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flopping the nuts

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flopping the nuts - Wed Sep 26, 2012, 10:03 AM
(#1)
danan758's Avatar
Since: Feb 2012
Posts: 93
SilverStar
right i flopped the nuts... so checked the flop...... didnt want to scare anyone away

so my question here is should u have made a small bet on the turn if i should have how much

and then someone opened on the river had 1 caller then i raise about pot which was like 1/2 my stack i need u guys to access that also thanks

 
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Wed Sep 26, 2012, 12:00 PM
(#2)
Drarr's Avatar
Since: Jan 2010
Posts: 33
Your aim here shouldn't be not scaring people off here, it should be winning the biggest pot you can.

Against one or two opponents the temptation might be there to check, but with so many people in the pot preflop you can definitely afford to bet the flop. There is a flush and straight draw there plus people will call or raise with a 5 and they may call with overcards. I would bet around half pot here, give or take.

On the turn you are basically in the same as the flop. Sure you're losing if any opponents have a 5 but if that's the case then it's just unavoidable. I would be ideally designing my bet so my opponent could not escape an all-in bet on the river, and they will feel they have the odds to call if they hit their draw or pair their overcard. This would ideally mean that on the river my stack would be less than the pot. The more you feel you will get called on the turn the better for achieving this, but again in this pot around a half pot bet should be enough.

The river should then pretty much play itself, the only spot I would put the breaks on would be if the final 5 came along in which case my hand would likely be dominated with quad 5s and an 8 kicker, but the vast majority you won't need to worry about this. Just get it all in, fist pump, and take down the pot.

But you won't be able to be in this position unless you start to plan your betting on earlier streets, and start building the pot. Remember "big hands, big pots" and accept that in order to maximise your win in these situations over the longterm, you have to hope your opponents either make mistakes or have a hand big enough to go with you.
 
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thanks - Wed Sep 26, 2012, 01:06 PM
(#3)
danan758's Avatar
Since: Feb 2012
Posts: 93
SilverStar
thanks man
i like the way u would approach the hand
with so many in the hand odds are hands like 67s over pairs and flush draws were still in maybe one or two people might call thus generating a bigger pot and playing for stacks by the turn or river

ill keep that in mind in the next situation
but i must admit i was only thinking of my hand in that spot well except for i was hoping an ace hit giving someone a nice fullhouse
had i been thinking of what hands may call here with the correct odds i probably wpuld have played the hand better
 
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Wed Sep 26, 2012, 01:36 PM
(#4)
oriholic's Avatar
Since: Oct 2010
Posts: 751
BronzeStar
Just gotta bet and hope some people stay in. There are enough draws available (67/97/96/64, spades) that even if no one has a 5 you are likely to keep at least one customer. Also, since you could presumably be betting one of those draws, most overpairs probably won't be folding for a single bet. Maybe bet something around 222.

On the turn no pocket pair is folding. Great spot to bet and get value from them. You may lose your flush draw customers, but you actually may get some Ax and Kx peelers. The river is the best card in the deck with so many people still in. Now, no pocket pair is folding, no Ax is folding, most flushes aren't folding (you could be bluffing!) make a nice big raise and watch the chips flow your way.
 
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Wed Sep 26, 2012, 02:30 PM
(#5)
JWK24's Avatar
Since: Jun 2010
Posts: 24,809
(Super-Moderator)
BronzeStar
Hi danan758!

With 88 into a limped family pot, I'm more than happy to limp behind and try to setmine with my pocket pair.

The flop is a great one for me, as I get the 2nd nuts. The nuts here is 55 for quad 5's. While I want to keep as many opps in the hand as possible, I also want to be building a pot here, so that I can get any of the opps that stay all-in on the river. I would make my standard value bet here of 1/2 pot (160). I don't want to bet more or less than my standard amount, as I don't want to tip anyone off to the strength of my hand. There are plenty of hands that should call my bet, 5x, 8x, two overcards, any pocket pair, plus straight or flush draws. Yes, some opps may drop, but I want to be building a pot with what is most likely the best hand. Also, with this many in the pot, anyone drawing to a straight or flush is definitely priced in to try and hit it (little do they know that they are basically drawing dead). Betting the flop also gives anyone that holds 5x the wrong odds to draw to the case 5. I don't want to let someone see a third 5 hit the board without having to pay for it.

The same thing for the turn. Having the 2nd nuts, when it checks to me, I want to make a value bet of my std size again. This will set up an easy river shove and the opp will be very tempted to call it, as the shove will only be a smaller % of the pot size. If one of the opps would lead into me on the turn, then I'm just going to call and look to raise on the river.

On the river, when I get one opp leading into me and another flatting their bet before I act, I want to raise whatever amount I think either or both opps will call. If I would have bet the prior streets, then it's an easy shove here.

Hope this helps and good luck at the tables.

John (JWK24)


Super-Moderator



6 Time Bracelet Winner


 
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thanks guys - Wed Sep 26, 2012, 03:04 PM
(#6)
danan758's Avatar
Since: Feb 2012
Posts: 93
SilverStar
thanks alot will look to implement this in my play and thinking in the future
 

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