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1/2c NL vs Goldstar micro grinder

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1/2c NL vs Goldstar micro grinder - Thu Jun 07, 2012, 03:08 AM
(#1)
Tonk Shuffle's Avatar
Since: Jul 2011
Posts: 618
The villian plays a lot of tables. With J10s in the SB, I probably could have folded pre-flop versus an ABC player. My VPP is 8% after 100 hands, so my nitty table image might have saved my river bet from being shoved back at me. He might have thought I had a full house.
I would like to know if I should have donk bet the flop here, and if the pot sized bet on the river was appropriate.

Sorry, this hand was deleted by its owner

Last edited by Tonk Shuffle; Thu Jun 07, 2012 at 03:39 AM.. Reason: posted in wrong spot, wanted analysis
 
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Thu Jun 07, 2012, 04:37 AM
(#2)
ronh1967's Avatar
Since: Jun 2010
Posts: 376
i dont play cash games much but i would off bet the flop here instead off checking and giving the villian a chance to see a free card
 
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Thanks ronh1967 - Thu Jun 07, 2012, 06:32 PM
(#3)
Tonk Shuffle's Avatar
Since: Jul 2011
Posts: 618
Quote:
Originally Posted by ronh1967 View Post
i dont play cash games much but i would off bet the flop here instead off checking and giving the villian a chance to see a free card
It has been a week since I started learning cash games, and like many players I am having trouble making the change over from multi-table SNGs. I have the BR to absorb the learning curve loses, but I want to improve my game soon.

One concern of mine is that I seem to have the lowest VPP at any table I am at, and when I open a hand everyone folds, unless I run into a monster. It is one thing to have a bad run of cards, but I would like to find more situations where I can get involved in hands. One long session my VPP was 2%; no pairs, no suited aces, broadway cards, ect. I am considering playing any 2 cards from the button whenever this happens, just to improve my table image. So far, when I join a table I slowly leak chips, and when I have a hand I often get out played post-flop in what is supposed to be a 'soft' game.

Last edited by Tonk Shuffle; Thu Jun 07, 2012 at 09:31 PM.. Reason: cant spell
 
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1/2 small blind leaking chips - Thu Jun 07, 2012, 09:13 PM
(#4)
Tonk Shuffle's Avatar
Since: Jul 2011
Posts: 618
After 195 hands I've seen 9 flops, won 2 of 5 at showdown, won 10 without showdown. I am down -$2 for the session; these stats are typical for me.
This happens often, once again, should I have folded pre-flop?
Should I have taken a stab at the pot on the turn? Should I have called the re-raise?

Sorry, this hand was deleted by its owner

Last edited by Tonk Shuffle; Thu Jun 07, 2012 at 09:18 PM.. Reason: posted wrong hand
 
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Fri Jun 08, 2012, 12:12 PM
(#5)
ravenqueen76's Avatar
Since: Sep 2011
Posts: 75
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tonk Shuffle View Post
The villian plays a lot of tables. With J10s in the SB, I probably could have folded pre-flop versus an ABC player. My VPP is 8% after 100 hands, so my nitty table image might have saved my river bet from being shoved back at me. He might have thought I had a full house.
I would like to know if I should have donk bet the flop here, and if the pot sized bet on the river was appropriate.

Sorry, this hand was deleted by its owner
here are my two cents.

first of i would make a note that villain opens KQs in early pos at a fulring table. thats actually really loose.

if i were in your position, i would have folded the JT preflop, but my vpip is much higher than 8 so i cant take advantage of a tight image
because of your tight image you could think of 3B here as a bluff. if he is a multitabler he will most likely have a tracking software so your 3B should get a lot of respect.

i think your flop check is fine, you are checking to the raiser. when he failed to CB i would have bet the turn for about half to 3/4 pot this because a lot of the time you can pick up the pot.

in retrospect he probably would not have folded his KQs.

just remember that in a sng you play a lot of shortstack poker. now you have to play big stacked and thats very different. just take your time

what you can do to boost your vpip, is open more from the steal positions. furthermore watch the video''s in the archive. they are a great learning tool

gl
 
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Fri Jun 08, 2012, 12:24 PM
(#6)
ravenqueen76's Avatar
Since: Sep 2011
Posts: 75
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tonk Shuffle View Post
After 195 hands I've seen 9 flops, won 2 of 5 at showdown, won 10 without showdown. I am down -$2 for the session; these stats are typical for me.
This happens often, once again, should I have folded pre-flop?
Should I have taken a stab at the pot on the turn? Should I have called the re-raise?

Sorry, this hand was deleted by its owner

for me this is a 3B preflop. the sizing i will use is 3x his raise + a little bit extra because i will be out of position. AJ is a very good hand in the blinds and because it is a late position opener it will be a monster against his range of hands. the trouble is his short stack. i would advice to 3B and shove any flop if he calls the 3B. sure he can hold a monster hand but i think that in the long run you will profit from a move like this.

again this is my 2 cts
 
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Sat Jun 09, 2012, 02:49 PM
(#7)
ravenqueen76's Avatar
Since: Sep 2011
Posts: 75
oh and dont forget that goldstar doesnt mean he is a good player, it just means he plays a lot
and playing a lot doenst automatically make you a good player
 
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Thanks ravensqueen76 - Sat Jun 09, 2012, 04:20 PM
(#8)
Tonk Shuffle's Avatar
Since: Jul 2011
Posts: 618
Quote:
Originally Posted by ravenqueen76 View Post
oh and dont forget that goldstar doesnt mean he is a good player, it just means he plays a lot
and playing a lot doenst automatically make you a good player
Agreed on that point!

I am finding it a lot harder to play from the blinds in cash games than MTTs and SNGs. In general I now realize that in tournaments I tend to just leak chips until I find a spot to double up or bust out; for the lack of a strong big stack game. In cash games the villain can buy-in for any stack size s/he wants. Without the threat of ending an opponents game, because they can just re-buy, too often my steal attempts get challenged, and I back down.

A big step forward would be an improved post flop game. Evaluating hand strength, understanding board structure, shifting more emphasis to my opponents' hands, and their actions.
 
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1/2 nl: no value extracted - Sun Jun 10, 2012, 06:58 PM
(#9)
Tonk Shuffle's Avatar
Since: Jul 2011
Posts: 618
If I had bet the flop rather than checking to these guys, I believe that I could have been their tour guide to Valuetown. Instead, I chickened out, because I have lost a few hands trying to extract value. I would like to rename this thread "How to Lose at 1/2nlhe."
Sorry, this hand was deleted by its owner
Is that a fair self-assessment?

Last edited by Tonk Shuffle; Sun Jun 10, 2012 at 07:02 PM.. Reason: post wrong hand....again
 
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Tue Jun 12, 2012, 06:32 PM
(#10)
Eli-21-12's Avatar
Since: Apr 2012
Posts: 4
Hi Tonk Shuffle!

This hand is either a fold or a 3bet against this player.
The range of hands you're up against from an early position opener is too strong for your hand.
Second, you have to play out of position - against a player with more experience... (gold*).

Good luck!
 
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Tue Jun 12, 2012, 06:44 PM
(#11)
JWK24's Avatar
Since: Jun 2010
Posts: 24,809
(Super-Moderator)
BronzeStar
Hi Eli-21-12!

Welcome to the forum! Here's a link that will help to get you familiar with all that PSO has to offer.

When up against an opponent, don't just go by how many stars that the opp may or may not have. All that a gold means is that they spend more money playing every month. It doesn't necessarily mean that they are a good player. I've seen even supernovas that didn't have a clue on how to play a tourney along with bronze stars that I would NOT want at my table.

Good luck at the tables.

John (JWK24)


Super-Moderator



6 Time Bracelet Winner


 
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Wed Jun 13, 2012, 04:16 AM
(#12)
ravenqueen76's Avatar
Since: Sep 2011
Posts: 75
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tonk Shuffle View Post
If I had bet the flop rather than checking to these guys, I believe that I could have been their tour guide to Valuetown. Instead, I chickened out, because I have lost a few hands trying to extract value. I would like to rename this thread "How to Lose at 1/2nlhe."
Sorry, this hand was deleted by its owner
Is that a fair self-assessment?
dont be so hard on yourself. you are here to learn

again this is how i would have played this hand. with two limpers in front i would have raised any hand i want to play. usually my open raise is 3bb. then i add 1bb per limper, so i would have raised to 5bb or 10ct here. what this does is give you the initiative in the hand. most of the time you drive out the players behind you so you can play the hand in postion or you can win the pot right there.

i dont really mind the check on the flop, you can go either way here. i would have called a bet if one was made because you still have equity in the pot. you have second pair and some backdoor draws. when the flop checked trough i would have taken a stab at the pot anyway but the Q hit giving you trips and there you lost potential value in my opinion. on the turn you could still get called by draws (hand like JT, AT)
if you had bet the turn i would have bet any river even if the straight got there. its whats called betting for thin value. if you bet for thin value it means that you feel you have the best hand but accept that better hands will call.

the first thing i would have you change in your game is to stop limping. if you want to play a hand raise (first in: 3bb, with limpers 3bb+1bb per limper) if there is a raise in front of you it depends on the villain if you want to call behind or even 3B. if you dont feel comfortable playing in a raised pot (and not one were you did the raising) only call with hands that you feel comfortable playing or 3B with premiums.

i would stongly advise you to check out the video section. especially the videos by the langolier. he has a lot of theory classes and you will learn a ton

and how you can loose at 2nl? well there are a lot of ways, but playing to passively is certainly one of them. dont worry though you'll get the hang of it
 

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