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U.S. player.

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U.S. player. - Wed Oct 12, 2011, 08:47 AM
(#1)
jakesmm's Avatar
Since: Oct 2011
Posts: 1
I am from the U.S. and currently working in China and will be in Asia for atleast another year, can I sign up as a non U.S. player and if yes how does it work. Thanks Mike.
 
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Wed Oct 12, 2011, 09:00 AM
(#2)
!!!111Dan's Avatar
Since: Jul 2010
Posts: 3,290
Hi Mike and welcome to the forum.
Unfortunately, as long as your address on your account shows you in the US, Pokerstars will block your ability to play for real money games.
There are a number of US players running play chip games if you're interested. Along with that, there are still numerous resources here to improve your game with.
Hope to see you around, and hope that even sooner, we can all play again.

Let us know if you have any other questions.
 
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Wed Oct 12, 2011, 09:08 AM
(#3)
XxTiberxX's Avatar
Since: Sep 2011
Posts: 374
Quote:
Originally Posted by !!!111Dan View Post
Hi Mike and welcome to the forum.
Unfortunately, as long as your address on your account shows you in the US, Pokerstars will block your ability to play for real money games.
There are a number of US players running play chip games if you're interested. Along with that, there are still numerous resources here to improve your game with.
Hope to see you around, and hope that even sooner, we can all play again.

Let us know if you have any other questions.

that is somehow not all true, my adress is listed in the Netherlands, and at my previous company i was playing through a proxy server that was placed in the U.S.

Although my profile said Netherlands, it still showed me that I was trying to play from the U.S. and denied me access to real money games.

I dont know how this works if ur registered in the U.S. and try to play from any other country...
 
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Wed Oct 12, 2011, 09:26 AM
(#4)
!!!111Dan's Avatar
Since: Jul 2010
Posts: 3,290
Quote:
Originally Posted by XxTiberxX View Post
that is somehow not all true, my adress is listed in the Netherlands, and at my previous company i was playing through a proxy server that was placed in the U.S.

Although my profile said Netherlands, it still showed me that I was trying to play from the U.S. and denied me access to real money games.

I dont know how this works if ur registered in the U.S. and try to play from any other country...
Yep, you can't play in the US, and you can't play as a US citizen. They have 2 safeguards. If you're a non-US citizen, they check the proxy server and block you there. If you're account shows a US address, they block your account from real money permanently...for now.
 
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Wed Oct 12, 2011, 10:23 AM
(#5)
Cairn Destop's Avatar
Since: Jun 2010
Posts: 1,477
BronzeStar
Check out my thread in the challenge section for an American challenge. Sure, it's play money, but one of these days . . . .
 
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Wed Oct 12, 2011, 11:04 AM
(#6)
Maj. D Zastr's Avatar
Since: Jul 2011
Posts: 120
Er... some of you know my - sometimes strongly expressed - opinions on the subject...
..but in this case, I'd say it's a slam dunk, if you're not playing from the US, and above all if the money isn't going to the US, looks to me you aren't breaking any laws or rules, and who's to know anyway.

Whether you then will have to pay taxes in China, in the US, or in Alderney on the Sunday Million Win is another matter, but start with winning that and then ask the lawyer you can afford :)
 
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Wed Oct 12, 2011, 11:19 AM
(#7)
hemetdennis's Avatar
Since: Oct 2010
Posts: 2,019
BronzeStar
Quote:
Originally Posted by jakesmm View Post
I am from the U.S. and currently working in China and will be in Asia for atleast another year, can I sign up as a non U.S. player and if yes how does it work. Thanks Mike.
YES YOU CAN ALL YOU NEED TO DO IS SHOW POKERSTARS THAT YOU ARE NOT LIVING IN THE U.S.A. YOU WILL NEED A COPY OF A RENTAL CONTRACT OR A LIGHT BILL IN YOUR NAME
GOOD LUCK


 
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Wed Oct 12, 2011, 03:13 PM
(#8)
19honu62's Avatar
Since: Jul 2010
Posts: 1,770
Yes just like Nanonoko did by moving to Vancouver
 
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Wed Oct 12, 2011, 04:43 PM
(#9)
hemetdennis's Avatar
Since: Oct 2010
Posts: 2,019
BronzeStar
Quote:
Originally Posted by !!!111Dan View Post
Yep, you can't play in the US, and you can't play as a US citizen. They have 2 safeguards. If you're a non-US citizen, they check the proxy server and block you there. If you're account shows a US address, they block your account from real money permanently...for now.

YES YOU CAN PLAY FOR REAL MONEY DAN AS A U.S. CITIZEN
ALL YOU HAVE TO DO IS MOVE OUTSIDE THE US


 
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Wed Oct 12, 2011, 04:53 PM
(#10)
!!!111Dan's Avatar
Since: Jul 2010
Posts: 3,290
I should have stayed with "address" as I intended.
 
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Wed Oct 12, 2011, 04:57 PM
(#11)
hemetdennis's Avatar
Since: Oct 2010
Posts: 2,019
BronzeStar
Quote:
Originally Posted by !!!111Dan View Post
I should have stayed with "address" as I intended.
YOU SHOULD BE LIKE ME AND NEVER MAKE A MISTAKE


 
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Wed Oct 12, 2011, 05:45 PM
(#12)
Moxie Pip's Avatar
Since: Aug 2010
Posts: 3,853
Quote:
Originally Posted by Maj. D Zastr View Post
Er... some of you know my - sometimes strongly expressed - opinions on the subject...
..but in this case, I'd say it's a slam dunk, if you're not playing from the US, and above all if the money isn't going to the US, looks to me you aren't breaking any laws or rules, and who's to know anyway.

Whether you then will have to pay taxes in China, in the US, or in Alderney on the Sunday Million Win is another matter, but start with winning that and then ask the lawyer you can afford

A, According to US tax law he WOULD still owe taxes on any winnings,as he is STILL a US citizen. Way to encourage the flaunting of US law.

B. Again from Pokerstars themselves...

"Residents of the United States and United States Territories are not permitted to make deposits into their accounts or engage in real money activity (game-play,transfer of funds,or trading T$ trading) from ANYWHERE IN THE WORLD."

Later they go on to say this...

"ANY attempt to circumvent these restrictions is a breach of the Pokerstars Terms of Service. This will lead to your account being closed and your account balance being forfeited."

Way to encourage flaunting the Pokerstars T.O.S.


C. You're batting a thousand.


D. Are you this dense/stubborn on the tables as well?
 
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Wed Oct 12, 2011, 06:18 PM
(#13)
roomik17's Avatar
Since: Aug 2010
Posts: 4,556
BronzeStar
As long as you can prove that you are living in another country, need a lease agreement that is for not less than 6 months, a foreign bank account etc then you can play on stars... there are several threads on 2p2 about this whole issue
 
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Wed Oct 12, 2011, 08:08 PM
(#14)
hemetdennis's Avatar
Since: Oct 2010
Posts: 2,019
BronzeStar
Quote:
Originally Posted by Moxie Pip View Post
A, According to US tax law he WOULD still owe taxes on any winnings,as he is STILL a US citizen. Way to encourage the flaunting of US law.

B. Again from Pokerstars themselves...

"Residents of the United States and United States Territories are not permitted to make deposits into their accounts or engage in real money activity (game-play,transfer of funds,or trading T$ trading) from ANYWHERE IN THE WORLD."

Later they go on to say this...

"ANY attempt to circumvent these restrictions is a breach of the Pokerstars Terms of Service. This will lead to your account being closed and your account balance being forfeited."

Way to encourage flaunting the Pokerstars T.O.S.


C. You're batting a thousand.


D. Are you this dense/stubborn on the tables as well?

A. YES HE WOULD STILL OWE U.S. TAXES

B. HE IS NOT AT THIS TIME A RESIDENT OF THE U.S. SO NOT BREAKING T.O.S.

C. I ALWAYS BATT A THOUSAND

D. I AM KIND OF STUBBORN


 
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Wed Oct 12, 2011, 08:44 PM
(#15)
Maj. D Zastr's Avatar
Since: Jul 2011
Posts: 120
Quote:
Originally Posted by Moxie Pip View Post
he WOULD still owe taxes ... Way to encourage the flaunting of US law.
?
I'm encouraging flaunting?
I said the tax matter was another matter, ask a lawyer, except he's got to win the money first, nothing else.

Quote:
"Residents of the United States and United States Territories are not permitted to make deposits into their accounts or engage in real money activity (game-play,transfer of funds,or trading T$ trading) from ANYWHERE IN THE WORLD."
If you are referring to:
http://www.pokerstars.com/poker/room/tos/

it does not say " from ANYWHERE IN THE WORLD" at all.
If you are referring to other TOS, which ones?

Quote:
Way to encourage flaunting the Pokerstars T.O.S.
Again, it seems I'm not. Which ones?
 
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Wed Oct 12, 2011, 09:09 PM
(#16)
!!!111Dan's Avatar
Since: Jul 2010
Posts: 3,290
Quote:
Originally Posted by hemetdennis View Post
YOU SHOULD BE LIKE ME AND NEVER MAKE A MISTAKE
.....
Quote:
Originally Posted by hemetdennis View Post
.....

C. I ALWAYS BATT A THOUSAND
.....
Uh huh.

 
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Wed Oct 12, 2011, 09:30 PM
(#17)
!!!111Dan's Avatar
Since: Jul 2010
Posts: 3,290
QUOTE=Maj. D ZastrEr... some of you know my - sometimes strongly expressed - opinions on the subject...
..but in this case, I'd say it's a slam dunk, if you're not playing from the US, and above all if the money isn't going to the US, looks to me you aren't breaking any laws or rules, and who's to know anyway........

This part is answered in the TOS. It's not about the tax laws or the government. It clearly states in the 4th line (below in red) that if you attempt to circumvent the restrictions, Pokerstars will consider it a breach of your agreement with them. And pretty much what you're suggesting is manipulating residential information and that is circumvention. Punishment would likely be banning the offender.
Now I don't know how Pokerstars view dual citizenship, but support could answer that. We're not talking about that in your directions Maj.


....Whether you then will have to pay taxes in China, in the US, or in Alderney on the Sunday Million Win is another matter, but start with winning that and then ask the lawyer you can afford
____________________

We'll drop this in the middle of the two quotes and talk to how it pertains.
TOS...
5.11. Residents of the United States and United States Territories are not permitted to make deposits into their accounts or engage in real-money play. They may cash out their existing account balances. Residents of other nations are not permitted to engage in real-money play while located in the United States. Any attempt to circumvent the restrictions on play by residents of the U.S. or U.S. Territories, and by residents of other nations while located in the United States, is a breach of this Agreement. An attempt at circumvention includes, but is not limited to, manipulating the information used by PokerStars to identify your location and providing PokerStars with false or misleading information regarding your residence.

QUOTE=Maj. D Zastr?
I'm encouraging flaunting?
I said the tax matter was another matter, ask a lawyer, except he's got to win the money first, nothing else.

If you are referring to:
http://www.pokerstars.com/poker/room/tos/

it does not say " from ANYWHERE IN THE WORLD" at all.

I actually think it doesn't need to say anywhere in the world. It seems implied that if you're a US player out of the US, you're anywhere else in the world.
If you are referring to other TOS, which ones?

Again, it seems I'm not. Which ones?
___________________________

Believe me, I understand your thinking and I'm sure that many people have done their all to play the game they love on this site. But encouraging anything that is even a little shady is only going to possibly cause problems for them, when we are allowed to return. Love the passion!
 
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Wed Oct 12, 2011, 10:30 PM
(#18)
Maj. D Zastr's Avatar
Since: Jul 2011
Posts: 120
Quote:
what you're suggesting is manipulating residential information
I am? He's in phriggin China, for frogs' sake :)

Quote:
I actually think it doesn't need to say anywhere in the world. It seems implied that if you're a US player out of the US
Hmm.
First it says "from ANYWHERE IN THE WORLD" in caps, then "it seems implied"... but it doesn't say anything about "outside the US" either.

I really believe he can play from China if he gets the money in China.
(Question is, has he asked support? What's the answer? I would just ask.)
About the tax matter, I have no idea and said so, certainly better to find out, if he wins any money that is. However weird the US tax system may be, I can't imagine having to pay any money on losses, especially in China :)

And no, I'm not advising disguising the wins as losses either.
 
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Wed Oct 12, 2011, 10:38 PM
(#19)
Maj. D Zastr's Avatar
Since: Jul 2011
Posts: 120
Actually, you missed the fl... er, my only "incriminating " statement in both replies, which was: "who's to know anyway...."

Now that may be taken as "advocating circumventing", although it actually wasn't really ;), it was just in the sense of "aren't we being a wee bit paranoid"

And in the other thread, yes I was advocating a bit ;), said so and gave up, but not in this one, I believe it's 100% legit... as opposed to only about 98% in the other one.
 
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Thu Oct 13, 2011, 01:53 PM
(#20)
!!!111Dan's Avatar
Since: Jul 2010
Posts: 3,290
I'm not the one who wrote "ANYWHERE IN THE WORLD," but how could the first line be interpreted any other way?
Residents of the United States and United States Territories are not permitted to make deposits into their accounts or engage in real-money play.
It doesn't matter where you are, the line is very clear. Now if you get a change of address approved by stars, or a dual citizenship, you may be ok, but support could answer that for sure.
 

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