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is this play acceptable-big11

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is this play acceptable-big11 - Fri Dec 16, 2011, 01:55 PM
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marvinsytan's Avatar
Since: Aug 2010
Posts: 6,453
Sorry, this hand was deleted by its owner

PRE 1750 to win 10100 is this enough to be alling with any 2 cards and hope to outplay them after the flop

POSTFLOP I tried to make a move so that I can win the pot. tried to represent K, maybe AQ or AJ will fold at this later stages.

is this acceptable or just fold PRE just like you told me a lot of times.

and if I called just Check/Fold no need to waste 6k chips

I don't why I keep defending my Big Blinds w any random suited cards. This is my biggest leak. I just can't resist the odds.
 
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Fri Dec 16, 2011, 02:16 PM
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JWK24's Avatar
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preflop: J4s is an underdog to even a single, random hand.... let alone multiple opponents with any real hands. Muck it now and save your chips for a better situation. You don't want to be throwing chips into a pot that you're guaranteed to be way behind in.

flop: do not like the lead bet at all. If you had anything that would have hit this board, you'd have raised preflop. AK would raise preflop, pair would normally raise preflop. The lead here is wasting chips because it doesn't make sense with what you're trying to bluff and represent.

Trying to defend a blind this way, especially against multiple opponents, without a real hand is normally going to get you into trouble.

If you wanted to make a play, instead of leading into a flop you missed, you'd actually be better off 3-betting preflop.... but that type of play is only going to work if you have a tight table image (which will not be the case if you have ever shown a hand like this to any opp in the past that is at this table). If your table image is anything else, the opps will call your 3-bet light and you'll lose even more chips.
 
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Fri Dec 16, 2011, 02:27 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by marvinsytan View Post
I don't why I keep defending my Big Blinds w any random suited cards. This is my biggest leak. I just can't resist the odds.
This is your problem.... you don't have the correct odds. In this example, against even random hands, you only have about 32% equity. If both opps are playing top 10% hands, then your equity goes down to 21%.

You're in a 3-way pot, being out of position makes the situation even worse, and you basically have 33% invested (a bit less due to the antes). That is much more than the 21% equity that you have in your hand.
 
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Fri Dec 16, 2011, 04:03 PM
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marvinsytan's Avatar
Since: Aug 2010
Posts: 6,453
Quote:
Originally Posted by JWK24 View Post
This is your problem.... you don't have the correct odds. In this example, against even random hands, you only have about 32% equity. If both opps are playing top 10% hands, then your equity goes down to 21%.

You're in a 3-way pot, being out of position makes the situation even worse, and you basically have 33% invested (a bit less due to the antes). That is much more than the 21% equity that you have in your hand.
where can i read this kind of computation. i dont know that pot odds can be this so complex.

that's why i keep repeating my leak because i don't kno this kind of computation

i just know ok 1600 to earn 11000 not bad go. the more players the more i want to join even with
83s i will come in the BB. i thought it's just easy. I'm wrong
 
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Fri Dec 16, 2011, 08:58 PM
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JWK24's Avatar
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the first thing you will want to do is to download pokerstove. www.pokerstove.com

then, go to the video section and watch the video from Dave (TheLangolier) on how to use it. Here's the link to it.
http://www.pokerschoolonline.com/art...-to-PokerStove

What you want to have happen is for the equity from pokerstove's % to be higher than the % you need to put into the pot. If that's the case, then it is a +EV play for you, positive chips in the long run. When the equity % from pokerstove is less than the % you would have to put into the pot, then it is a losing play -EV over time for you.

It'll take you some time to get used to it and use it, but will help you learn which are the plays to make and which situations to avoid.
 
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Sat Dec 17, 2011, 12:50 AM
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marvinsytan's Avatar
Since: Aug 2010
Posts: 6,453
noted

i will add this to my arsenal
 
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Sat Dec 17, 2011, 12:57 AM
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JWK24's Avatar
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it's a great tool to have for reviewing your play in a tournament too.
 

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