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AK - Big Loss

 
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AK - Big Loss - Thu Jun 02, 2011, 12:03 PM
(#1)
JARGON1977's Avatar
Since: Jan 2011
Posts: 66
http://www.pokerschoolonline.com/rep...ash=5A947846B4

Hello ,

Looking for a little insight into a particular hand I was recently involved in , the largest hand I have played to date at the 1c/2c level , above is a link to illustrate the hand graphically .

I had established a tight aggresive player image and built my stack slowly from $1.60 to $2.50 from 100 hands dealt (15% sent to the flop , half of them checked from the BB) . My opponent was reasonably new to the table only 10 hands played perhaps and seemed to be involved in most of them , I thought I had a good chance of playing this hand well and winning with it .

Being new to ring tables , I would be interested to receive feedback on what my best play might be in this situation and how you think my play faired in general terms .

Thankyou .

Last edited by JARGON1977; Thu Jun 02, 2011 at 12:31 PM..
 
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Thu Jun 02, 2011, 01:02 PM
(#2)
PanickyPoker's Avatar
Since: Sep 2010
Posts: 3,168
First off, betting all-in at a 1c/2c game with a $4 stack with 64o is a bad play. Folding 99 to a UTG minraise is a bad play. Cold calling a bet and a raise from the small blind with 23s is a bad play. Opening AK from the small blind into a loose opponent with AA in the big blind is not a bad play. You have no control over how the cards are dealt.

Here's how the action played out:

You opened to 2.5x, the BB minraised, you reraised a little over 3x, the BB minraised, you called.

On the flop, you hit top pair. You bet 3/4 pot, the BB raised all-in (less than a pot-sized bet), you called.

The only thing I think you could have improved upon was your preflop line. I think you should have reraised all-in instead of calling. Getting all-in preflop is fine because you get to see all 5 cards for free, and you don't have to worry about missing the flop with a fifth of your stack in the pot. Given that you were 3bet minraised, and then 5bet minraised, I actually wouldn't mind a fold at all either.

Notice how your opponent repeatedly minraised you. That's a tell, right there. It's not necessarily a good reason to fold, but the guy was screaming monster hand preflop. If you had a read on the guy saying that he would only minraise with AA or KK, then that's an arguement to actually fold preflop, because even if you flop a pair, it will rarely be able to win you the hand.

Last edited by PanickyPoker; Thu Jun 02, 2011 at 01:05 PM..
 
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Thu Jun 02, 2011, 01:54 PM
(#3)
oriholic's Avatar
Since: Oct 2010
Posts: 751
BronzeStar
You could either just call the min 3-bet and see a pretty dang cheap flop with AK or 4-bet as you did and then fold to a 5-bet. Really, what would he 5-bet that AK beats? It's 2NL, 5-bet bluffing is pointless.

As you played it on the flop I would check. Probably check/fold. What hands would he have been playing this way preflop? AA, KK, QQ, AK, JJ maybe? If it's even in his range, he's folding JJ if you bet and AA, KK, and QQ all have you beat and won't fold so there's no sense in betting. If he bets something ludicrously small you may want to peel and see if you can catch a K. It will put you ahead of AA and make KK impossible. The key is to know that you're behind but might be able to catch up.
 
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Thu Jun 02, 2011, 02:16 PM
(#4)
PanickyPoker's Avatar
Since: Sep 2010
Posts: 3,168
Quote:
Originally Posted by oriholic View Post
Really, what would he 5-bet that AK beats?
Have you played 2NL lately, ori? I'd make a list, but it's roughly 1225 hands long. I think that getting it in with AK is an absolute winning long-term play at 2NL, given the quality of play there. That's in general, though. There definitely was reason to find a fold in this hand, although I disagree with check/folding the flop if you're going to call to see a flop with AK. I don't think you can flop top/top with AK and fold with the stacks and pot sized as they are. But then again, I don't really think a flop should have been seen.

Last edited by PanickyPoker; Thu Jun 02, 2011 at 02:18 PM..
 
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Thu Jun 02, 2011, 03:12 PM
(#5)
oriholic's Avatar
Since: Oct 2010
Posts: 751
BronzeStar
From the description and the betting I had assumed he was loose passive. This is exactly how a loose passive player would play a monster preflop.

Quote:
There definitely was reason to find a fold in this hand, although I disagree with check/folding the flop if you're going to call to see a flop with AK. I don't think you can flop top/top with AK and fold with the stacks and pot sized as they are. But then again, I don't really think a flop should have been seen.
I can't think of any worse hands that can call on the flop. JJ? TT? AQ and QJ/QT are laughably bad. JT for an open ender or T9 for a gutshot....5 bet preflop at 2NL, no way. I guess the way KJ is overplayed at these limits it could be a possibility. And clearly no better hand than AK is ever folding, so I really can't see any point in betting this flop. I think we should either check/call or check/fold depending on what he C-bets.
 
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Thu Jun 02, 2011, 04:00 PM
(#6)
JARGON1977's Avatar
Since: Jan 2011
Posts: 66
Glad to receive some positive input .

I feel glad that it was not a major no-no to do what I did . However , I now think if the villain is 5 betting pre-flop then perhaps he has to have Kings , Queens or the Aces he did have and therefore my Top-Top would have to be beaten on that board , a board I needed to improve my hand but , one that played right into his 5- bet range . If I could have folded pre-flop I think I would have .

Very disappointed to see pocket Aces in the villains hand .
 
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Thu Jun 02, 2011, 04:15 PM
(#7)
PanickyPoker's Avatar
Since: Sep 2010
Posts: 3,168
Quote:
Originally Posted by oriholic View Post
From the description and the betting I had assumed he was loose passive. This is exactly how a loose passive player would play a monster preflop.
That's true, for sure. I wasn't making the assumption that he was passive, just loose. Against a loose/aggressive player, this is more of an auto-shove, but agansta passive player, it could easily be an auto-fold.

In a blind-on-blind confrontation, some passive players open their betting and raising ranges. But then again, loose/passive players don't necessarily understand positional considerations, so many don't. Specifically, I think that weak aces as low as ATs might look enough like the nuts to a new player to cause them to raise blind-on-blind like this, but given that they chose to minraise, and assuming that they are passive, folding AK makes a lot of sense. If they were not a passive player though, the story changes completely.
 
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Thu Jun 02, 2011, 09:05 PM
(#8)
OMGCBF's Avatar
Since: Mar 2011
Posts: 48
My thoughts follow fairly similar to Ori's on this

As you watch through the playback for the first time its useful to try and figure out what he holds.

My conclusion from the preflop betting is its got to be a Big pair, JJ+ plus at a minimum and possibly AK or AQ. KQs might be a slim possibility. (Unless the guy is very loose and wild)

Now as soon as the flop hits you are already in a bad spot to almost all of that range, with JJ and AQ being the only 2 you can beat.

As the action unfolds in the hand I was actually putting him on QQ since there's 3 combinations of that and it makes sense with the continued betting. As Ori said, JJ he really needs to fold and AQ he should check/call down if he wants to get to showdown so those are unlikely. Which leaves only hands that can beat you.
 
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Fri Jun 03, 2011, 09:17 AM
(#9)
JARGON1977's Avatar
Since: Jan 2011
Posts: 66
I again , found myself in a very similar spot with AJ in the SB , heads up against the BB who was re-raising me , I went to the flop on the 3rd bet this time and caught the Jack with a Queen on the board , I played the rest of the hand with pot control in mind and lost a small amount - against the villains pocket rockets AA .

I have to be learning something from this .
 

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