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Did I Play This Right?

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Did I Play This Right? - Sun Oct 21, 2012, 10:08 AM
(#1)
Jameisus's Avatar
Since: Jun 2011
Posts: 45
Hey all, thought I'd post a hand for the first time, as it's (for me!) a slightly confusing spot and I'm not sure if I played this correctly.

Sorry, this hand was deleted by its owner

Looking at the stack sizes this was probably a shove or fold pre-flop, I think?

But once it got to the flop, could I / should I have folded this?

And was my all-in too aggressive? My think was he calls with any club which I'm beating, and JJ / TT / poss 99 etc.

Any thoughts would be highly appreciated!
 
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Sun Oct 21, 2012, 10:24 AM
(#2)
Croyd93's Avatar
Since: Jul 2011
Posts: 639
**Moved as hand analysis was requested**

Hi Jameisus,

Welcome to the Pokerschoolonline. Here is an overview of the site that will help you get to know the place a bit better.

I'm not a hand analyser so you should probably wait for some more experienced input however I will give you my opinions on the hand.

Starting with pre flop, although you have a strong hand I would not actually 3 bet in this spot for a few reasons.

1) The original raiser may be isolating on the UTG limper with quite a wide range, by 3-betting you will often fold out hands you dominate.

2) By 3 betting you may scare the fish out of the pot which you don't want. He's limped UTG and is playing an unconventional stack which tells you a lot about him, you want him in the pot.

3) If you get 4bet it puts you in a pretty bad spot where you should probably fold, this is why I like flatting as I think our hand is good enough to see a flop with.

You did 3bet and then villain 1 4bet really small this is why I would have just flatted, unfortunately I now think we have to let this one go as often a min raise is a sign of a monster at these stakes.

You called and flopped TPTK, given that there is an SPR lower than 1 I think your shove is fine, he can call with lots of worse hands, he can definately call with lots of hands that are ahead of you but I think he also calls with worse. Given all the money already in the middle and his short starting stack I'm getting it in. However I would have played preflop more conservatively.

Best of luck.

Oliver.


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Last edited by Croyd93; Sun Oct 21, 2012 at 10:35 AM..
 
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Sun Oct 21, 2012, 11:01 AM
(#3)
Jameisus's Avatar
Since: Jun 2011
Posts: 45
I see what you're saying, I guess my thought was I'm out of position against two players, which I've developed a strong fear of!

Thanks for the prompt friendly reply
 
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Sun Oct 21, 2012, 11:11 AM
(#4)
Ovalman's Avatar
Since: Feb 2011
Posts: 1,778
The small blind should be where your losing $$$ from.

I'm also not reraising but I think you'll still lose this hand no matter how it's played. Many loose aggressive's get married to their hands, he seen the flush draw and no matter what his chips were going in.

It's not much consolation be happy you got your chips in ahead.
 
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Sun Oct 21, 2012, 12:17 PM
(#5)
loveaphrodit's Avatar
Since: Sep 2012
Posts: 4
well at first

when you raise at preflop, blind is 0.01 so

3 times is good, you bet 0.18.

then your opponent go bet raise 0.30

then you raise 0.57

well so what do you mean by this?
you did good play did not you...

opponent was just lucky,

and you had 2 chance to fold in the game, but you would not.

that's all about it.

 
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Sun Oct 21, 2012, 03:23 PM
(#6)
TheLangolier's Avatar
Since: Jun 2010
Posts: 13,511
(Head Trainer)
Hi Jame! Welcome and thanks for jumping into the hand analysis forum Will take a look at this one right now.


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Sun Oct 21, 2012, 03:31 PM
(#7)
TheLangolier's Avatar
Since: Jun 2010
Posts: 13,511
(Head Trainer)
Given that we are up against a fish (short stack, plus poorly sized preflop raise that will not be successful in isolating very often), I actually do like 3-betting. Oliver has nice points about inviting the other weak players in with a flat call, but in this case I'm not really eager to play a multi-way pot out of position with AQ when I think we can profitably get it in with a 44 bb stack pre who is just splashing around a lot here. So I think the 3b is good (flatting is not bad or anything, I just think this is a decent spot to 3b iso the short stacker for value). I would actually 3b bigger than .18c... although that's 3x his bet size, his I would really like to discourage the limper from coming along as we'll be out of position, and force the shorty to totally commit himself if he continues, which I fully expect he will (and if he folds that's fine as well). .22-.24c I like a bit better here. And once he 4-bets I would just put him in pre, sometimes we run into a monster but there are plenty of weaker hands in his range, and the whole point of 3-betting here was to get this result so it's all good. Obv he's even wider than I'd have thought, showing up with JTo, but these weak short stackers make awful plays like this a lot, which is why there's nice value in iso'ing the guy with AQ.

Post flop, as played, I'd just check and let him put himself in. He's sure to c-bet jam his entire range I'd think, it gives him a chance to stack off hands that are drawing super bad and might fold to your jam, stuff like AdTd or 4d4s. He can definitely call your jam with worse, but it may restrict his "get it in" range to hands that have reasonable equity and better hands, where as since he was the final preflop aggressor, just letting him bomb the rest in for you gets all those same hands in the middle, but also adds some hands that are totally smashed and shove as a pure bluff.


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Mon Oct 22, 2012, 02:41 AM
(#8)
Jameisus's Avatar
Since: Jun 2011
Posts: 45
Thanks for all the info everyone, really appreciate it, I guess what I can learn is the hand could have been played worse, and perhaps most interestingly I could have waited for the shove or called / raised any bet on the flop instead of shoving to bring his bluffs into the range (my thinking was actually something like 'this is too easily the best hand, I'm not folding this so I'm shoving it so I don't get bluffed')

Again, thanks for all the advice!
 
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Mon Oct 22, 2012, 11:35 AM
(#9)
TheLangolier's Avatar
Since: Jun 2010
Posts: 13,511
(Head Trainer)
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jameisus View Post
(my thinking was actually something like 'this is too easily the best hand, I'm not folding this so I'm shoving it so I don't get bluffed')
Right, but here's the key... Once you have made your commitment decision and know you are committing to stacking off because you think it will be profitable to do so long term (which it clearly is here on the flop), then by definition you can no longer be bluffed out by a shove. In fact if you decide it's profitable to get it in then you actually welcome the shove as it helps you realize this profit. The only question now becomes how to maximize, by shoving yourself or letting him shove. Vs. a loose-passive calling station type we should shove ourselves. In this spot we're up against a short stacking, spewing aggressor, I think we maximize by leaving him in the lead and letting him ship the rest in on his misses (as well as all the hands that would have called our shove anyway).


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