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KK beaten by Q3

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KK beaten by Q3 - Fri Sep 09, 2011, 06:08 AM
(#1)
Pikey79's Avatar
Since: Sep 2011
Posts: 3
I'm UTG, make a big raise with Kings, big stack goes all in so I call. He has Q3 and flops a queen, then hits a 3 on the river and beats me with two pair. Rubbish

I'd seen him go all in with sub-optimal hands before, so I was pretty sure he was playing loose and I'd have the beating of him, unless he'd lucked into Aces or something.

Did I do something wrong or is that a badbeat? Should I have gone all-in straight away as I didnt quite have 10 big blinds? Doesnt sound to me like the best way to make chips from a pair of Kings?
 
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Fri Sep 09, 2011, 06:11 AM
(#2)
hemetdennis's Avatar
Since: Oct 2010
Posts: 2,019
BronzeStar
JUST GOT UNLUCKY
GOOD LUCK



 
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Fri Sep 09, 2011, 06:43 AM
(#3)
topthecat's Avatar
Since: Nov 2007
Posts: 1,962
Unfortunately, it is just one of those things. If you have a short stack, and raise or go all in with your premium hand, then one of the big stacks will often call with rubbish and sometimes suck out on you.

Honestly, I know of no way to counteract it. I have even been in the position of being a relatively large stack, and opening 2.5X with Qs in the SB. The cutoff ( a slightly larger stack who had limped) reraises me all in with K2. Off course I call and he hits the K on the river.

Now I hear a lot of people saying not to be results orientated, but if you are playing cash tournies, making good decisions, and still taking these sort of hits, then it is highly frustrating.

What is even more annoying, is that when you look at the rankings of some of these players, they are consistently winning money in tournies and MTTs. I actually railed one guy a few days ago who plays most of the regular and guaranteed tournies, he final tabled in 3 out of 6, with just such play. Maybe there is a secret way of playing that no one is telling us about

TC
 
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Fri Sep 09, 2011, 07:07 AM
(#4)
Pikey79's Avatar
Since: Sep 2011
Posts: 3
I'm not playing for money yet, as I've only started playing online last week. I like playing for fun and if it's regularly costing me money that's not fun, lol

I've played 5 UKIPT division 2 freerolls now, and finished higher in each one, finished 88th out of 800+ in the one yesterday and got some points.

I play a small game with some friends every couple of months, and it takes me a long time to decide what to do, and a long time to see who has won at the end of each hand - this makes me look a little bit slow, lol, so playing online helps me with that as you have a timer counting down so you have to decide faster
 
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Fri Sep 09, 2011, 08:55 AM
(#5)
ChiltonMafia's Avatar
Since: May 2011
Posts: 164
Quote:
Originally Posted by Pikey79 View Post
I'm UTG, make a big raise with Kings, big stack goes all in so I call. He has Q3 and flops a queen, then hits a 3 on the river and beats me with two pair. Rubbish

I'd seen him go all in with sub-optimal hands before, so I was pretty sure he was playing loose and I'd have the beating of him, unless he'd lucked into Aces or something.

Did I do something wrong or is that a badbeat? Should I have gone all-in straight away as I didnt quite have 10 big blinds? Doesnt sound to me like the best way to make chips from a pair of Kings?
That's just standard online, k k a a , q q rarely win. 7 2 os is best hand online. lol
 
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Sat Sep 10, 2011, 01:15 PM
(#6)
Moxie Pip's Avatar
Since: Aug 2010
Posts: 3,853
Quote:
Originally Posted by Pikey79 View Post
I'm UTG, make a big raise with Kings, big stack goes all in so I call. He has Q3 and flops a queen, then hits a 3 on the river and beats me with two pair. Rubbish

I'd seen him go all in with sub-optimal hands before, so I was pretty sure he was playing loose and I'd have the beating of him, unless he'd lucked into Aces or something.

Did I do something wrong or is that a badbeat? Should I have gone all-in straight away as I didnt quite have 10 big blinds? Doesnt sound to me like the best way to make chips from a pair of Kings?

Much as in life...POKER HAPPENS.

It's just unlucky Pikey but it does and will happen. Play enough and it will get to the point where you just understand that 80,85 and 90% (or better) is not 100%. Never will be and that means that 20,15 and 10% (or worse) WILL happen. And you'll just realize that continuing to get your chips in good will pay off as it should when seen over a large sample. Small samples equal large variance swings---both good and bad.

As to how you played it would be better if you posted the Hand History or used the Hand Replayer to give a more concise analysis,but the money went in good (anywhere from 83-16% in your favor if he's suited with a suit you don't have to as high as 89-11% if he's unsuited and lower than you on both cards---say like you have KhKc and he has Qh3c). So no problems there.

As a good rule of thumb though if you're UTG and 10 bb's or less you should just be open-shoving any hand that your are thinking of playing. If it's not a good enough hand to jam then fold. No reason to be tricky here as larger stacks will possibly call you off and shorter stacks that are opening up their range because they are short will as well. A non-shove bet to a more experienced player is going to look suspicious anyway and bad players are typically only thinking about their holdings (and many don't even do that...) so your bet won;t even matter. May as well get it in and the general rule to follow when playing bad players is always to bet out aggressively as they will call you off with worse. That's part of the reason that they're bad players.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Pikey79 View Post
I'm not playing for money yet, as I've only started playing online last week. I like playing for fun and if it's regularly costing me money that's not fun, lol

I've played 5 UKIPT division 2 freerolls now, and finished higher in each one, finished 88th out of 800+ in the one yesterday and got some points.

I play a small game with some friends every couple of months, and it takes me a long time to decide what to do, and a long time to see who has won at the end of each hand - this makes me look a little bit slow, lol, so playing online helps me with that as you have a timer counting down so you have to decide faster
Just be clear and honest with yourself as to what your goals and reasons for playing here are is the best thing you can do. If it's just to have fun,then just have fun. If it's something more results oriented then realize that you're going to have to put the work in. There are no short cuts.
 
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Sat Sep 10, 2011, 01:38 PM
(#7)
Moxie Pip's Avatar
Since: Aug 2010
Posts: 3,853
Quote:
Originally Posted by topthecat View Post
Unfortunately, it is just one of those things. If you have a short stack, and raise or go all in with your premium hand, then one of the big stacks will often call with rubbish and sometimes suck out on you.

Honestly, I know of no way to counteract it. I have even been in the position of being a relatively large stack, and opening 2.5X with Qs in the SB. The cutoff ( a slightly larger stack who had limped) reraises me all in with K2. Off course I call and he hits the K on the river.

Now I hear a lot of people saying not to be results orientated, but if you are playing cash tournies, making good decisions, and still taking these sort of hits, then it is highly frustrating.

What is even more annoying, is that when you look at the rankings of some of these players, they are consistently winning money in tournies and MTTs. I actually railed one guy a few days ago who plays most of the regular and guaranteed tournies, he final tabled in 3 out of 6, with just such play. Maybe there is a secret way of playing that no one is telling us about

TC


Yeah it can be frustrating as Hell TC.

But you know better than to think that some joker that plays like this (constantly getting it in behind and/or dominated) is a winning player over any kind of meaningful sample. 6 tourneys is a blink of the eye.

Being a LAG is one thing and quite frankly getting more LAG playing skills into my game is something I want to work on myself. But that ain't got nothing to do with constantly getting your money in behind and dominated. That's a fish and that's who you want to be HU for stacks against---EVERY TIME.

You know better than that TC. And I know you know better. Ask Fred,he'll tell ya.

So how was your trip to the Med?
 

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