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Did I play this correctly?

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Did I play this correctly? - Mon Apr 09, 2012, 12:11 PM
(#1)
jysteruk's Avatar
Since: Apr 2010
Posts: 83
This hand has been bugging me since it happened.
I'm very inexperienced in MTTs.
This hand came up earlyish in last nights Sunday Storm.
The villian was 22/9 over 46 hands and had 3 bet 4 times from middle position.

It was still pretty early in tournament and I did not want to reraise him and have half my stack in the middle preflop and run into AA or KK.
Was calling a good option?
If the flop was all low and he bet after I would have checked on a flop without a queen then what?

Did I play this correctly or was it bad play folding preflop on my part?


Last edited by jysteruk; Mon Apr 09, 2012 at 12:15 PM..
 
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Mon Apr 09, 2012, 12:17 PM
(#2)
Ovalman's Avatar
Since: Feb 2011
Posts: 1,778
A lot of what I do will depend on any notes or stats I have on villian but I'm calling there to set mine. If you're prepared to reraise then I think you've also got to be prepared to shove. You're also last to act so there's no-one behind you to decrease your odds should they call. You're bet sizing is at the marginal lower end of what I'm re-raising but I still think it's an OK amount.
 
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Mon Apr 09, 2012, 12:48 PM
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JWK24's Avatar
Since: Jun 2010
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Hi jysteruk!

With a raise and 2 calls in front of me, I'm definitely going to 3-bet with QQ, especially being out of position, as I want to try and thin the field some. QQ plays much better against a lower number of opps and early in a tourney, I don't want players staying with Ax or Kxs to be able to have a cheap draw to beat me. The original raiser now 4-bets and the two caller drop.

Now, I'm looking for info and reads on the opp. The opp had already 3-bet four times from mid position (almost 10% of the hands in history the opp 3-bets) and 4-bets here.
Holding QQ, I'm only behind AA or KK and am ahead in a flip with AK. Since the opp is continually raising, their range should be much larger than this.

QQ vs a top 10% hand has 64.4% equity and to shove over the opp costs me 4655 into a pot that will be 10928 (42.6%). My hand has much more equity than what I will have to invest into the pot, so shoving is a +EV play even if I get called everytime. It will even be ahigher +EV play if the opp folds a portion of the time, where I will gain almost 50% to my stack without a fight.

Due to this, I'm going to 5-bet shove with QQ here.

This is also a great example of where bankroll management comes into play, as I want to be making this shove here without worrying about losing (which will happen about 1/3 of the time), but when I win the hand, I'm now set up for a good run in the tourney..... maybe even having enough chips to get ITM just from this one hand.

Hope this helps and good luck at the tables.

John (JWK24)


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Mon Apr 09, 2012, 01:08 PM
(#4)
Ovalman's Avatar
Since: Feb 2011
Posts: 1,778
I don't know how I missed your info on his stats and why I posted about notes and stats being important.... I think I need reading glasses

As a question John, is a set mine not a good play in this spot?

I set mine a lot in a STT as tournament survival is a main part of cashing in them, ie. you get nothing for 4th in a STT so I try and make the cash first and then push for 1st. It's a good STT strategy as you avoid coinflips when the blinds are low. I'm pushing/ reraising every time with QQ when the field thins and/ or the blinds are high but is a limp a bad play in a MTT in this situation when you have no stats on your opponent?
 
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Mon Apr 09, 2012, 01:28 PM
(#5)
JWK24's Avatar
Since: Jun 2010
Posts: 24,831
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ovalman View Post

As a question John, is a set mine not a good play in this spot?

I set mine a lot in a STT as tournament survival is a main part of cashing in them, ie. you get nothing for 4th in a STT so I try and make the cash first and then push for 1st. It's a good STT strategy as you avoid coinflips when the blinds are low. I'm pushing/ reraising every time with QQ when the field thins and/ or the blinds are high but is a limp a bad play in a MTT in this situation when you have no stats on your opponent?
Hi Ovalman!

I try to setmine with lower/mid pairs, not with premium pairs. I want to be betting the premiums for value and not to setmine due to the fact that I don't want others drawing to beat me when I'm most likely currently ahead.
With a lower pair, I'm not going to be a favorite in the hand, so that's where I want to setmine... and only want to setmine on a large stack, to get the correct odds to do so.
Limping in a large MTT with a premium pair is going to get a player into trouble too high of a % of the time as if I allow more opps to draw at me, someone could easily hit something that can then be ahead of me.
I don't want to just be auto-shoving premium hands, but I do want to value bet/raise with them.

Hope this helps.

John (JWK24)


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6 Time Bracelet Winner


 
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Mon Apr 09, 2012, 02:00 PM
(#6)
Ovalman's Avatar
Since: Feb 2011
Posts: 1,778
As I said on my blog, I don't mind inputting something against the grain into a thread and learning from any replies.

I'm comparing STT's (in which I think I'm OK) to MTT's (where I've yet to win one on Stars). AA and KK I'm raising/ shoving/ calling 99% of the time but QQ I like to mix up. Against any random A you're only 70/30 and against AK you're a coinflip. It sort of makes sense not to be flipping pre flop early in a STT as you're money isn't made until it becomes 3 handed and I commentated on the hand from a STT perspective.

I didn't take into account the stats the O/P gave but I can see where you're coming from. While I've been value betting before I'm sort of only coming to terms with it's meaning.

I've still a helluva lot to learn.
 
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Mon Apr 09, 2012, 02:06 PM
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JWK24's Avatar
Since: Jun 2010
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ovalman View Post

I've still got a helluva lot to learn.
That's exactly what I said to myself when I first found PSO. The key is to keep learning and getting better and better every day.

If the opp here was a total nit, then I would consider laying down QQ here, but 3-betting 10% of the time, QQ plays well against all but 3 hands in their range.

Good luck at the tables.

John (JWK24)


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6 Time Bracelet Winner


 
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Mon Apr 09, 2012, 02:54 PM
(#8)
jysteruk's Avatar
Since: Apr 2010
Posts: 83
Ta for the evaluation.
As said I have very little MTT experience behind me.

In a STT I would probably shove here.
I try not to set mine in STTs as I think you are only 8-1 to hit your set and if you keep doing it you will find yourself short on chips with little leverage for the middle stages of the tournament.
If I do try to set mine I want to be in late position and the blinds to be very low.
 

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