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Pantaleo vs Lizano - Great hand.

 
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Pantaleo vs Lizano - Great hand. - Wed Jun 01, 2011, 11:54 AM
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Watch the video of this great hand from the EPT 7 Barcelona, Spain in November, 2010. Giuseppe Pantaleo (Germany) takes on Jesus Cortes Lizano (Spain).

Watch video here.


Would you have acted the same way? What would you have done differently? Share your thoughts and feedback via this forum discussion about this hand.

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Last edited by PSO Admin; Fri Jun 03, 2011 at 01:36 PM..
 
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Wed Jun 01, 2011, 02:53 PM
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Since: Sep 2010
Posts: 3,168
That was a fun hand to watch. It looks to me like these guys both put the other on non-flush, non-Q hands and were both bluffing with air because neither had any showdown value. Lizano's river call confuses me, though.

First, Lizano flat called in his big blind. He'd probably only do that with speculative hands, since he would have to assume that Pantaleo would be stealing a lot. I'd say that JTs was probably at the top of his flatting range. With better odds than 3-to-1, that's a decent call, but not one he would make with legit big hands, I think, which sent Pantaleo a message I'm sure.

On the flop, Lizano and Pantaleo both whiffed, and both checked. The board was fairly wet, so if Pantaleo had a hand on the flop, he should be c-betting it. By checking back, he sort of takes hands like AA, KK, AQ, KQ, and QJ out of his range. Lizano could have been going for a checkraise (but probably wasn't here), so his check probably didn't mean much to Pantaleo.

On the turn, Pantaleo was likely putting Lizano on a weak hand, like second pair. I think he was doing exactly what the commentators were saying; I think he was already in bluff-mode and was committed to raising the river.

Lizano seemed to read that Pantaleo would bluff here a lot, but I really don't understand the bet/call on the river with that big of an airball.
 
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Wed Jun 01, 2011, 03:23 PM
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Since: Oct 2010
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I almost choked on my chips when I saw the ending.

Hmm...I would prefer to 3-bet with JT suited from the BB preflop most of the time. However sometimes it would be good to call to keep my range balanced and keep the pot small. Also, since both players have big stacks building a big pot without a hand is very dangerous. No idea why Pantaleo doesn't barrel the flop. My guess is that he picked up on something from Lizano and also wants to keep the pot small. Additionally he has a backdoor straight draw. By checking behind he gets to see a free card. Turn is a 3rd club. Lizano pretty much has to bet here. Pantaleo showed weakness on the flop and this is a decent bluffing card. Of course Lizano could have anything here, and Pantaleo floats, planning to take it away on the river. Usually when I float I prefer to have a hand with some potential.

Lizano's bet on the river is interesting. It's not a value bet, but at the same time it's not really a bluff. It will pretty much never be called by weaker, and it won't fold out any better hands (maybe a few Jx chops). When Pantaleo raises Lizano actually has a very easy decision. If Pantaleo had a K or A he would probably just call as no worse hand should call and his hand has way too much showdown value to turn into a bluff. With an unlikely 2 or flush or better 2nd pair I think he would just call as well--though I can't see how he got here with a 2. When he raises here he's mostly polarized between Qx and total air. It's only 460k to call into a 1.98 million chip pot, giving him 4.3 to 1 odds to call. He only needs to be right 19% of the time to make this call +EV. As long as Pantaleo is bluffing here 19% of the time or more this is an easy call. Even if he would do this with , flushes, and pairs I still think the call is correct as again he only needs to win 19% of the time!

Pantaleo mucking his hand was crazy. It's like folding to a check. I guess he figured Lizano had some kind of A or K and that he could raise him off of it. When Lizano called he was sure he was beat.
 
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Wed Jun 01, 2011, 04:18 PM
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Since: Jun 2010
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That ending surprised me... never muck your cards unless someone shows a better hand... never! You don't ever want to throw away chips in a tourney (nor a cash game for that matter).

I was surprised that Pantaleo didn't follow up his initial raise and bet something on the flop, if nothing else, than to see where you are at in the hand. Not doing so definitely shows weakness and opens himself up for a steal by the opponent. After the check by the initial raiser on the flop, Lizano had to make a bet on the turn.
On the river, the call surprised me too. With nothing, I would have figured that you either need to make a bluff at it, or get out... calling was not what I expected.
 
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Wed Jun 01, 2011, 06:29 PM
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roomik17's Avatar
Since: Aug 2010
Posts: 4,556
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nice hand, 2 guys playing poker the ending is baffling though.. maybe he thought he raised all in? language barrier?... love the guys making moves with nothing stuff you need to do when you are trying to win.. just the end is crazy
 
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Wed Jun 01, 2011, 07:19 PM
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!!!111Dan's Avatar
Since: Jul 2010
Posts: 3,290
The muck isn't too crazy, as some people would not like to show a bluff here...let's face it, no one normally is going to call w/ a worse hand.
At first, the call on the river appears silly, but if he feels that the river bet is a bluff, maybe a 3,4 for a busted st8 draw, or busted 4 card flush draw, then he has the 3rd best hand..after A high and K high. Quite an interesting and good call imo.
Guess maybe we should keep in mind, not to muck a bluff every time...after all, who never bluffs?
 

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