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j.dean,langolier,j.w answer this please

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j.dean,langolier,j.w answer this please - Thu Jun 07, 2012, 10:25 AM
(#1)
holdemace486's Avatar
Since: Nov 2011
Posts: 1,760
I have posted my complete itm history from feb 2012 and also my overall stats from 2009-2012.

MY question to you guys looking at my results,and please tell me straight! am i been deluded into thinking im a good player when in fact im shite.Or do you see it as i see it and think they may be something specail in there somewhere?



120 Days 93.78% $431 * 501 20% 66,287 of 1,065,343

Year 2012 92.69% $493 * 690 20% 90,094 of 1,232,888


Year 2011 48.41% $520 * 561 14% 974,980 of 1,889,687

Year 2010 31.31% $865 * 511 10% 1,320,636 of 1,922,695

Year 2009 91.49% $610 * 276 9% 147,053 of 1,727,304


avf r/a itm
2012-$493 * * * 1002 1% 137/690 20%

all tourney results from febuary

02 Jun 12 No Limit Hold'em HENL arturluiz $0.25 45 6 $0.62
30 May 12 No Limit Hold'em HENL envy14 $0.25 45 3 $1.70
30 May 12 No Limit Hold'em HENL Farsunka $0.25 45 7 $0.36
28 May 12 No Limit Hold'em HENL A.Henriick $0.10 360 25 $0.27
25 May 12 No Limit Hold'em HENL Mihal666 $0.25 45 6 $0.62
23 May 12 No Limit Hold'em HENL cuñaos502 $0.25 45 6 $0.62
22 May 12 No Limit Hold'em HENL ChinadoO $0.10 360 12 $0.51
22 May 12 No Limit Hold'em HENL zariusom $0.25 45 4 $1.29
14 May 12 No Limit Hold'em HENL bohoszole $0.10 360 19 $0.27
14 May 12 No Limit Hold'em HENL Moneytry $0.02 990 32 $0.10
14 May 12 No Limit Hold'em HENL mcvibster $0.25 45 2 $2.22
14 May 12 No Limit Hold'em HENL RaoulDuke182 $0.02 990 32 $0.10
14 May 12 No Limit Hold'em HENL BornToLoseÒó $0.25 45 6 $0.62
13 May 12 No Limit Hold'em HENL victormadrid $0.25 45 4 $1.29
13 May 12 No Limit Hold'em HENL smashen $0.55 10900 470 $1.68
11 May 12 No Limit Hold'em HENL holdemace486 $0.50 45 1 $6.30
06 May 12 No Limit Hold'em HENL digi1978 $0.25 45 5 $0.93
06 May 12 No Limit Hold'em HENL rafelet76 $0.55 11306 317 $2.20
05 May 12 No Limit Hold'em HENL dacerocket $0.25 45 4 $1.29
04 May 12 No Limit Hold'em HENL NR1990 $0.25 45 7 $0.36
29 Apr 12 No Limit Hold'em HENL JC57B $0.25 45 6 $0.62
29 Apr 12 No Limit Hold'em HENL Tatitovich $0.25 45 6 $0.62
26 Apr 12 No Limit Hold'em HENL holdemace486 $0.25 45 1 $3.23
26 Apr 12 No Limit Hold'em HENL pereira158 $0.25 45 5 $0.93
25 Apr 12 No Limit Hold'em HENL marciofisio $0.25 90 10 $0.50
23 Apr 12 No Limit Hold'em HENL Monkeeyyy $0.25 90 11 $0.50
23 Apr 12 No Limit Hold'em HENL cbapkr $0.25 45 4 $1.29
23 Apr 12 No Limit Hold'em HENL Imm1k93 $1.10 2321 110 $3.36
09 Apr 12 No Limit Hold'em HENL roto121 $1.10 2458 274 $1.84
08 Apr 12 No Limit Hold'em HENL gaga_x $0.50 90 3 $5.67
07 Apr 12 No Limit Hold'em HENL Dwarf_ff $0.50 45 2 $4.35
07 Apr 12 No Limit Hold'em HENL aleks118 $0.50 90 8 $1.45
06 Apr 12 No Limit Hold'em HENL glassback1 $1.10 4306 268 $2.45
05 Apr 12 No Limit Hold'em HENL pickerel57 $0.25 45 2 $2.22
05 Apr 12 No Limit Hold'em HENL sw0rdz0r $0.50 90 6 $2.12
05 Apr 12 No Limit Hold'em HENL trevtones $0.50 45 4 $2.53
04 Apr 12 No Limit Hold'em HENL tankir232 $1 180 6 $8.19
04 Apr 12 No Limit Hold'em HENL coolman150 $1 45 4 $5.11
04 Apr 12 No Limit Hold'em HENL Mikeg1578 $1.10 5217 28 $11
03 Apr 12 No Limit Hold'em HENL JinxOxniJ $1.10 2459 145 $2.95
02 Apr 12 No Limit Hold'em HENL Arshak28 $0.25 45 5 $0.93
31 Mar 12 No Limit Hold'em HENL coys38 $1.10 4209 30 $9.25
31 Mar 12 No Limit Hold'em HENL dexir $2.20 836 21 $11
30 Mar 12 No Limit Hold'em HENL iaico $4.40 7554 361 $11
29 Mar 12 No Limit Hold'em HENL Grendel_Khan $1.10 3600 391 $1.69
29 Mar 12 No Limit Hold'em HENL collio89 $1.10 4020 111 $5.02
27 Mar 12 No Limit Hold'em HENL rick3d $1.10 2451 149 $2.94
26 Mar 12 No Limit Hold'em HENL @LEXA5788@ $1 45 3 $6.75
25 Mar 12 No Limit Hold'em HENL bquaresma24 $1 45 5 $3.68
24 Mar 12 No Limit Hold'em HENL Just Lika $1.10 3659 4 $201
24 Mar 12 No Limit Hold'em HENL B0rovik $0.25 45 4 $1.29
24 Mar 12 No Limit Hold'em HENL sledgeham3r $0.25 45 2 $2.22
23 Mar 12 No Limit Hold'em HENL MrMister1 $1 45 6 $2.45
22 Mar 12 No Limit Hold'em HENL edypokerman $0.25 45 7 $0.36
22 Mar 12 No Limit Hold'em HENL michelk66 $0.10 360 28 $0.24
22 Mar 12 No Limit Hold'em HENL vlasis1980 $1.10 2979 67 $6.06
21 Mar 12 No Limit Hold'em HENL momismyqueen $1.10 3561 103 $4.62
21 Mar 12 No Limit Hold'em HENL brando353 $0.25 45 4 $1.29
19 Mar 12 No Limit Hold'em HENL mad_baldrick $0.25 45 7 $0.36
18 Mar 12 No Limit Hold'em HENL holdemace486 $0.25 45 1 $3.23
18 Mar 12 No Limit Hold'em HENL Maverick1763 $0.25 45 2 $2.22
17 Mar 12 No Limit Hold'em HENL RubEnTrance $0.50 90 7 $1.72
14 Mar 12 No Limit Hold'em HENL reiseAttackk $1.10 2793 305 $1.89
13 Mar 12 No Limit Hold'em HENL badicool $0.25 45 7 $0.36
13 Mar 12 No Limit Hold'em HENL hvgp2 $0.25 45 7 $0.36
13 Mar 12 No Limit Hold'em HENL Fuchsmühl $0.25 45 6 $0.62
12 Mar 12 No Limit Hold'em HENL GiwrgosTak $0.25 45 2 $2.22
10 Mar 12 No Limit Hold'em HENL shandy333 $0.25 45 5 $0.93
09 Mar 12 No Limit Hold'em HENL wanderer_pro $0.25 45 5 $0.93
09 Mar 12 No Limit Hold'em HENL ooATIRAMoo $0.25 45 7 $0.36
08 Mar 12 No Limit Hold'em HENL Danyo1983 $0.25 45 7 $0.36
08 Mar 12 No Limit Hold'em HENL santi2582 $0.25 45 3 $1.70
07 Mar 12 No Limit Hold'em HENL oscilograf $0.25 45 5 $0.93
07 Mar 12 No Limit Hold'em HENL scare75 $0.25 45 2 $2.22
07 Mar 12 No Limit Hold'em HENL hoops87 $0.25 45 5 $0.93
06 Mar 12 No Limit Hold'em HENL IOpuka $0.25 45 6 $0.62
04 Mar 12 No Limit Hold'em HENL L0v3Fu1 $0.25 45 2 $2.22
03 Mar 12 No Limit Hold'em HENL dmitr30 $0.25 45 2 $2.22
03 Mar 12 No Limit Hold'em HENL RollMD $0.25 45 4 $1.29
03 Mar 12 No Limit Hold'em HENL paddi112 $0.25 45 4 $1.29
02 Mar 12 No Limit Hold'em HENL peterpan428 $0.25 45 2 $2.22
01 Mar 12 No Limit Hold'em HENL zolain11 $0.25 45 6 $0.62
01 Mar 12 No Limit Hold'em HENL gellissystem $0.25 45 2 $2.22
29 Feb 12 No Limit Hold'em HENL daaanj00 $0.25 45 2 $2.22
29 Feb 12 No Limit Hold'em HENL va1830 $0.10 4543 754 $0.15
28 Feb 12 No Limit Hold'em HENL Chernovsky $0.25 45 6 $0.62
28 Feb 12 No Limit Hold'em HENL holdemace486 $0.25 45 1 $3.23
27 Feb 12 No Limit Hold'em HENL Maximalistik $0.25 45 2 $2.22
26 Feb 12 No Limit Hold'em HENL gamerwalt $0.25 45 2 $2.22
24 Feb 12 No Limit Hold'em HENL Cherep007 $0.25 45 3 $1.70
23 Feb 12 No Limit Hold'em HENL holdemace486 $0.25 45 1 $3.23
22 Feb 12 No Limit Hold'em HENL Alex5364 $1.10 6081 78 $7.84
21 Feb 12 No Limit Hold'em HENL marxenios $0.25 45 2 $2.22
20 Feb 12 No Limit Hold'em HENL holdemace486 $0.25 45 1 $3.23
19 Feb 12 No Limit Hold'em HENL holdemace486 $0.25 45 1 $3.23
18 Feb 12 No Limit Hold'em HENL onlyevil87 $0.25 45 5 $0.93
16 Feb 12 No Limit Hold'em HENL 00all $1.10 3678 343 $1.83
14 Feb 12 No Limit Hold'em HENL Hollandians $0.10 360 9 $0.61
14 Feb 12 No Limit Hold'em HENL tiapa_83 $1.10 2624 196 $2.62
10 Feb 12 No Limit Hold'em HENL ariosonove $0.25 1453 53 $0.78
09 Feb 12 No Limit Hold'em HENL collallins $0.25 45 3 $1.70
 
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Thu Jun 07, 2012, 11:04 AM
(#2)
JWK24's Avatar
Since: Jun 2010
Posts: 24,824
(Super-Moderator)
BronzeStar
Hi Holdemace!

Honestly, I don't care about ITM%'s..... the bottom line is the ROI, both for tourneys and for cash tables. A positive ROI means that a player is making $$ and the bottom line for me.... is my bankroll increasing?

Also, I have to note that the tracking sites don't take every single game/tournament type into account too... and to have an accurate assessment, from day 1 that I started playing online in any cash tourneys, I set up and keep an excel spreadsheet of every single tourney and cash table that I've ever played. This way, I can have a 100% accurate assessment. Only counting selected games will not give an accurate assessment. Only the overall total of everything, every single table whether it's a cash game or tourney and the combination of all of them will give an accurate assessment.

I track the date, tourney number, type of tourney, finishing position, number of entrants, buy-in, return from tourney, fpp's, bankroll total and fpp totals. For cash tables, same things minus entrants and finishing position.

I have multiple lists too... one that includes all games, then on individual sheets, I break them down into each type of game. Yes, it's a lot of work for me to do this... but it's something that I feel is necessary for me, to know that I'm beating a given game before I would try moving up.

I can take the individual lists and calculate an ITM% if I want to..... but it's not even a stat that I keep on my list.
Depending on the tourney types, etc that a given player is playing, I've seen players with a 5-7% ITM that are flat-out killing a game.... I've seen some in the 55-60% range that are losing money!

The bottom line is..... AM I MAKING $$?

John (JWK24)


Super-Moderator



6 Time Bracelet Winner


 
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Thu Jun 07, 2012, 11:59 AM
(#3)
Sandtrap777's Avatar
Since: Jun 2010
Posts: 3,310
Holdem,

Here are a few more numbers

In just over a year, since May 31st 2011 (not counting private games, Home games or Regional games) you've played 250 games and out of those, 135 were buy-ins (others were free rolls)

So out of the 135, you were ITM 27 times, which means you were 20% ITM
You spend a total of $210 and won $267 for a ROI of 27%
If you remove the big win of $200, then your ROI would be -68%

But here are some great stats
You've played 67 $1 game and cashed in 19 for 29% ITM and spend $67 and won $222.14 for a ROI of 231%. So here's something to think about.
Why not stick to what you are good at and when your BR permits it, ONLY then go up a level?

The last posts were mainly about cash games and you have no stats to show for. But a few of us have railed you and notice how your play was terrible. Like I've said, mtt's and cash games are two different types of games, while you could be good at one, it doesn't mean you'll be good at the other.

Like JW said, not all games or stats show up on those sites, you need your own and you can do that by asking your audit from PokerStars every month (that's what I do and I also have PT3)

GL
 
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Thu Jun 07, 2012, 01:13 PM
(#4)
Feskprins's Avatar
Since: May 2011
Posts: 450
One more thing: You can't just hand pick the tourneys you want to count (i.e. "from february 2012"). In that case, I pick the last six MTTs I played. Oh yeah, I rule! I'm 83% ITM!!!!!!

Your ITM% has to be over a long period of time, such as a year or 1000 tournaments. And like the others said, it doesn't matter anyways. Your ROI is still negative. Look at THEBATTLER33. Note that he's only 14% ITM.

....
 
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Thu Jun 07, 2012, 03:32 PM
(#5)
JDean's Avatar
Since: Aug 2010
Posts: 3,145
BronzeStar
Hi HEA486.

My feeling reading your posts is that you most likely ARE a "bad player"...but NOT in the way you may have ever considered before.

As JWK states, poker is all about the $.

If you are really SERIOUS about the game, all that matters in the end is how much $ you have to spend on stuff you want.

- How you got the money, via suck outs or great plays, doesn't matter.
- How much you have in your BR that you intend to keep playing poker on doesn't matter.
- How it came to pass that you do not win MORE doesn't matter.

All that matters is how much money you have to spend on stuff you want.

The reason you seem to be a "bad" player to me is that you seem overly invested in the BAD thins that can happen on your journey to profitability, and do not focus enough on the things you should probably be doing to make SURE you are profitable.

It really strikes me that you seem to think in your gut that somehow, someway, if you just do everything "right" you will win ALL THE TIME. I'm here to tell you now HEA486, that is never going to happen.

The reason why you seem to me to be a "bad" player is that your expectations are unrealistic, and in your unrealistic expectations you allow yourself to spend way too much time on irrelevancies. That time would be much better spent in studying ways to make the best decision possible; all the rest is down to luck HEA486...

Now before you get all bent out of shape by this, THINK about it...

Poker is a "whole" game, and mental control is part of that whole game, just like knowing things like the difference between good and bad start hands, knowing when to bet fold call or raise, or knowing the in's an out's of MTT play. If you have a serious hole in your game ANYWHERE, you are not anywhere near your potential as a poker player.

I think you'd have to admit that at the very least you have an issue with mental control regarding the game HEA486, and as long as you have that issue you are always going to be a "bad" player.

On the positive side, once you finally REALIZE you have that issue regarding mental control in poker, you should be well on your way to being a very GOOD player.

Being good or bad at poker is a RELATIVE THING, and is only measured by the benefit you get form the game. For some people, the benefit is MONEY they can SPEND, and it doesn't matter to them if they play well or poorly to get that money. If you look at poker results as only valid in relation to other things, then you HAVE to look at all the time you've "wasted" on bad beat whines, and rants about bad luck you cannot ever control, and think that you'd be a much BETTER player if you did not waste your time there.

So in not making the best use of your time, you can only be a BAD player until you stop worrying about things you cannot control.

Hope it helps.

-JDean


Double Bracelet Winner

Last edited by JDean; Thu Jun 07, 2012 at 05:13 PM..
 
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Thu Jun 07, 2012, 08:30 PM
(#6)
TheLangolier's Avatar
Since: Jun 2010
Posts: 13,512
(Head Trainer)
Hi holdemace,

Your ITM doesn't mean as much as you think it does. It's possible to have a 20% ITM in mtt's and be a hugely successful player (ROI wise... $$$$$). It's also possible to have the same ITM % and be a losing player.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sandtrap777 View Post
But here are some great stats
You've played 67 $1 game and cashed in 19 for 29% ITM and spend $67 and won $222.14 for a ROI of 231%. So here's something to think about.
Why not stick to what you are good at and when your BR permits it, ONLY then go up a level?

The last posts were mainly about cash games and you have no stats to show for. But a few of us have railed you and notice how your play was terrible. Like I've said, mtt's and cash games are two different types of games, while you could be good at one, it doesn't mean you'll be good at the other
Sandtrap is spot on, mtt's and cash games are very different, and a good bit of that difference relates to the depth of money.

What Sand has identified here in your success at the $1 mtt's actually makes a lot of sense to me in light of the reviews you received in the other thread on your cash game play, which was obviously not good. One of the big leaks you had in cash game action was overplaying 1 pair hands, making big all in overbets with premiums, etc. This type of play will get you killed long term in cash games because it's rarely good play on deeper money. Even sitting on a shorter stack like you tried, 40-60bb's is still much deeper than most of your mtt spots. If you are playing your mtt's in a similar fashion, this might actually be a nice adjustment in $1 mtt's because:

1) the depth of money is often more shallow
2) there will be tons of super fishy/spewy opponents who will call off with garbage. So unlike the cash games where with deeper money you often end up just value owning yourself, in the $1 mtt's you're getting good value much more often.

I do think that's not, in general, the best way to play, but against hugely spewy callers with shallower stacks it would be a good adjustment to the situation to maximize value. It would also explain a bit why your success goes down as the buy in level goes up... better structures on average lead to deeper money for longer into the event, and less total clowns to spew off than in the $1 player pool.


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Fri Jun 08, 2012, 07:15 AM
(#7)
PokerPest72's Avatar
Since: Nov 2011
Posts: 247
BronzeStar
Well a lot of this makes a lot of sense to me, I also over value premium hands in cash games and lose some 200+bb over playing them, now if I started to play qq+ in a diff way stop getting all my chips in pref then I would not lose as much with prem hands and it would not stick in the back of my throat and affect the mental side of my game, now as for tourney play something I do suck at, I suppose it makes more sense to back them big hands up and hope you just run good, e.g I cant fold AK in a tourney but I can in a cash game.

So through my cash game play, sorry to steal ya topic bro, I find myself table chip leader a lot of times but lose massive pots with AA KK QQ so this is nothing to do with running bad but over playing them hands, so have I just identified a leak within my game or is playing hands within the top so may % down to player preference?

When it comes to cash versus tourney play bro, I think 2 completely different games with the same 2 cards tourneys require a TAG style and cash requires a LAG style, 3 and 4 betting, picking on weaker players, I would put it this way if u see a player with a 50% vpip in a tourney he is prolly a very loose and weak player but in a cash game a good player can end up with a high vpip, not because he is some kind of giant fish but because he is targeting a player or players he has identified as weak so he is making more plays against them, the key is knowing who is who, watching the table closely and adjusting accordingly and also taking note when u have figured hey he,s a good player u can expect him to adjust so u have to be ready to adjust again, its a game of cat and mouse not ABC poker.

I have been doing an experiment the past couple of days, odds calculator vs HUD play so basically math vs reads and I can say from a smallish sample size that reads are where all the power is, the odds calc makes all it decisions based on math, you end up with a low vpip and it costs u in BB ph, now reads on the other hand give u a +bb ph, so like it or lump it you need a HUD bro u need to be on exact same playing field as other players, I stopped using a HUD on here and went back to fun play 1/2c and lost 60$ on here acting daft and I don't think I have ever in my life lost $60 on 1/2c in cash games I am livid with myself, now if I lose a 50-75$ pot in a 25nl well that's expected but 60$ @ 1/2c I need a hot poker ramming up my back side lol. Get a HUD bro stop playing as an underdog, I have auto notes with pokertracker 4 beta yes auto notes, I don't even have to type them In,
 
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Sun Jun 10, 2012, 10:56 PM
(#8)
holdemace486's Avatar
Since: Nov 2011
Posts: 1,760
Ok thank you for the honest but all so true answers. I have considered all you have said and by no means will under estimate the advice you have gratefully given me.

J.dean your reads are good off the tables i would not like to play you, you are completely correct in thinking i do in fact think and want to win every game and structure i play.

Thank you JW for pointing out that winning chips and keeping them is more important than the rankings, although i did grind myself a ranking from a small BR, and I feel i do deserve some respect for my efforts.

Thanks Dave for enhancing what sandtrap as said, even though to be honest i am not entirely sure of what you mean as poker terminology to me can be confusing as maths and stats etc mean nothing to me as i dont use them to be honest <perhaps i should>

I think you are both saying maybe 1 doller sngs maybe my best option.

And on to feskprins! i did want a silent railing, you completely threw me off track by sittting at my table, you sat down with a 5 doller br compared to my small change, i was dominated by your stack that you could afford to chuck away if you wanted,
I tilted and did say in the chat box to you so i still think your summary of me was rather harsh,but nether the less i respect your skills and judgement.

Ok advice taken, transferred 5 dollers from my emergency BR,infact 50 percent of my emergency BR.
Decided to stop thinking it was the a computer program i was trying to beat and actaully started to watch the play.

SO to cut a long story short, now on 30 dollers, 2c 5c blinds,profit every table i have played on,
no tilt no frustration and hidden from search,

2 doller buyins

So ok thanks for the beat down it was needed as complacincy sets in regular, and ROI i need so ROI it will be,even though i hate taking money of people


ANY one have any secret tips to share appreciated
 
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Mon Jun 11, 2012, 03:32 AM
(#9)
Moxie Pip's Avatar
Since: Aug 2010
Posts: 3,853
Quote:
Originally Posted by holdemace486 View Post
Ok thank you for the honest but all so true answers. I have considered all you have said and by no means will under estimate the advice you have gratefully given me.

J.dean your reads are good off the tables i would not like to play you, you are completely correct in thinking i do in fact think and want to win every game and structure i play.

Thank you JW for pointing out that winning chips and keeping them is more important than the rankings, although i did grind myself a ranking from a small BR, and I feel i do deserve some respect for my efforts.

Thanks Dave for enhancing what sandtrap as said, even though to be honest i am not entirely sure of what you mean as poker terminology to me can be confusing as maths and stats etc mean nothing to me as i dont use them to be honest <perhaps i should> Ya think?

I think you are both saying maybe 1 doller sngs maybe my best option.

And on to feskprins! i did want a silent railing, you completely threw me off track by sittting at my table, you sat down with a 5 doller br compared to my small change, i was dominated by your stack that you could afford to chuck away if you wanted, He wasn't playing that stack because he could "afford to chuck it away". He was playing it because effective stack sizes is a consideration in poker and on ring tables fish that sit down with small stacks and play weak fold or ship poker are EXACTLY what regs are looking for.
I tilted and did say in the chat box to you so i still think your summary of me was rather harsh,but nether the less i respect your skills and judgement.

Ok advice taken, transferred 5 dollers from my emergency BR,infact 50 percent of my emergency BR. NO,actually advice (once again...) completely IGNORED. See below.
Decided to stop thinking it was the a computer program i was trying to beat and actaully started to watch the play.

SO to cut a long story short, now on 30 dollers, 2c 5c blinds,profit every table i have played on,
no tilt no frustration and hidden from search, Nice start. See you in a few days (at the most) for the next installment of your "I'm bust BR and out of 'ere" whinefest. Again,see below.

2 doller buyins Just LOL,see below.

So ok thanks for the beat down it was needed as complacincy sets in regular, and ROI i need so ROI it will be,even though i hate taking money of people


ANY one have any secret tips to share appreciated
Yes,either start listening to the good advice that you're getting here or withdrawal that $30.00 IMMEDIATELY and buy something that you want with it. Because you STILL are not getting it and are going to piss this pile away as well. SEE BELOW.





Holdem,you say advice received and understood and then go right back to doing what everyone here told you NOT TO DO. To wit...

1. You're trying to play 5NL on a $5.00 BR to start and have ground it all the way up to $30.00 You say? Smashing,you're now only $170.00 SHORT of the proper bankroll for 5NL (that's .02/.05 tables to you...). You should have AT LEAST 40 stacks of full buy-ins for any level of NLHE ring tables that you are playing. That's standard BR principles. For someone who tilts the way you do I would advise a more conservative BR,more like 60 stacks.

2. FULL BUY-INS holdem. At 5NL that's $5.00,NOT $2.00. We all told you that you were making a mistake playing 2NL with .80 buy-ins (40% of a full stack...) so what do you do? Jump up a level and buy-in for 40% ($2.00 is 40% of $5.00...) there.

You are NOT sufficiently rolled to be playing 2NL,much less 5NL and when the variance hits,and it WILL hit,you,especially the way you spew stacks off,are going to be down to the ether-felt in short order.

Again.

Bad BR decisions are the single biggest leak in poker. They beat you before the cards are even dealt. And you keep making them,over and over again.

And that has,nor will it ever have,a damn thing to do with any RNG.

Probably 10% of online players turn a profit. But there are probably another 10-15% whom are good enough to turn a profit if they would just follow proper BR procedures and discipline. Your game,as of right now,is nowhere near good enough to spit into the wind when it comes to BR discipline. And you ARE going to go Busto again because of it,I guarantee you that.

Or you can wise up and start actually listening to the advice you get here. Your call.
 
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Mon Jun 11, 2012, 03:58 AM
(#10)
r0ck.carver's Avatar
Since: Apr 2011
Posts: 201
lol no grey area there moxie... on the other hand truth hurts.. as my sis says doesn't change the fact its the truth...holdem i looked up ur stats as I have them from Jan 2011 on and your vpip is really high m8 ....43 percent... still a newb myself and making mistakes constantly so comments should be taken accordingly...but that stat speaks volumes to me....like jw i keep my own records in order to improve my game ...but the bottom line is the bottom line and thats how we score poker!!! MONEY IN THE BANK...UR A WINNER SPEW ALL IT OUT AND YOUR A ......NUFF SAID
 
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Mon Jun 11, 2012, 07:17 AM
(#11)
Feskprins's Avatar
Since: May 2011
Posts: 450
Quote:
Originally Posted by holdemace486 View Post
And on to feskprins! i did want a silent railing, you completely threw me off track by sittting at my table, you sat down with a 5 doller br compared to my small change, i was dominated by your stack
1. My BR is not five dollers
2. Having a larger stack is not an edge in cash games
3. There's no such thing as "dominated stacks", especially not in cash games
4. There's always someone who buys in deep, just happened to be me this time
5. Playing pots against players that have you covered should not influence your game since you're the effective stack

Quote:
Originally Posted by holdemace486
emergency BR


Quote:
I tilted and did say in the chat box to you
Is that a good thing? By telling me that you were tilting (not that you needed to, was pretty obvious) you just gave me a GOLDMINE of information so I could take (read: be handed) more of your money.


....

Last edited by Feskprins; Mon Jun 11, 2012 at 07:19 AM..
 
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Mon Jun 11, 2012, 10:20 AM
(#12)
Sandtrap777's Avatar
Since: Jun 2010
Posts: 3,310
Quote:
Originally Posted by holdemace486 View Post
Ok advice taken, transferred 5 dollers from my emergency BR,infact 50 percent of my emergency BR.
Decided to stop thinking it was the a computer program i was trying to beat and actaully started to watch the play.

SO to cut a long story short, now on 30 dollers, 2c 5c blinds,profit every table i have played on,
no tilt no frustration and hidden from search,

2 doller buyins

So ok thanks for the beat down it was needed as complacincy sets in regular, and ROI i need so ROI it will be,even though i hate taking money of people


ANY one have any secret tips to share appreciated

Are you kidding me?????????
You bought in with $2 from a BR of $5 into a 5NL, Haven't you understood anything?
If you want to play cash games, your BR should be at $40 and you should ONLY play 2NL (1 cent 2 cents)

What about the learning process
How will you analyze your good and bad plays?
Will you be watching videos?

To me, you're just back to your old tricks and staying a losing player. You'll be bankrupt in no time. Remember, you just had a good session and there will be bad sessions and you haven't got the knowledge nor the BR to face it.

GL
 
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Mon Jun 11, 2012, 12:33 PM
(#13)
holdemace486's Avatar
Since: Nov 2011
Posts: 1,760
Thanks again for the interesting posts and advice,

Fesk i meant you brought in for 5 dollers and not that mbeen your BR,was in the early hours of this morning lol.
Thanks for some solid advice there as well with your post.

Ok i posted so i dont make the same mistakes and loose my BR again,As Sandtrap suggested watching videos yes i hope to attend thje next free live traiing when thats available,and may watch Daves reads vid again.

I do understand what you are all saying about BR management, and understand why we should not do the crazy buyin for my level of BR, however I did do a good job of it this time,
thanks mainly to a kick up the butt of you guys,and not wanting to look like a utter d......k.

OK looking at 6 seaters cash games what would be a good VPIP average to play?
I know im still on about cash tables and should drop back to 45 ppl stgs and am hearing what you are all saying. I do still have 5 dollers in reserve for that purpose if needed,I know that just still doesnt explain Bad BR management and certainly if any newbies are reading this,

THEY MUST NOT FOLLOW MY ADVICE IN ANY SENSE ON BR MANAGEMENT

However i now see it like this for just my purposes,i can use half of my new BR for the cash and half for the sngs and this at least is some sort of plan,goal,watch some vids keeping my poker mind on the game,etc and talking to you guys with a weekly question of a normal asking lol.

So with that in mind ,and i understand and thank the guy for the vpip stats,
my question is

why is vpip such over rated
6 seaters will have higher vpip players,the table could loose a couple players and so on,
So what is the average vpip on a six seater for winning players?
 
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Mon Jun 11, 2012, 01:46 PM
(#14)
Sandtrap777's Avatar
Since: Jun 2010
Posts: 3,310
Quote:
Originally Posted by holdemace486 View Post
Thanks again for the interesting posts and advice,
You're Welcome


Ok i posted so i dont make the same mistakes and loose my BR again,As Sandtrap suggested watching videos yes i hope to attend thje next free live traiing when thats available,and may watch Daves reads vid again.

WHY wait, there's about 420 videos right here and you might have to watch them 3-4 times each, so that's about 1,500 watching. You need to get started.


I do understand what you are all saying about BR management, and understand why we should not do the crazy buyin for my level of BR, however I did do a good job of it this time, thanks mainly to a kick up the butt of you guys,and not wanting to look like a utter d......k.
You probably just got LUCKY, variance hasn't kick in yet, nor the tilt

OK looking at 6 seaters cash games what would be a good VPIP average to play?
I would say about 16-18% at 2NL, Dave would better answer that

I know im still on about cash tables and should drop back to 45 ppl stgs and am hearing what you are all saying. I do still have 5 dollers in reserve for that purpose if needed,I know that just still doesnt explain Bad BR management and certainly if any newbies are reading this,

THEY MUST NOT FOLLOW MY ADVICE IN ANY SENSE ON BR MANAGEMENT

However i now see it like this for just my purposes,i can use half of my new BR for the cash and half for the sngs and this at least is some sort of plan,goal,watch some vids keeping my poker mind on the game,etc and talking to you guys with a weekly question of a normal asking lol.

You still haven't learned DAM,
Let me explain AGAIN. Once you reached $40 in your BR, ONLY then should you play cash games. In the mean time, play in the league, play freerolls to build your BR and that's ONLY for the cash games. If you also want to play SnG's, you need a bigger BR

So with that in mind ,and i understand and thank the guy for the vpip stats,
my question is

why is vpip such over rated
6 seaters will have higher vpip players,the table could loose a couple players and so on, so what is the average vpip on a six seater for winning players?
VPIP is not overated, it's one of the statistic that will help you take advantage of a player. The higher the %, the bigger the fish, the lower it is, the more NIT the players is.

WHAT IS YOUR TOTAL BR NOW?
 
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Tue Jun 12, 2012, 05:41 AM
(#15)
PokerPest72's Avatar
Since: Nov 2011
Posts: 247
BronzeStar
vpip short handed is not a perfect science bro, some games mines up some games mines down, but winning players in general have a vpip of between 16.5% and 30% @ 6 max and if yours is in the high 40,s then any1 with a HUD is going to exploit you and u prolly don't even know its happening.

Stick to 25/c sng,s. Once you have over 40$ in your br pref 80$ download a trial tracker 30/60 trial depending which tracker u go for, then sit down play less hands, try to make some money over the next 30/60 days then use this to pay for your tracking software, so its a risk free purchase.

Option 2 do what I have done i'm playing some really bad poker, making bad calls and just falling into a big slump, so I am having a 30 day cool off, under responsible gambling, I,ll go away spend some time seeing where I am going wrong try to correct it and then hit them tables on july 11th .
I am leaking money faster than Greece time to take a step back.
Yeah i'm running like dung my made hands not holding up, but that's no excuse for bad play, so i'm spewing chips all over the show.A bad beat can cost you over 100bb but bad play costs you 1000,s of bb.
 
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Wed Jun 13, 2012, 12:19 PM
(#16)
holdemace486's Avatar
Since: Nov 2011
Posts: 1,760
hi sandtrap sorry for not replying to your question but i did it again and pissed most of it away back down to 16 dollers so going to drop back to 25c 45ppl sngs where i should of just gone in the first place and listened to you and everyone else,

the fact is i again played too much,too many hands and for far to many hours i.e 7 am the next morning from the night befores tea time.

The worse graveyard play you will ever see.

The fact is once i have got chips i can not play, my game goes out of the window on all formats,

Yesterday for example i sat down with 2 dollers no problem took it to nearly 5,left the table.
Continued on the next table with success,then for no apparent reason but stupidity, decided to play 11 tables at once with no software which i know is stupidity on my part.

lost all but 1 which i did manage itm in ,two i needlessly chucked away close to itm when i was stacked with chips,well enought for itm for sure,so again my stupidity cost me.

As j.dean mentioned once JOY tilt, thats probably my biggest factor in been a losing player as once i have chips and i know its enough for a while,i just stop caring untill my chips are down.

ITs just me ,i have not got that big of an interest in money,it does not bother me that people are sitting in jakuzis in the bahamas etc,as long as i eat and got a roof over my head who cares.

Morbid look i suppose that does as adverse effect on my game.

I have saved a few hands in these cash games and will post for analysis once i have the time to see where i went wrong or even went right,i think im losing value at times and this could be a leak in my game i had never thought of.

Thank you all for putting up with me,and i do listen and know the correct advice from you all should be followed,however sitting in my bedroom with the comp gets boring,playing to many players multitabling is just boring,you practically know once they bet they got something unlike my raise 72 just for the boredom factor,i even reraise these multitablers with fressh air,sometimes it works ,sometimes it doesnt but its all good fun.

I can sit there and play tag or nit and yes i do win when i do this i have got to admit, but you all have to admit its boring like that theres no fun just seriousness.

Sorry mods if this as gone slightly off topic in this section but thats just me i will just talk away,
 
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Wed Jun 13, 2012, 12:32 PM
(#17)
Sandtrap777's Avatar
Since: Jun 2010
Posts: 3,310
It's no use............

Speaking for the 15-20% of winning players (not that I'm one) THANK YOU for your money and please don't stop donating.

 
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Wed Jun 13, 2012, 12:43 PM
(#18)
EdinFreeMan's Avatar
Since: Feb 2010
Posts: 4,540
If poker is a game of decisions, then I think you have a big one to make holdemace....

do you want to

a) be a serious winning poker player and therefore play 'correctly' whenever possible to achieve that

or


b) be a recreational player and have more fun, but at a cost to your BR (nothing wrong with paying to have fun if that is what you enjoy)

I'm not sure you have decided yet - but they seem to be mutually exclusive concepts for you, whereas for most of us winning is more fun than losing. But why waste time studying and learning here at PSO if you do not want to apply that at the tables?

Good luck

Ed from Edinburgh - EdinFreeMan
 
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Wed Jun 13, 2012, 12:58 PM
(#19)
holdemace486's Avatar
Since: Nov 2011
Posts: 1,760
you could not have said that any better guys, thanks, and yes i think i want to be serious but then yes as you say edin enjoy the recreational side and need truly to make a good decission and be right with it.
I have learnt a lot of here from you guys and when i play that way can win, grrr i feel like a right prat at times and really need to give myself a kick.

Ok all decided i know what im going to do now, im going to use up the last of my BR in tourneys,
or slam it all on one cash table and have fun lol.

I then will take a break from poker, and sort out my life situation,
i then will return fresh headed and focused with a fresh BR enough to avoid the microstakes,

Play at a level where i feel i should be playing at,and the value of my chips as more meaning to me.

TY for everything i will return,and start fresh with BR management for the BR i manage to put on my account,back to the basics for me.
 
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Wed Jun 13, 2012, 02:28 PM
(#20)
TheLangolier's Avatar
Since: Jun 2010
Posts: 13,512
(Head Trainer)
Quote:
Originally Posted by holdemace486 View Post
i then will return fresh headed and focused with a fresh BR enough to avoid the microstakes,

Play at a level where i feel i should be playing at,and the value of my chips as more meaning to me.
Taking a break and getting your life situation sorted out sounds like a good idea to me.

However when you do return, if this is your plan, I strongly suggest your entire BR be disposable money that won't cause additional life situations when you lose it.


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