Home / Community / Forum / Poker Education / Texas Hold'Em Tournament Section (MTTs & STTs) /

Should I have folded to th reraise preflop?

Old
Question
Should I have folded to th reraise preflop? - Wed Dec 07, 2011, 09:16 PM
(#1)
Walshie3434's Avatar
Since: Aug 2011
Posts: 7
BronzeStar
Here is some info leading up to this hand for ranging purposes, I registered for the tourny, the table appeared, got dealt my AKo,Lead up over. Yep first hand of the tourny, Generally I don't like to play the first couple of hands as I like to see whats happening around the table but I went with my gut ( and I have plenty of that )
My train of thought for this hand :
UTG limpes = are you trapping or just want to see a flop
UTG re-raises = Alarm bell,red flag,Warning!!! Warning!!! Will Robinson appears in my head ( now I'm showing my age ) 380 to call leaves me with 1100 chips, plenty of chips and time to rebuild, If the flop wasn't nice to me and I quote " were just going to go away". The BB also came along for the ride.
UTG all-in on the flop = I didn't put him on pocket As due to the limp pre flop and I never had him on pocket Ks because although possible combinatorically (combinatorics video in the archive from The Langolier) his chances of him holding them have dramatically reduced, so my thinking was that I had the best hand. So should I have folded at the 320 re-raise pre flop or keep going with my gut and warped way of thinking?
Oh by the way there are bragging rights for anyone who knows which PSO trainer states the quote i wrote in their training vids. If you haven't seen the videos or been to live training before get you butt over there they are awesome, click on the live training or video tab at the top of the page and go from there.


 
Old
Default
Wed Dec 07, 2011, 09:37 PM
(#2)
JDean's Avatar
Since: Aug 2010
Posts: 3,145
BronzeStar
Honestly, the 400 is too large a 3Bet for you to flat call with AK.

Consider...

About 2/3rds the time you will miss the flop entirely.
400 = 26.5% of your stack (roughly).

Even though you will have a ton of chips left if you must fold, do you really WANT to call/fold that much?

Do you really want to be on a tricky decision with what figures to be just a 1 pair hand on the flop in a HUGE pot at this blind level, if/when the villain shoves all in?

For these reasons I think you are probably better off shoving yourself, or folding....

At least if you shove in over his raise you are racing everything up to AA/KK and even vs KK you are going to have about a 30% shot to run him down by the river. you also end ANY chance you have of making a "mistake fold" if this guy is simply trying to build a huge pre flop pot with the intent of shoving in to take it down immediately. Afterall, if you had MISSED this flop, if that K were a Q, and the raiser shoved like that, you would have folded the best hand right?

Now do not get me wrong, I am NOT saying you really want to court a race for stacks on a 75BB start stack very often, and by moving all in over the top of his big raise that is exactly what you'd be doing. What I AM saying is that a 4Bet all in is preferable to a CALL for over a quarter of your stack, followed by a FOLD on the 2/3rds of the flops that you miss...

My personal risk assessment levels probably allow me to fold for the 80 chip raise without much of a fuss though, as I'd have the idea in my head that by NOT losing the extra 340 is going to allow me to have more time to find a BETTER situation than this one might be.

...but if I've seen this guy do this even once before, even without a showdown, I am probably shipping AK and letting the chips fall where they will.

Hope it helps.

-JDean

Last edited by JDean; Wed Dec 07, 2011 at 09:46 PM..
 
Old
Default
Wed Dec 07, 2011, 09:38 PM
(#3)
Puciek's Avatar
Since: Oct 2010
Posts: 771
Jesus christ my head is spinning. So much text that is for most part irrelevant.

Yeah, you have blocket o AA and KK, that makes the LESS LIKELY but not impossible. If someone limp/raises from UTG this makes it very tough and pretty much polarizes it between complete bluff and AA/KK.
And my question here is - does he ever do that without AA/KK? If not - fold it as you are drawing nearly dead. If the answer is "nope, not really" then i like to just call and simply "fit or quit" OTF.
By calling we also invite BB to make another horrible call which is good.
 
Old
Default
Wed Dec 07, 2011, 09:40 PM
(#4)
JWK24's Avatar
Since: Jun 2010
Posts: 24,809
(Super-Moderator)
BronzeStar
I like the raise to 80 and actually, I'm glad you just called the re-raise to 400 instead of shoving. While you do have a hand with great potential, you still only have A high.
The BB that calls, I definitely wouldn't put on AA or KK, because they should have re-raised your raise or shoved here if they had either of those two hands.

The only way I fold and don't call the 400 pre is if I had a previous note on the player that says that they are a total nit. If you call and miss and have to fold, you're left with 1100, which is still a very playable stack.

With the flop, if they got lucky and hit a low set... I'll pay them off. There are way too many players that will shove the flop with worse hands than you have.
 
Old
Default
Wed Dec 07, 2011, 09:42 PM
(#5)
Puciek's Avatar
Since: Oct 2010
Posts: 771
Quote:
Originally Posted by JWK24 View Post
I like the raise to 80 and actually, I'm glad you just called the re-raise to 400 instead of shoving. While you do have a hand with great potential, you still only have A high.
Go back to your cave, read a book titled "Why <only a-high hand> can be better than pocket pair" wrote by Tilty Macgrill and then come back.
You posted that nonsense in numerous topics.
 
Old
Default
Wed Dec 07, 2011, 10:48 PM
(#6)
Walshie3434's Avatar
Since: Aug 2011
Posts: 7
BronzeStar
thanks for your input JDean, JWk24 and Puciek.
And sorry about the head spin Puciek as this was my first Hand analysis I wanted to let you know how I thought at at the time and also If any new members came in and check this out and didn't know about live training and the video archive I could point them in the right direction as older members had done for me in when I first came in.

Cheers.
 

Getting PokerStars is easy: download and install the PokerStars game software, create your free player account, and validate your email address. Clicking on the download poker button will lead to the installation of compatible poker software on your PC of 51.7 MB, which will enable you to register and play poker on the PokerStars platform. To uninstall PokerStars use the Windows uninstaller: click Start > Control Panel and then select Add or Remove programs > Select PokerStars and click Uninstall or Remove.

Copyright (c) PokerSchoolOnline.com. All rights reserved, Rational Group, Douglas Bay Complex, King Edward Road, Onchan, Isle of Man, IM3 1DZ. You can email us on support@pokerschoolonline.com