker. There are no male only tournaments as far as I am aware and the promotion of female only tournaments I feel is sexism in the extreme. Indeed I believe it is detrimental to the possibility of having a female WSOP Main Event champion any time in the near future.

As someone who posts often about female poker, Jen, perhaps you could come up with some valid reasons as to why we have women only tournaments at all.

Thanks

TC
 
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Thu May 19, 2011, 04:00 PM
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flophitter's Avatar
Since: Apr 2011
Posts: 2,959
It's an interesting subject. While I have heard, read and, alas, have experience of how men and women think differently in many ways (Venus vs Mars, etc.), it does seem sexist to have women-only events and yet no men-only ones. To have women-only events seems to support a theory that women are biologically less able to be good poker players. I'm not sure that is the case. Let's hear more opinions.

Edit: I just remembered watching several years ago a TV documentary about pro poker players where Vicky C herself stated "...women are crap at poker..."

Last edited by flophitter; Thu May 19, 2011 at 04:03 PM.. Reason: Addition
 
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Fri May 20, 2011, 05:50 AM
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topthecat's Avatar
Since: Nov 2007
Posts: 1,962
Well there are many brain studies which say that men and women use the two hemispheres of the brain differently; we certainly process information in different ways with men generally using the left hemisphere more while women process equally between the two hemispheres.

Men are supposed to have better spatial ability, while women are assumed to excel in language skills and creativity. There are arguments that any of these abilities could give you an edge in poker.

Personally, I believe there are always exceptions to these rules. I myself am crap at Maths and Sciences, useless at foreign languages yet I know many ladies who out excel the majority of men at both.

Possibly they began women only tournaments because casinos and poker rooms may have been daunting establishments for women, and many of the established players in the early days were involved in the mob, extortion or worse.

Times have changed though and if I were a woman I would be mildly insulted that there were women only games and that the consensus was that women are incapable of competing on a level playing field with men.

As a man, I believe that if women only tournaments should continue, then there should be men only tournaments as well for the sake of equality.

TC
 
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Mon May 23, 2011, 11:42 AM
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PStarsJen's Avatar
Since: Apr 2011
Posts: 33
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Women enjoy the tournaments very much, and the demand for women-only tournaments offers a chance to bring players into the games who might otherwise not be comfortable enough to try. The women who play these events enjoy them and are likely to play open events as well. We welcome the opportunity to give women a place to play where they are comfortable and encouraged.
 
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Mon May 23, 2011, 11:54 AM
(#6)
roomik17's Avatar
Since: Aug 2010
Posts: 4,556
BronzeStar
My thoughts on this is that poker is mainly a mans game, so when women who are new to the game would like to play, a womens only game would be less intimidating to newer players... also they wouldnt be subjected to a lot of the crap that seems to come their way on the mixed tables..

I am all for the womens only games, the more people playing this game makes it all better for us in the long run, and I am glad they are playing the womens only games cause it makes less of a chance for them to kick my butt

I for one enjoy playing with t he women, they tend to think a bit differently than the men, and they add a lot to the game and these forums
 
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Sat Jun 04, 2011, 09:15 AM
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Freckldgator's Avatar
Since: Dec 2010
Posts: 217
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"Seat draws are the curse or blessing of a traveler. My trip to Madrid began on an ominous note. On my flight from Philadelphia, I was seated next to a toucher. This man had a habit of telling me a bad joke and then accidentally brushing my leg or arm with the punch line. I couldn't sleep the entire trip. Still, soon after landing in Madrid, I immediately took to exploring the compact, energetic city."

This is a quote from the Jennifer Shahade article about her trip to Madrid.

For many women, these unsolicited intrusions are part of daily life. And you don't have to be particularly cute to be on the receiving end, either. The online world can be even worse.

It is what it is, and as long as it is, there will be a need for female only tournaments.

Just my opinion
 
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Wed Jun 08, 2011, 10:25 AM
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ketchup143's Avatar
Since: Jul 2010
Posts: 279
BronzeStar
women only tournaments are the affirmative action of the poker world. women have traditionally been the minorities in the poker world, but according to this website i just read (http://www.womanpokerplayer.com/poke...ker-world.html), 33% of online poker players are women. i think if live poker grows in popularity with women much more, and these women only events start to fill up considerably, then they might start dying away. however, if there seems to be a liking towards them, then maybe they will continue. i don't think we should start supporting men's only events simply because excluding women from playing doesn't take on the same conotation as excluding men. poker started as a man's game, but is trying to change that reputation to become as open as possible to both sexes. there is still work to be done i believe, but i think allowing women's only events creates an atmosphere of openness, while men's only events would create an atmosphere of unfair discrimination. in other words, we would be resorting to the attitudes of our "forefathers" (no pun intended) in the poker world. the world class female players can play anywhere and win, so i don't see why a professional or semiprofessional female player would feel offended that women only events are offered.

Last edited by ketchup143; Wed Jun 08, 2011 at 10:50 AM..
 
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Thu Jun 09, 2011, 02:56 PM
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Swaxwell's Avatar
Since: Sep 2010
Posts: 315
Just noticed this thread. I gotta say I am a big fan of Vicky Coren (cf. my recent post in the general forum). I often read her newspaper articles and her blog, and her poker book is fantastic.

On the subject of women only tournaments, Vicky has stated that she didn't like the idea until a high profile female player convinced her that the fields were softer and so good value. Then Vicky played one (PCA I think) and made the FT. Also on the EPT (I think) there are women only events AND men only events. With the final being a battle of the sexes kinda thing. I thought that was a novel idea.
 

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