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2NL KK runs into donk overbet

 
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2NL KK runs into donk overbet - Mon Aug 08, 2011, 09:38 AM
(#1)
mytton's Avatar
Since: Oct 2010
Posts: 181
1c/2c Cash game, only half a dozen hands into my session, but Villain may already have been frustrated, having twice recently raised preflop before folding to a 3 bet each time.

He limps, I raise with my Kings, and he calls. When he bets into me on the flop my first thought is he has some medium pocket pair and is trying to push me off before I can improve, trusting I have missed the flop with high cards. If he had flopped a set, I couldn't see him making this bet, surely he would want to price me in, not out, with plenty of streets left to get all his stack in. Maybe he would make this play as a semi-bluff with a flush or straigth draw (or, a combination I didn't think of at the time, both, as in As2s). Or maybe he is just bluffing with air.

Anyway, all my instincts told me he would never make this bet with a strong made hand, so I pushed him all in.

Was my reasoning right? Was a shove the right play? I really struggle to get any kind of read on overbets like this, as I find it hard to imagine making such a play myself.


8 players
[SB] (1.98)
[BB] (2.51)
Villain (1.27)
mytton (1.93)
P3 (1.07)
P4 (1.13)
P5 (5.04)
Button (4.54)

mytton Initial Pot: 0.03

Villain calls 0.02
mytton raises to 0.08
P3 folds
P4 folds
P5 folds
Button folds
SB folds
BB folds
Villain calls 0.06
### FLOP ### Pot: 0.19
Villain bets 0.54
mytton ?????
 
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Mon Aug 08, 2011, 10:03 AM
(#2)
JWK24's Avatar
Since: Jun 2010
Posts: 24,836
(Super-Moderator)
BronzeStar
I don't mind the push. Yes, they could have a set, but sounds like a flush draw (maybe A 3 sp).
 
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Mon Aug 08, 2011, 10:19 AM
(#3)
mtnestegg's Avatar
Since: Feb 2011
Posts: 1,336
Jmo, but at this level i'm putting him on As/10 or maybe an over pr (JJ/QQ less likely) and is trying to price out draws. It's a possible semi bluff but I doubt that. I don't see a set betting that at all unless he's really bad, as you wanna keep ppl in the hand with that and flush draws are only a very small part of your range. He's committed with that bet with his stack size so you should definetely be expecting a call when you shove. My .02 stack em high! MT soooooo, fill us in....lol howed it go?
 
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Mon Aug 08, 2011, 02:55 PM
(#4)
JDean's Avatar
Since: Aug 2010
Posts: 3,145
BronzeStar
Quote:
Originally Posted by mtnestegg View Post
Jmo, but at this level i'm putting him on As/10 or maybe an over pr (JJ/QQ less likely) and is trying to price out draws. It's a possible semi bluff but I doubt that. I don't see a set betting that at all unless he's really bad, as you wanna keep ppl in the hand with that and flush draws are only a very small part of your range. He's committed with that bet with his stack size so you should definetely be expecting a call when you shove. My .02 stack em high! MT soooooo, fill us in....lol howed it go?
+1

Get 'em in regardless...

Sure, you are a SLIGHT math dog to the 2 way draw, like A2s. But since that, plus ANY Ax/spade hand is small part of the potential range someone might make this sort of value owning bet on after limping, if they are drawing it is much more likely it is just with random spades (or why not try extracting some value).

As MTN stated, I would tend to feel at this micro level that this is much more a bet sized in the mistaken belief that you must bet pot+ to deny odds to a flush draw with a made hand. Many made hands that would probably over-bet the pot after limp/calling are behind your KK, so get 'em in now, BEFORE an A or spade comes and makes you feel more trepedatious.

If he pulled the old "switcheroo" on you, and bet AA, a set, or a 2 pair hand like this, so be it. Without reads yet you have no way to know if that is in his play book, so you must act only on what is MOST LIKELY, MOST OFTEN.
 
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Mon Aug 08, 2011, 06:10 PM
(#5)
mytton's Avatar
Since: Oct 2010
Posts: 181
Thanks for the feedback, very useful. Nice point about the overbet perhaps being a clumsy effort at pricing out any draw I might have. For the record, I shoved, villain called and turned over Kd5h, so nothing more than a simple middle pair!
 

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