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[6-Max No Limit Cashgame Blog] Grinding up through the micros

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[Blog] From 2NL to 100NL 6-max - Wed Sep 28, 2011, 11:21 AM
(#1)
PSO-xflixx's Avatar
Since: Jun 2011
Posts: 1,119
(Live Trainer)
From 2NL to 100NL 6-max

Hey there PSO folks,

I am going to use this new forum blog to start a challenge that will accompany my future PSO live training sessions and enable me to stay in touch and communicate with you guys a little more than just once a week on wednesdays.

Before I get to the gist of my challenge, for those of you who don't know me here's some info on my background and a list of all my previous live training sessions here at PSO.


Now on to the challenge:

In 2010 I opened up a similar blog to this one in the German community over at IntelliPoker (if you can read or understand German it might be worth a click^^).

I started out with an $80 bankroll on 2NL 6-max cashgame and ground it up to over $4000 stepping through each different 6-max cashgame limit up to 100NL in the process.


This is one of the early graphs of my first challenge from 2NL to 50NL


I will repeat this challenge here with you guys in order to give you an impression and some guidelines on how to approach 6-max no limit cashgames from scratch. The blog will also help support my live training sessions as I am planning on doing at least 1 live challenge session each week showing you my live play at the tables on all the different stakes. In addition we can also review and analyse interesting hands I played.

I won't use any deadlines for this challenge since my main game is 200NL 6-max and I will have to set priority on my usual grind. Whenever there is time left to get in some volume for this challenge and do some posting here though I will oblige to do so.

So, here are the cliffnotes for the challenge:

Starting bankroll: $80
Starting limit: 2NL
Target bankroll: $4000
Target limit: 100NL

I will try and keep you guys updated with interesting hands, graphs and the state of my BR as well as scheduled live training sessions as regularly as possible.

Hope we can get some good discussions going and liven up this new blog area here at PSO!

GL at the tables,
xflixx

***

Final Bankroll Update 2011:

Final bankroll: $109.33
Total no. of hands played: 11047
Final limit: 2NL/5NL

***

Coaching/Blogging Promo:

I will put out an hour of free private live training on 10NL with me for ALL members who manage to first reach the required bankroll for 10NL before I do. Conditions for this prize will be:

- you have started your own forum blog here at PSO
- you have recorded your data with HEM/PT and post graphs of your challenge results
- you have reached the required $400 bankroll for 10NL having started from $80 on 2NL
- you have reached 10NL before the date that I have reached it

All members who manage to accomplish the above before I reach 10NL will be invited to a special 10NL Live Training session with me.

I am also proud to announce that among all members who manage to reach 10NL by Dec 31st 2011 under the above conditions 10 step 1 tickets will be randomly drawn as a prize.

It would be great to see you guys taking up my challenge and starting your own blogs here! Keep grinding and blogging!

GL to everyone!

Last edited by PSO-xflixx; Tue Dec 20, 2011 at 01:16 PM..
 
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Wed Sep 28, 2011, 04:46 PM
(#2)
PSO-xflixx's Avatar
Since: Jun 2011
Posts: 1,119
(Live Trainer)
Session #1

Not much seems to have changed since I have played 2NL during my first challenge last year. Some observations from this first ~500 hand / approx. 30 minutes session which I played at 4 tables at the same time:

1. Players call valuebets especially on the river with such wide ranges that it gets really profitable to valuebet thinner than thin...sometimes even with something like the 4th nutflush:



2. Players are still generally very tight when it comes down to pre all ins. I have been AI about three times with AK, QQ and KK. Each time I was up against a range of KK+ and AK. This probably makes playing AK for stacks (100bb deep) less attractive especially when villains take VERY strong preflop lines like this one:



More hands to come, feel free to comment or ask any questions!

Current BR: $84.51



After finishing training, doing tons of other work for PSO/IntelliPoker today and even grinding some 200NL I feel like dropping dead into my bed now^^

Good night folks!
Felix
 
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Wed Sep 28, 2011, 06:34 PM
(#3)
roomik17's Avatar
Since: Aug 2010
Posts: 4,556
BronzeStar
Great stuff Felix whats with the big drop in your original graph around hand 50000? is that some uber tilt or shot taking gone bad? Thats about the only part of your graph that resembles mine
 
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Thu Sep 29, 2011, 02:53 AM
(#4)
PSO-xflixx's Avatar
Since: Jun 2011
Posts: 1,119
(Live Trainer)
Quote:
Originally Posted by roomik17 View Post
Great stuff Felix whats with the big drop in your original graph around hand 50000? is that some uber tilt or shot taking gone bad? Thats about the only part of your graph that resembles mine
It actually is one of the standard downswings that you experience once in a while, sometimes it drops as heavy and fast as this one, at other times it drops a little more sublty and slowly. But overall there will still be a lot of those in the course of several thousands of hands even when you are winning at a decent to high winrate.

Sometimes when variance goes bad on you your play might also deteriorate from A- to B- or C-game because you dont feel as good and confident as you did when you where winning and this might even make a downer like this a little worse as well.
 
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Thu Sep 29, 2011, 03:33 AM
(#5)
XxTiberxX's Avatar
Since: Sep 2011
Posts: 374
nice project hope u make ur goal.

How can i make a graph like that? I want to see all my losses
 
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Thu Sep 29, 2011, 09:02 AM
(#6)
PSO-xflixx's Avatar
Since: Jun 2011
Posts: 1,119
(Live Trainer)
You can create graphs automatically with Holdem Manager or Pokertracker. I would recommend using either of those to track your play, whatever games you might play. Always helps with analysing your data and difficult spots later on to improve your game.
 
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Thu Sep 29, 2011, 10:11 AM
(#7)
RockerguyAA's Avatar
Since: Feb 2011
Posts: 1,089
BronzeStar
This is fantastic xflixx thanks. Really interested to see how you interpret the micro landscape post-Black Friday. I felt like after your previous run at this challange, 5NL-10NL became tougher and more aggressive. However, I hear things have gotten softer again after Black Friday. As someone contemplating moving outside the USA for 6-12 months, partially for poker, really looking forward to reading about your results and analysis.

Regarding that big downswing, yeah roomik that is totally normal to run into one atleast once and a while over your poker career. It's going to happen eventually, so good to be both bankrolled and mentally prepared for it. After 99,000 hands I ran into a few small downswings, and 1 rather bad one. The bad one was -6 buyins at the end of a four hour session. I got stacked many times after getting it all-in with 50-90% chance of winning. Got a blog written up about it with the details and probably some tilted rant.

Notice where xflixx's downswing happens on the graph. It was when he was at 25NL. The higher the limit you play, the more tough and aggressive the opponents get. As xlfixx has pointed out in his live training, this extra aggression causes higher variance. Higher variance means more/bigger swings.

Two questions for xflixx:
- How many tables will you be playing on average?
- Will you be using a HUD?

Good luck at the tables xflixx!
 
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Thu Sep 29, 2011, 10:43 AM
(#8)
PSO-xflixx's Avatar
Since: Jun 2011
Posts: 1,119
(Live Trainer)
@RockerguyAA:

1. I will be playing 4 tables on average only, and my sessions wont take more than approx. half an hour to an hour time. I want to make sure to produce some good valid content for training purposes and not spew around too hard

2. Yes, I will use my standard HEM Hud which actually just displays:

VPIP /PFR /Aggression / Steal % / 3-Bet

I actually just fired up a quick session. Feel free to rail anytime And thx for the GL wishes!

Last edited by PSO-xflixx; Thu Sep 29, 2011 at 10:50 AM..
 
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Thu Sep 29, 2011, 03:46 PM
(#9)
PSO-xflixx's Avatar
Since: Jun 2011
Posts: 1,119
(Live Trainer)
Session #2

Today I played some hands by myself and some hands during live training at IntelliPoker, always sticking to 4 tables.

I did not run particularly well today in some spots and especially with preflop AIs against shortstackers ($1 or less stacksizes) but thats fine and will even out soon enough. The reason for this is the horrendous number of mistakes I see people making constantly and at such a high rate in each hand.

As an example I had a funny hand come up that illustrates this fact really well and shows that microstakes are still easily beatable:



On the contrary here another spot where I did manage to "suck out" myself. It does show however that sometimes in poker either player involved in a hand is not making a mistake at all:



That's it for today, here the stats:

Total # of hands: 1233
Bankroll: $86.88

GNight folks and gl at the tables!
xflixx
 
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Sat Oct 01, 2011, 06:34 AM
(#10)
PSO-xflixx's Avatar
Since: Jun 2011
Posts: 1,119
(Live Trainer)
New update will follow soon!

In the meantime you can also follow me on Twitter for updates on my regular grind, coaching and trainings:

http://twitter.com/#!/xflixx
 
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Sat Oct 01, 2011, 12:16 PM
(#11)
73REX73's Avatar
Since: Jun 2010
Posts: 745
Hi your challenge has inspired me to give 6 max cash a try, I played two sessions this afternoon, first one I lost $1.18, second one I won $1.07, could of been worse on one hand I flopped a set of eights and my opponent flopped a straight, with Q9 on 8JT board.

I have not played much cash and no 6 max, would you fold hands such as KJs, T9s and KJo in the BB to a 4xBB raise from early to middle position without any strong reads?

I am playing 2NL at the moment and hope to follow you on your challenge through the micro's.

Thanks
 
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Sat Oct 01, 2011, 04:02 PM
(#12)
scotty200480's Avatar
Since: Jan 2011
Posts: 35
Quote:
Originally Posted by 73REX73 View Post
Hi your challenge has inspired me to give 6 max cash a try, I played two sessions this afternoon, first one I lost $1.18, second one I won $1.07, could of been worse on one hand I flopped a set of eights and my opponent flopped a straight, with Q9 on 8JT board.

I have not played much cash and no 6 max, would you fold hands such as KJs, T9s and KJo in the BB to a 4xBB raise from early to middle position without any strong reads?

I am playing 2NL at the moment and hope to follow you on your challenge through the micro's.

Thanks
With no reads, yes!

I'd call with PP's 22-TT's, AQ, AJ, KQ, and 3bet JJ-AA's, AK. This is IMO, but I hate playing OOP.
 
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Sat Oct 01, 2011, 07:19 PM
(#13)
73REX73's Avatar
Since: Jun 2010
Posts: 745
In your presentation on 2NL you stated you should not bluff at this level, does this include continuation betting ?

At times my raises were being flatted and I would miss the flop and check and then my opponent would sense my weakness and take the pot away on the turn.

Thanks.
 
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Sun Oct 02, 2011, 09:34 AM
(#14)
PSO-xflixx's Avatar
Since: Jun 2011
Posts: 1,119
(Live Trainer)
@Rex: Youre right on both, without infos/reads I would fold a lot OOP to 4x opens from EP except for pairs and AQ+. I would even often consider flatting JJ and QQ instead of 3betting for the same reasons. Also c-betting is a concept that even works at microstakes when you do it on the right boardtextures and against the right opponents. You just need to think about how often a specific opponent and his hand range might connect with a flop that you want to cbet and whether the same range will still continue on different turn cards.

Update on session 3 will be up soon!
 
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Sun Oct 02, 2011, 04:03 PM
(#15)
PSO-xflixx's Avatar
Since: Jun 2011
Posts: 1,119
(Live Trainer)
Session #3

The way through 2NL is the quickest when you do it right - meaning that I am currently not really taking all necessary adaptions to my game when stepping down from my 200NL grind

I have to admit it is kind of hard to see a very good bluffing opportunity and not be able to make it profitable because a typical 2NL will not make folds often enough with weak holdings. The same applies for situations in which you get raised at microstakes. Most of the players are not capable of bluffing, or at least not in a sense that I am used to from higher stakes. I therefore can only advise to always be happy about bet/folding a hand like top pair when getting raised on the turn or the river by a weaker/passive player. Chacnes are that you are not good 90% of the time^^

So here's my performance so far since Sep 28th (which is the official start of the challenge):


Wrapping up this update I'll give you guys a typical turn spot where you can decide what you would have done. No infos on the villain:


Stats:

Hands: 2708
BR: $93.66

Im doing a tourney night tonite grinding the Bigger 11 and will slowly fall to bed still hung over from last night's casino trip where I managed to net at least 100 bucks for 4 hours of play.

Good night from Germany and gl @ the tables
Felix

Last edited by PSO-xflixx; Sun Oct 02, 2011 at 04:11 PM..
 
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Sun Oct 02, 2011, 08:37 PM
(#16)
joy7108's Avatar
Since: Jul 2010
Posts: 2,286
I would be folding, putting villian on either two pair or trips. They just don't raise that much without a good hand at this level.
 
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Sun Oct 02, 2011, 09:47 PM
(#17)
RockerguyAA's Avatar
Since: Feb 2011
Posts: 1,089
BronzeStar
Really impressive xflixx. It's not very hard to show a small profit at 2NL, but your really killing it. Keep up the good work. It is all very interesting!

Regarding the AK hand, I think without any particular reads I am folding there. Would put random 2NL villain on top two pair(J,K) or better. You took a very strong line and there was an overcaller.... yet villain didn't seem too concerned waiting until the turn to spring his trap. His move was so strong I'd actually wieght his range being JK at the bottom end, with pocket 66 or JJ being even more likely here.

Being 2NL there is still that slight chance he hit his set of 2's haha. I've seen plenty of absurd things happen at that limit.

As a side note: I absolutely believe a random 2NL player is capable of calling your raise from the button with JJ. Not with the intent of being tricky, but simply out of pure fear of playing JJ unimproved in a big pot.

Last edited by RockerguyAA; Sun Oct 02, 2011 at 09:52 PM..
 
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Tue Oct 04, 2011, 04:22 AM
(#18)
PSO-xflixx's Avatar
Since: Jun 2011
Posts: 1,119
(Live Trainer)
You two are absolutely right. I think it is a clear fold. Getting raised on the turn in a multiway pot with TPTK usually means we are toast.

I am gonna update soon with session #4 which did not run too well. Good side of that is I will be able to show you guys as early as now how common these phases are even at microstakes levels
 
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Wed Oct 05, 2011, 11:49 AM
(#19)
PSO-xflixx's Avatar
Since: Jun 2011
Posts: 1,119
(Live Trainer)
Session #4

My initial heater has now been a little diminished by some preflop all-ins that I lost. I played on two consecutive days and did not manage to show a profit. However, here's a rule that I will carry over from my old German blog:

Blog Rule: I won't post any hands that are bad beats, coolers or suck outs some sort

I generally think that if I do it will help neither you guys nor me in any way. I just feel that such a rule helps you to focus more on the important hands and keeps you from mourning too much about the ones where you just got unlucky.

Because I cannot really come up with any interesting spots in this update from my previous 2 sessions, I have to go with this funny hand:



Stats:


Hands: 3363
Bankroll: $89.34

Live-Training Updates:

I will be reviewing 5NL 6-max hands from PSO member alepse today at 15:00 ET. Hope to see you all there! That' it for today,

Felix
 
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Fri Oct 07, 2011, 07:33 PM
(#20)
scotty200480's Avatar
Since: Jan 2011
Posts: 35
Xflixx, instead of HH from Pso members, will/would you review live recorded sessions instead?
 

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