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was i a fish?

was i a fish? - Tue Dec 11, 2012, 05:00 PM
kingkong263's Avatar
Since: Jul 2010
Posts: 175
Sorry, this hand was deleted by its owner
Tue Dec 11, 2012, 05:21 PM
JDean's Avatar
Since: Aug 2010
Posts: 3,145
It is hard to say...

- If the opp is extremely tight, and/or loathe to bet 3 streets without a BIG hand, then yeah you are a fish here.

- If the opp is on the bluffy side, and will bluff bet 3 streets a decent amount of time, no you aren't a fish.

All I can really say is you MIGHT want to take a look at some of the videoes on committment decisions.

You played your over pair here pretty passively, and got yourself into a spot where you were calling off your stack. If the opp is very bluffy this might be ok, but far more often you should be recognizing earlier that you COULD be running into a situation where you hold a good, but 2nd best hand,. In that spot your calls are giving you only 1 way to win.

Also, if the opp had a WORSE hand here he might have stopped betitng (thus costing you value), and if the opp had a BETTER hand, you are putting so much in on calls you are sticking yourself hard. So checking out some of the great videoes available might clear up some stuff!

Hope it helps.

Tue Dec 11, 2012, 05:45 PM
kingkong263's Avatar
Since: Jul 2010
Posts: 175
true i shoulded the turn when he bet, i cant remember the players stats, what vids are you talking about ? and yes on turn i was commited so i should have raised and got it in or folded . no reason to be a calling station there. ty for helping me clear that up
Wed Dec 12, 2012, 03:22 AM
geoVARTA's Avatar
Since: Oct 2010
Posts: 1,306
I'm happy to be folding JJ pre here.
You are open raising UTG, and getting 3bet from CO. You are only getting raised here with premiums since UTG opens are percieved to be the tightest opening range (which they should be) unless villain has a high 3bet vs UTG stat.
Against a range of: JJ+, AK, your Jacks have 36% equity.

Being OOP position also makes it hard for you to know where you are at in the hand.

If you do decide to call pre. I would have rather donk bet that flop and folded to a raise.

I'm more inclined to fold pre.
Wed Dec 12, 2012, 07:01 AM
kingkong263's Avatar
Since: Jul 2010
Posts: 175
i was calling 4 a set . but then i got stupid
Wed Dec 12, 2012, 10:49 AM
TheLangolier's Avatar
Since: Jun 2010
Posts: 13,517
(Head Trainer)
Hi kingkong,

First you will tend to get more useful feedback if you include any reads you have... here you provided none but in reply to JDean indicated you did have some when you said you forgot what his stats were (if you are using a stat tracker you can't forget since they're available to you anytime... if not then I recommend noting any reads after the hand when you plan to post for evaluation).

In a vacuum, folding to this 3b is not a bad option like geo said. I realize it feels really nitty to consider folding but this is not a spot we can play profitably without reads or initiative out of position. We could continue profitably against certain opponent types and with certain reads, and taylor our line accordingly, but without any read I have no idea how to do that.

On the flop I think donking out is a nice option. As played I would check-call 1 street, and generally fold to a 2nd solid barrel on the turn. Definitely am folding to a 3-barrel, we're not beating anything in his value range at this point so we're only bluff catching, and most opponents aren't 3-barrel bluffing in micro-stakes. Any of this could change with reads, but without any it's very easy to be a bit lost as to how to proceed in the best (and in a profitable) manner... which is why folding pre to the 3b is not a bad option.

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