Home / Community / Forum / Poker Community / Brags, Beats and Variance /

77 flop the 2nd nuts get unlucky again

Old
Default
77 flop the 2nd nuts get unlucky again - Mon Jun 04, 2012, 05:12 PM
(#1)
holdemace486's Avatar
Since: Nov 2011
Posts: 1,760
hi guys this is why i hate cash nl,it seems like every time i grind away and start to get some chips built up in my br as soon as i go all in i loose,
I all ready knew the opps had the Jack and i was in front
am i suppose to fold in this spot?
Pokerstars is annoying at times,meant and designed for action i swear

PokerStars Hand #81492478018: Hold'em No Limit ($0.01/$0.02 USD) - 2012/06/04 20:30:09 UTC [2012/06/04 16:30:09 ET]
Table 'Cheruskia II' 6-max Seat #5 is the button
Seat 2: holdemace486 ($0.84 in chips)
Seat 4: stajp691 ($0.47 in chips)
Seat 5: AlexAlmighty ($3.28 in chips)
Seat 6: jaycie999 ($0.81 in chips)
jaycie999: posts small blind $0.01
holdemace486: posts big blind $0.02
*** HOLE CARDS ***
Dealt to holdemace486 [7s 7d]
stajp691: folds
AlexAlmighty: raises $0.04 to $0.06
jaycie999: calls $0.05
holdemace486: calls $0.04
*** FLOP *** [7h Jc Jh]
jaycie999: checks
holdemace486: bets $0.08
AlexAlmighty: raises $0.20 to $0.28
jaycie999: calls $0.28
holdemace486: raises $0.50 to $0.78 and is all-in
AlexAlmighty: raises $0.50 to $1.28
jaycie999: calls $0.47 and is all-in
Uncalled bet ($0.50) returned to AlexAlmighty
*** TURN *** [7h Jc Jh] [Qh]
*** RIVER *** [7h Jc Jh Qh] [Qc]
*** SHOW DOWN ***
holdemace486: shows [7s 7d] (a full house, Sevens full of Queens)
AlexAlmighty: shows [Jd Kd] (a full house, Jacks full of Queens)
AlexAlmighty collected $0.05 from side pot
jaycie999: shows [Js Ts] (a full house, Jacks full of Queens)
jaycie999 collected $1.18 from main pot
AlexAlmighty collected $1.17 from main pot

this happens a lot on here and you think your software runs well? its about time you got your rng updated i thinks.
Thats my moan out of the way but come on ide be rich by now if this did not keep happening.

SO ? im pretty sure this was text book play? when i play proper this is how i play,so why can i not win on cash tables compared to tourneys weith the exact style of game?
 
Old
Default
Mon Jun 04, 2012, 06:09 PM
(#2)
Feskprins's Avatar
Since: May 2011
Posts: 450
You grind away and build some chips, and your total profit is four cents? Must be terrible to lose those four cents after a long and sweaty grind.

1. Play with a full stack. Always play with a full stack.
2. You don't have the 2nd nuts, you have the 3rd nuts (quad Js, J7, 77).
3. You forgot to put on your tinfoil hat. If you did wear it, then...
4. There's definitely something wrong with the software/RNG coding. This should NEVER happen!

Seriously though: You should be happy that you got all in there. I'd never fold in this spot and try to get the money in as soon as possible, although I'd probably check/raise the flop instead to get value from any jack or any flush draw instead of firing a donk bet.

....

Last edited by Feskprins; Mon Jun 04, 2012 at 06:13 PM..
 
Old
Default
Mon Jun 04, 2012, 06:49 PM
(#3)
ronh1967's Avatar
Since: Jun 2010
Posts: 376
Quote:
Originally Posted by holdemace486 View Post
hi guys this is why i hate cash nl,it seems like every time i grind away and start to get some chips built up in my br as soon as i go all in i loose,
I all ready knew the opps had the Jack and i was in front
am i suppose to fold in this spot?
Pokerstars is annoying at times,meant and designed for action i swear

PokerStars Hand #81492478018: Hold'em No Limit ($0.01/$0.02 USD) - 2012/06/04 20:30:09 UTC [2012/06/04 16:30:09 ET]
Table 'Cheruskia II' 6-max Seat #5 is the button
Seat 2: holdemace486 ($0.84 in chips)
Seat 4: stajp691 ($0.47 in chips)
Seat 5: AlexAlmighty ($3.28 in chips)
Seat 6: jaycie999 ($0.81 in chips)
jaycie999: posts small blind $0.01
holdemace486: posts big blind $0.02
*** HOLE CARDS ***
Dealt to holdemace486 [7s 7d]
stajp691: folds
AlexAlmighty: raises $0.04 to $0.06
jaycie999: calls $0.05
holdemace486: calls $0.04
*** FLOP *** [7h Jc Jh]
jaycie999: checks
holdemace486: bets $0.08
AlexAlmighty: raises $0.20 to $0.28
jaycie999: calls $0.28
holdemace486: raises $0.50 to $0.78 and is all-in
AlexAlmighty: raises $0.50 to $1.28
jaycie999: calls $0.47 and is all-in
Uncalled bet ($0.50) returned to AlexAlmighty
*** TURN *** [7h Jc Jh] [Qh]
*** RIVER *** [7h Jc Jh Qh] [Qc]
*** SHOW DOWN ***
holdemace486: shows [7s 7d] (a full house, Sevens full of Queens)
AlexAlmighty: shows [Jd Kd] (a full house, Jacks full of Queens)
AlexAlmighty collected $0.05 from side pot
jaycie999: shows [Js Ts] (a full house, Jacks full of Queens)
jaycie999 collected $1.18 from main pot
AlexAlmighty collected $1.17 from main pot

this happens a lot on here and you think your software runs well? its about time you got your rng updated i thinks.
Thats my moan out of the way but come on ide be rich by now if this did not keep happening.

SO ? im pretty sure this was text book play? when i play proper this is how i play,so why can i not win on cash tables compared to tourneys weith the exact style of game?
mabe cash games are not for you,have you tried one table sit and goes yet 6or9man?if not give them a try mace i find the competion is better playing these then cash games
 
Old
Default
Mon Jun 04, 2012, 08:10 PM
(#4)
Sandtrap777's Avatar
Since: Jun 2010
Posts: 3,310
Quote:
Originally Posted by holdemace486 View Post
this happens a lot on here and you think your software runs well? its about time you got your rng updated i thinks.
Thats my moan out of the way but come on ide be rich by now if this did not keep happening.

SO ? im pretty sure this was text book play? when i play proper this is how i play,so why can i not win on cash tables compared to tourneys weith the exact style of game?

EVERY time you post, it's the same OLD story
- Sotware
- I always lose

Lets see if I can ram some sense into you

First, cash game and tourneys are NOT the same. You can't play the same way. There's lots of similarities, but it's NOT the same

Second, the software works fine for 10-20% of the players, because they know how to play, therefore once you figure out how to play, you will see that there's NO problem with the software.

Third, I'm sure you know what variance is right? NOT, as per most of all your postings, I think you have no clue about it. So let me give you a FREE lesson.

In mtt's (tourneys), good players are in the money (ITM) about 18% of the time. So to make it simple for you to understand, out of 200 games you'll be ITM 36 times. If you are in a downswing, this mean you can go 164 games without winning. So if you play 10 games a week, you could lose all your games for the next 4 months. Even if you're ITM, it doesn't mean you win big. Out of 100 games, you're ITM 18 times, but out of those 18, only 1-2 are final tables. What I'm saying is that for every 100 games, you might hit 1 or 2 big cash, so it takes a lot of time. So if you ONLY play the Sunday storm, it might take 2 years to win a big cash.

In Ring games (cash), same rules apply. Quantity will correct the variance. If you ONLY have $2 and sit at one 2NL table and lose it all and only play 2-3 weeks later, the same might happen again. You've got to play LOTS of hands to be a winning player.

And lastly, BR management. I think you have no clue on how to use it. The basic rules of bankroll management suggest that you should have at least 20 buyins for the limit you wish to play at. So before playing 1c/2c, you should have at least $40 and if you were to drop to $20, I would stop and rebuild my BR.

If you can't accept any of this, may I suggest you take on checkers, it's less painful and there's no software to blame....LOL

GL
 
Old
Default
Mon Jun 04, 2012, 09:29 PM
(#5)
Feskprins's Avatar
Since: May 2011
Posts: 450
Quote:
Originally Posted by holdemace486
Poker is a lot more than just aces as we all know, my bro if he says his aces hold up only 51 percent not a problem i know hes telling you all the truth and anyone who says this is not possible well what can i say they do not understand variance like they think they do
You're wrong, Sandtrap. Holdemace says so.

....

Last edited by Feskprins; Mon Jun 04, 2012 at 09:32 PM..
 
Old
Default
Mon Jun 04, 2012, 10:28 PM
(#6)
TheLangolier's Avatar
Since: Jun 2010
Posts: 13,517
(Head Trainer)
The play is totally standard.

I am asking the mods to move this out of hand analysis, because you don't really want hand analysis, you want to complain about it being rigged and this isn't what the hand analysis forum is for. This is going in bad beats (although to be clear this is not a bad beat by any stretch of the imagination, you're only going to win this pot 2/3rds of the time at the point you got all in.

And before you state you're not saying it's rigged, which is what you've been saying a lot recently, that is exactly what you're saying:

-it's designed for action (rigged to produce action)
-you think your software runs well (it's rigged)
-time to update your rng (it's rigged)
-I'd be rich if this didn't keep happening (it's rigged against me)

No, you wouldn't, if you got all in here thousands of times you'd do fantastic since you'd ship this thing over 68% of the time getting an overlay on your money. The fact that you're losing money long term has nothing to do with losing a spot where you get the money in with 68% equity. I would encourage you to start looking for real hand analysis opportunities, I hope you'll be ready to go there soon. We'll be here to try and help when you are.

Dave


Head Live Trainer
Check out my Videos

4 Time Bracelet Winner



 
Old
Default
Mon Jun 04, 2012, 10:32 PM
(#7)
JWK24's Avatar
Since: Jun 2010
Posts: 24,862
(Super-Moderator)
BronzeStar
***moved to more appropriate forum JWK24***


Super-Moderator



6 Time Bracelet Winner


 
Old
Default
Mon Jun 04, 2012, 10:35 PM
(#8)
JDean's Avatar
Since: Aug 2010
Posts: 3,145
BronzeStar
^^ Agree!

I ignored this one earlier because does smell like a bad beat rant cloaked in a request for analysis.

I intended to come back and answer much like Dave did.

HEA486, do you really want the villain to FOLD here? Do you honestly expect him to fold when he flops trips?

Did you really recognize that you had a pretty FAT chance to be sucked out on because the trips an opp who might call your shove on here holds 3 of a kind that is BIGGER than the 3 of a kind portion of your flopped boat?

Doing this same action over and over again is going to net you a long term profit, but that does NOT mean by any stretch of the imagination you will win EVERY TIME.

I am moving this now.


Double Bracelet Winner
 
Old
Default
pso just become a disapointment - Tue Jun 05, 2012, 07:16 AM
(#9)
holdemace486's Avatar
Since: Nov 2011
Posts: 1,760
i put my hand up for evaluation as i can never win in cash games as mentioned in a previous post was switching to cash games.
Good players 18% sandtrap itm i have 21 percent.
again not once did i mention rigged but all off you on here are quick to slam down on the loosers and not help them in the slightest,thats good learning is it?
no that is a complete disgrace for any school and shocked that Dave and J.dean have gone along that route.
Thats not proffesional in the slightest,i could post 100s of these hands of bad beats from cash games so i posted for analysis,as i wanted analysis.
You disrepect me and disrepect other people alot with these type of posts and slandering,
what guys its a game,grow up and start to read posts properly and then this would not happen.
Its ok to slam the loosers because your hands hold up is it?
MY hands dont hold up in cash games,and thats that,so looking to play different in cash games but obviously not going find any help off you lot on here what a disgrave and very very very unprofessional.
 
Old
Default
Tue Jun 05, 2012, 07:53 AM
(#10)
holdemace486's Avatar
Since: Nov 2011
Posts: 1,760
Quote:
Originally Posted by Feskprins View Post
You grind away and build some chips, and your total profit is four cents? Must be terrible to lose those four cents after a long and sweaty grind.

1. Play with a full stack. Always play with a full stack.
2. You don't have the 2nd nuts, you have the 3rd nuts (quad Js, J7, 77).
3. You forgot to put on your tinfoil hat. If you did wear it, then...
4. There's definitely something wrong with the software/RNG coding. This should NEVER happen!

Seriously though: You should be happy that you got all in there. I'd never fold in this spot and try to get the money in as soon as possible, although I'd probably check/raise the flop instead to get value from any jack or any flush draw instead of firing a donk bet.

....
curious fesk why would u say thats a donk bet,i personally thought that was a small cbet utg to encourage any 1 with a jack to reraise or shove?
I got them both to put their chips in when i had the best hand with my reads on them?
is that bad play?
 
Old
Default
Tue Jun 05, 2012, 08:02 AM
(#11)
holdemace486's Avatar
Since: Nov 2011
Posts: 1,760
Doing this same action over and over again is going to net you a long term profit, but that does NOT mean by any stretch of the imagination you will win EVERY TIME.

J.dean your quote- when i play my game i do this over and over again on the cash tables but i still loose and can not gain a profit?
I can go on free play and win 100k no probs in a short space of time so whats happening with my cash game,why cant i win,i have looked for the answer and cannot find it so came here for help as i did with my tourney play,which is now 21% itm thanks,
I am living proof on this forum that infact the game isnt rigged i have said that before,so why would i say its rigged i have not.

An honest answer to my rng question would of been i quote- well it hasnt been changed sinced x date so maybe yea it could be outdated but thats not the problem m8t lets have a look at your cash game,post some more habds so we can see and work it out amongst us.

not that hard,i have great respect for you j.dean and with all i post can not see how you see this as a bad beat or rigged post,but nothing more than a help request again.
 
Old
Default
Tue Jun 05, 2012, 08:07 AM
(#12)
holdemace486's Avatar
Since: Nov 2011
Posts: 1,760
And thanks ron,breifly had a look at the 1 table games but find the buyin min of 1.50 a bit extreme,now if we had 50c single tables that would be some serious fun in the micros,and i also find the payout structure not as profitable as some would be,i know some have more people in them but itm is not that hard to meet so find them profitable.
 
Old
Default
Tue Jun 05, 2012, 08:32 AM
(#13)
0Magic14's Avatar
Since: Sep 2011
Posts: 71
BronzeStar
It's just unlucky, I've only cashed once in a MTT came close for cashing a 2nd time yesterday,

I had QAS on the button, cut off raised I re raised, he shoved I standard called, He showed QQ I was only at least 15% or somthing like that. just you get lucky or unlucky at poker. as standtrap says you'll only cash 18% of the time.

You have to handle bad beats, if you can't poker aint for you bud.

Good luck at the tables!
 
Old
Default
Tue Jun 05, 2012, 09:08 AM
(#14)
holdemace486's Avatar
Since: Nov 2011
Posts: 1,760
hi omagic,i can handle the bad beats not no problem for me anymore i dont even view it as a bad beats only bad play! hence was for analysis
 
Old
Default
Tue Jun 05, 2012, 09:43 AM
(#15)
Feskprins's Avatar
Since: May 2011
Posts: 450
Quote:
Originally Posted by holdemace486 View Post
curious fesk why would u say thats a donk bet,i personally thought that was a small cbet utg to encourage any 1 with a jack to reraise or shove?
I got them both to put their chips in when i had the best hand with my reads on them?
is that bad play?
It's still a donk bet. I'm not just saying that it is a donk bet. It IS a donk bet. And it's definitely not a cbet. And again, YOU DID NOT HAVE READS ON THEM. We have been through this a gazillion times and every time you say "okay, got it now", but you just never get it. If you don't know what a donk bet, cbet or a read is, you have some serious studying to do instead of throwing away your chips 40bbs at a time.

....
 
Old
Default
Tue Jun 05, 2012, 10:16 AM
(#16)
Sandtrap777's Avatar
Since: Jun 2010
Posts: 3,310
Quote:
Originally Posted by holdemace486 View Post
Good players 18% sandtrap itm i have 21 percent.
again not once did i mention rigged but all off you on here are quick to slam down on the loosers and not help them in the slightest,thats good learning is it?

what guys its a game,grow up and start to read posts properly and then this would not happen.

MY hands dont hold up in cash games,and thats that,so looking to play different in cash games but obviously not going find any help off you lot on here what a disgrave and very very very unprofessional.
18% AND at least 5% ROI which you DON'T have
You didn't mentioned rigged but you surely implied it
Quote:
Originally Posted by holdemace486 View Post
this happens a lot on here and you think your software runs well? its about time you got your rng updated i thinks.
As for reading post properly, DAM, what are you waiting for , it's been mentioned over and over and over how you should play and you have plenty of videos to watch, so what are you waiting for?
You just posted in another thread to come and watch you play, you would be starting with $0.80 at 2NL......................SIT WITH A FULL AMOUNT $2.00, what part of that didn't you understand and do you have the BR of $40?

As for the help, people have help you very much, but YOU DON'T listen, but at one point your rant is getting very annoying

 
Old
Default
Tue Jun 05, 2012, 11:14 AM
(#17)
JWK24's Avatar
Since: Jun 2010
Posts: 24,862
(Super-Moderator)
BronzeStar
Hi Holdemace!

You might want to take a look at OPR. It doesn't list you anywhere near 21% ITM. You're at 14% (292 cashes out of 2038 tourneys played).

John (JWK24)


Super-Moderator



6 Time Bracelet Winner


 
Old
Default
Tue Jun 05, 2012, 11:35 AM
(#18)
holdemace486's Avatar
Since: Nov 2011
Posts: 1,760
120 Days 93.80% $434 - 504 20% 66,159 of 1,067,900

thats what my opr says john?

gone down 1 percent

Sandtrap i do not no why you feel the need to have a dig at me,cash games i have not covered yet and kindly people are all ready helping me.

I do not know why u personally feel you are been offended in some way by my posts,in fact you are the ones that make my posts snd like i am saying its rigged when in fact im not and would certainly put it straight forward like i did when i first joined pso if i now thought that,

ITs now june 2012 i have not deposited since 2011 so i must be doing something right.

IF you dont want to help me no skin off my nose theres other people who will i should hope regardless of my sometimes insane comments,but mostly true as i do get my money in good quite often but still loose,so obviously theres a flaw in my game when im to eager to shove when maybe i should fold,

So i will keep posting and keep learning untill i have sorterd my leaks which is what i thought pso was for unless no one wants to learn or help anyone.
 
Old
Default
Tue Jun 05, 2012, 11:37 AM
(#19)
TheLangolier's Avatar
Since: Jun 2010
Posts: 13,517
(Head Trainer)
Quote:
Originally Posted by holdemace486 View Post
again not once did i mention rigged but all off you on here are quick to slam down on the loosers and not help them in the slightest,thats good learning is it?
I already detailed where you implied rigged with virtually every sentence. And I'm not slamming you down and not helping you. In fact I've tried over and over again to help you get past this limiting mindset but quite frankly you won't hear it.

The majority of people posting hands for analysis here are not winning players, and we try to help each and every one that is actually looking for advice. Your post wasn't.

Quote:
no that is a complete disgrace for any school and shocked that Dave and J.dean have gone along that route. Thats not proffesional in the slightest,i could post 100s of these hands of bad beats from cash games so i posted for analysis,as i wanted analysis.
You got an analysis on the hand, it's the first thing I posted.... the play was completely standard. It is NOT what you actually wanted however, as you went on to complain about losing the hand and ask non-serious questions like should I fold when I flop a full house.

Quote:
You disrepect me and disrepect other people alot with these type of posts and slandering,
what guys its a game,grow up and start to read posts properly and then this would not happen.
Its ok to slam the loosers because your hands hold up is it?
This is 100% untrue. No one is slamming you for losing the hand, slander isn't even an applicable word, no one is slamming other posters. LOL @ because your hands hold up. I get strong hands cracked just like everyone else. Especially 68% favorites, it happens alot, to everyone.

Quote:
MY hands dont hold up in cash games,and thats that,so looking to play different in cash games but obviously not going find any help off you lot on here what a disgrave and very very very unprofessional.
Again, the help is here, when you're ready for it. The OP and subsequent thread suggests you're not yet.


Head Live Trainer
Check out my Videos

4 Time Bracelet Winner



 
Old
Default
Tue Jun 05, 2012, 11:58 AM
(#20)
holdemace486's Avatar
Since: Nov 2011
Posts: 1,760
hi Dave i initaailly state im having a moan like we all moan to bad beats one way or another,
And i do ask questins on my initail post,
am i suppose to fold in this spot?
because like someone suggested the outs could crush me?

AND sry didnt really notice your analysis just noticed the people saying im saying its rigged when in fact i never mentioned it.

and also stated the rng probably could do with a revamp must be better technology out there by now? but that was half jokingly and people should not read emotion in texts which people on here seem to do.

YOu can not tell my emotion by a text in any sense so more confused people make the posts by been speculative when in fact im just talking to you,writing what im thinking and not thinking what im writing if you can follow that.

AND thx for the analysis but it didnt need moving when im not complaining abou thte beat just wanted to know wether i should of played it differently.
 

Getting PokerStars is easy: download and install the PokerStars game software, create your free player account, and validate your email address. Clicking on the download poker button will lead to the installation of compatible poker software on your PC of 51.7 MB, which will enable you to register and play poker on the PokerStars platform. To uninstall PokerStars use the Windows uninstaller: click Start > Control Panel and then select Add or Remove programs > Select PokerStars and click Uninstall or Remove.

Copyright (c) PokerSchoolOnline.com. All rights reserved, Rational Group, Douglas Bay Complex, King Edward Road, Onchan, Isle of Man, IM3 1DZ. You can email us on support@pokerschoolonline.com