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Set mining at 10NL 6-Max ZOOM - flop set

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Set mining at 10NL 6-Max ZOOM - flop set - Thu Dec 06, 2012, 10:39 AM
(#1)
EdinFreeMan's Avatar
Since: Feb 2010
Posts: 4,540
With pocket fives and reasonable implied odds I set mine in a ZOOM 6-max hand and hit with an Ace and King also on the flop - so I hope to get paid off



How do I best get paid? And in what, if any, circumstances, do I get out?

Ed


4 Time Bracelet Winner


 
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Getting paid for your set - Fri Dec 14, 2012, 07:29 PM
(#2)
Klumn's Avatar
Since: Dec 2011
Posts: 31
For a set to get paid you really need one of two things to happen.
Your Villain to have a strong but second best hand that he is willing to fight you with or . . .
He tries to bluff or bully you out of the pot.

Sets get paid when the Villain has a hand to play back at you with. when he doesn't have it and is unwilling to bluff you; you can't force him to give you a pay-off. [It's like having the bullets in the big blind and getting folded to; nothing you can do]

Lets see the hand from his seat. He is opening from the button and as such his range is usually wide. If he was trying to steal with trash he isn't going to put anymore in there.

You check it to him and he checks it back. No Cbet when he could easily have represented a hand but he didn't. Why?

His hand was strong pre-flop but he fears the Ace and King on the flop and wants to get out.
He has one of the gutshot straight draws and choosese the free card. QJ, JT, QT
He has a strong hand and is trying to slowplay YOU. possible he has one of the monster sets but don't let this concern you. It isn't likely enough to worry about.


I see a few option for you to try to get more money but ultimately if he is unwilling to put more chips in you can't have his chips.
Bet now! about 70% of the pot if he has a draw he might call this unprofitable bet. If he thinks he is trapping YOU this might cause him to spring his trap and you can come over the top.
Check! and see what he does. If he takes a stab at the pot you are on your way to a better payday. If he checks back he could be taking another free card or just has nothing.
River: Q, J or T reduce the value of your hand a tiny bit but don't think they make it worthless
If you do get checked back to you have some river options: Make a bluff looking bet that he might try to snap off with mid pair.
Wait and see if he tries to bluff or bet the river. I don't really recommend this but if he isn't going to bet he isn't going to and you have limited control.

I feel the best option is to bet the turn: If he is drawing; make him pay before he knows he has missed. If he wants to see a showdown with a mid-strength hand; he will call it hoping for a cheep river. If he feels his hand isn't strong enough to call it was unlikely that you would get more chip anyway.

At the end of the hand . . . sometimes you can't force a payday for your big hand.
 
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Mon Jan 07, 2013, 03:13 PM
(#3)
ArtySmokesPS's Avatar
Since: Oct 2011
Posts: 7,346
I'd expect a villain to c-bet that flop almost always, and woudl go for the check-raise. If he had air, you were never going to get more than the c-bet anyway.
Since he checks, I'd bet the turn, hoping to get called by random pairs and draws.
About the only times you should consider folding a flopped set at these limits is when there is a 4-straight or 4-flush on the board. Even sometimes on "scary" boards, you'll get paid of by 2 pairs. The 8 turn on this board is such a blank that I don't think I'm folding on any river card, except maybe the Qd, Jd or Td if villain raises my river bet. (When there are flush AND straights possible on the river, villain is seldom raising without a hand that beats trips).
 
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Tue Jan 15, 2013, 11:37 AM
(#4)
Acombfosho's Avatar
Since: Jun 2010
Posts: 56
Really unlikely you are getting paid off here.

First of all, his range is wide as he has the BTN. Therefore, I like 3betting pre as all low pocket pairs play terribly OOP as they miss the flop too much. Moreover, calling preflop only to check fold most flops is pretty bad in this spot longterm.

Next, we can bet this flop out and expect any gutter, draw or pair of any kind to continue. We need to get value.

The turn changes nothing given my line I am advocating, but in your line shown here he can literally have anything as all he did was open the 40% of hands he would open preflop and then checked the flop. He can improve with lots of hands here on this turn with equity like diamonds and straight draws aswell as a hand like pocket 8s which wouldn't be betting the flop for value which now have you crushed (although this is very unlikely). Most likely is he still has trash and you bet the turn and he simply folds. when he calls he has a hand with decent equity and strong implied odds for a bigger bet on a later street with position..

I doubt you are getting paid off, and even if you do it will for one street and be with a hand like KT trying to bluff catch a small bluff bet.

I would suggest that you should have played every street differently so far.
 
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Mon Mar 04, 2013, 07:38 PM
(#5)
nanonoko's Avatar
nanonoko
(nanonoko)
Since: Jun 2010
Posts: 350
Supernova
depends on what you think your opponent's check on the flop means. it seems after he checks this flop though that you aren't going to win a huge pot which happens. just because you flop a set doesn't mean you deserve to win a huge pot. if you think he'll consider bluffing later then by all means check to him again but if you think he's just looking to get to showdown for free then maybe consider betting out here to protect your hand even against hands that have low equity against you like a bigger pocket pair or a gutshot.

Last edited by nanonoko; Thu Apr 10, 2014 at 08:58 PM..
 

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