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89o in bb, mid blinds (+ev call?)

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Sun Jan 01, 2012, 10:45 AM
(#1)
marvinsytan's Avatar
Since: Aug 2010
Posts: 6,453
there's still probelm with your hand replayer?

Last edited by marvinsytan; Sun Jan 01, 2012 at 10:49 AM..
 
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Sun Jan 01, 2012, 11:03 AM
(#2)
PINOY_HITMAN's Avatar
Since: Oct 2010
Posts: 4,717
Quote:
Originally Posted by marvinsytan View Post
there's still probelm with your hand replayer?
yes pare. me also
 
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Sun Jan 01, 2012, 11:09 AM
(#3)
Keldraco's Avatar
Since: Jul 2011
Posts: 102
His ATo is a shove on the BU with 6BB. you are getting about 1.6 to 1 to call which i don't think is good. usually you want to tighten the 'call' abit more then the 'push'. Imo you want to have at least 1 high card to call here, 9 high is too small. plus as you mention it offsuit...

i have 2 question too on thing hand:

1: how desperate are we to bust him?

2: Do we really need his chips so much that we are willing to take this risk?

Last edited by Keldraco; Sun Jan 01, 2012 at 11:32 AM..
 
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Sun Jan 01, 2012, 11:54 AM
(#4)
marvinsytan's Avatar
Since: Aug 2010
Posts: 6,453
Sorry, this hand was deleted by its owner

change browser to mozilla

hand replayer works well with this browser
 
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Sun Jan 01, 2012, 12:23 PM
(#5)
marvinsytan's Avatar
Since: Aug 2010
Posts: 6,453
what stages of the tournament?

you will risk almost 50% of your stacks

if I'm not in the money, I will save my stacks and use it to steal/resteal and win the pot risk free rather than gamble with 89o. That's the best way to chip up.

with 89o you will be most of the times behind. With 14BB's you can't call if you knew your behind that's gambling and giving your opp a handicap.

if I got A high in the BB and I know that the BTN is a stealer I might(but will definitely think hard) before making a call.

14BB's you need to use this in steal/resteal strategy. Win the pot 2 ways. With 14BB never call without a premium hand except to a short stack that you know that is stealing also and your in the mood to gamble with your ace high which you should be able to know if your ace high is ahead. Only gamble to call if you know your ahead not if your way behind.
 
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Sun Jan 01, 2012, 06:42 PM
(#6)
JWK24's Avatar
Since: Jun 2010
Posts: 24,857
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89 off is going to be behind a random hand, let alone if the opp has a playable hand.
If the opp has any broadway, pair or suited A, you're a 2-1 dog in the hand.

If you want to make a play, then you need to be the first to shove in a hand. This is way, way too weak of a hand to be calling an all-in with. To call an all-in, you need to have much better cards than what you would need to shove first.


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Mon Jan 02, 2012, 12:48 AM
(#7)
JWK24's Avatar
Since: Jun 2010
Posts: 24,857
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47.1% of the pot are chips that were in your stack at the beginning of the hand (39% were from the call). Being a 2-1 dog, you have 33% equity.

The chip numbers are higher than your equity, so it's -EV to call.


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Mon Jan 02, 2012, 03:22 AM
(#8)
DasherF78's Avatar
Since: Oct 2011
Posts: 75
Hi Jig,

I'd be interested in the answer to this question as well, it's something I've been looking at learning recently.

From my limited knowledge, wouldn't you be getting 2-1 if the pot was twice the amount you had to call? since this is not the case you are getting < 2-1.

As a percentage
1792 / (2367 + 1792) = 43% pot odds

Your hand equity with 98o, looking at pokerstove with say a wide shove range of 40% is only 35%
 
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Mon Jan 02, 2012, 09:17 AM
(#9)
Keldraco's Avatar
Since: Jul 2011
Posts: 102
BU pushing range: 40.9%.

BB calling range: 36.7%, 22+, Ax+, K2s+, K6o+, Q6s+, Q9o+, J8s+, JTo, T9s
 
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Mon Jan 02, 2012, 03:37 PM
(#10)
oriholic's Avatar
Since: Oct 2010
Posts: 751
BronzeStar
This looks like a pretty bad call. It's -cEV and very -$EV. You have 9 high, offsuit, and you're risking almost half your stack on a 1.6 to 1 call.

I don't think you understand ICM. ICM basically makes it less profitable to call in every situation. Since chips lost are worth more than chips won the calls you make have to be significantly +EV not just barely above neutral, and definitely not -cEV. ICM forces you to tighten your calling range and thus allows you to widen your shoving range.

If he's shoving any two, a call here with 98o is slightly +$EV (I'm assuming this is a 9-man SnG with 50/30/20 payouts). You're +$.08 against a 100% shove range. But if he's pushing any tighter than about 75% (22+, A2+, K2+, Q2+, J2+, T2s+, T3o+, 93s+, 95o+, 84s+, 86o+, 75s+, 65s) you're losing money on this call.


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