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Zoom poker.

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Zoom poker. - Mon Dec 17, 2012, 04:35 PM
(#1)
Guyguyson's Avatar
Since: Nov 2012
Posts: 114
Is there something I'm missing? It's like no one will ever continue in a hand with anything less than two pair. Should I only be playing AA,KK,suited aces,suited connectors and set mining with all other pocket pairs? Everything else always seems to be beat, no one ever calls post flop without an overpair or two pair. Is this what your supposed to do when playing zoom? So most of your profits come from people who think TPTK is good and non showdown winnings?
 
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Tue Dec 18, 2012, 08:02 AM
(#2)
Sentras's Avatar
Since: Dec 2010
Posts: 122
In zoom most players open tighter because they can fold instantly up to a decent hand. This way giving the hands they do play a bigger edge towards a normal opening like in cashgames. However they will be blinding out alot.

It's true you'll only lose a big pot if you are willing to get it in with top pair. Try to potcontrol in these spots. If they reraise you you are lost!

They indeed setmine only with Pocketpairs. Mostly as above state an instant reraise. So don't be afraid to get away from AA's multiways or even heads up.


Your profit shuold come from alot of small pots, which they give up when they miss flops, or dont hit sets. And big pots when they bluff or call you down light. At least thats what I think. There are enough fish out there that will pay you out weak.
 
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Tue Dec 18, 2012, 12:25 PM
(#3)
Guyguyson's Avatar
Since: Nov 2012
Posts: 114
The reverse implied odds for premium hands in zoom almost makes them unplayable if someone calls a c bet i'm almost always beat. People keep limp calling with speculative hands like suited aces and connectors but also trash like k2o and Q8o in the space of 20 hands I had aces cracked twice to flopped two pair and queens cracked when they called with 87s and an 8 came on the flop and another on the turn. I never get raised in these spots they just check call to showdown or maybe put out a half pot bet on the river if you check the turn. I hardly ever get raised by made hands and when I do get check raised or re raised it's mostly a bluff.

Should I be limping and flatting or minraising with speculative hands and trash when I have position hoping to trap someone with aces or kings because that seems to be what everyone else does, also I hardly ever see fish in zoom the closest I see are the reg shortackers who shove 22+ Aj+ the others seem to be 100bb regs who like doing the above trapping or nit regs who will only shove preflop with AA and set mine with everything else.

I've played 12k hands of zoom and I can't remember the last time a value bet with TPTK didn't have reverse implied odds if called.
 
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Tue Dec 18, 2012, 01:04 PM
(#4)
Sentras's Avatar
Since: Dec 2010
Posts: 122
Well your example of AA's is really on a small scale tbh. Normally you should be fine. You might have a little downswing.

How I would counter that play is start raising limper bigger. And make a C-bet of 60% pot. Depending on the board I'd keep betting.

But indeed I play AA KK's really carefully postflop and fold them alot. I only really value them preflop. Zoom is way different than cashgames. You'll have to find your vibe I geuss. All I can say is:

- Dont' overplay AA KK QQ postflop, and for that reason and TPTK. Unless preflop alot of money went in.
- Don't get yourself in marginal spots where you can be outkicked.
- See cheap multiway flops with strong flopping hands.

It's really hard explaining how to play it just on threads. But make sure you start writing down tendesees and plays they make.
 
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Tue Dec 18, 2012, 01:43 PM
(#5)
Sandtrap777's Avatar
Since: Jun 2010
Posts: 3,310
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sentras View Post
But indeed I play AA KK's really carefully postflop and fold them alot. I only really value them preflop.
Really, and you want to teach people how to play...LOL
 
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Tue Dec 18, 2012, 01:50 PM
(#6)
Sentras's Avatar
Since: Dec 2010
Posts: 122
Sandtrap, may I remind you you are playing higher stakes than 5NL.
And I think you minsinterprated my sentence there.

But then again against such arrogancy I don't feel like explaining.

All I try is help. In the end why don't you concider posting yuor opinion instead of being negative. You might actually help Guyguyson.

Last edited by Sentras; Tue Dec 18, 2012 at 01:56 PM..
 
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Tue Dec 18, 2012, 02:01 PM
(#7)
Sandtrap777's Avatar
Since: Jun 2010
Posts: 3,310
NO Sentras, let me remind you that I also play 5NL and 10NL once a week for a club.

Also let me remind you that you did say "But indeed I play AA KK's really carefully postflop and fold them alot. I only really value them preflop." It doesn't matter if you're playing 2NL, you shouldn't fold them alot, but rarely.

Good Luck
 
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Tue Dec 18, 2012, 02:12 PM
(#8)
Sentras's Avatar
Since: Dec 2010
Posts: 122
Fair enough this is how I play them exactly:

Raise them 3x any position. 3/4bet them also 3x times.
In a 3/bet pot I'm not going away from it unless I have a specific read.

when normally played (3x + call) or when isolating a limper. I bet it 70/80% pot sized bet. Obviously you gotta keep an eye on the board. If you get check raised, I tend on folding everytime on a dry board. On an extremely wet board I concider getting it in. Depending on the reads I have or tendensees of the players.

Playing 100BB pots in reraised pots, you lose alot more with AA than you win. And I mean ALOT more. Thats my experience of it.

Multiways pot I Cbet 60% and really have no hard time folding to checkraises from SB / BB.


This way of playing AA is really exploitable. I know but then I got the comfort of my notes on how they play postflop. I note how they play eevry time and adapt according. I don't yet use a hud like you.

So obviously with the cautiously I meant depending on their aggression. But if you don't fold AA's please be willing to share your insight.
 
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Tue Dec 18, 2012, 02:21 PM
(#9)
Sandtrap777's Avatar
Since: Jun 2010
Posts: 3,310
I just went through my stats for the year

I played 380,000 hands this year, got AA 1,654 times and won 94.74% of the time. Got KK 1,701 times and won 91.95% of the time. Should you really be folding them a lot??

If you have a software such as PT3 or HM2, look at your stats

You're right I should be answering guyguy, but I'm no pro. I could give my opinion, but again, I could be totally wrong. Dave or Garreth or Felix, would be better of answering his questions

I tried helping by giving my opinion a few times, but because my answers are not always by the book, I stopped. But will correct false statements sometimes.

Sorry if I offended you, Good Luck
 
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Tue Dec 18, 2012, 02:33 PM
(#10)
Sentras's Avatar
Since: Dec 2010
Posts: 122
Ye sorry I often just try helping. And get annoyed if people complain instead of trying to help which has no benefit for the starter of this thread.

I'm only playing poker for over 2years. I'm profitable and thats all I know. I don't play by the book either. I started playing by the book and then adapted it to my style, on how my play makes the most profit.

And about those stats. Those %'s should be correct. I think mine are about the same. Maybe a little lower. In a month I'll let you know, what mine are. But remember you take the pot down uncontested most of the times

And the times I get reraised (as a situation I explained earlier) is pretty rare. Certainly in zoom. They are so tight, so you don't really have multiway pots that often with AA's compared to others.

And I know the pro's or experienced players should probably be better insights to the matter. And I couldn't agree more. But they are busy people to. Thats why I try to help, and I do it to the best extend I can. With blogs, forumposts etc

Just like in your 2012goal. You give your insight And I enjoyed reading that alot aswell. And for sure didn't agree every time with you play ^^
 
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Tue Dec 18, 2012, 03:08 PM
(#11)
Guyguyson's Avatar
Since: Nov 2012
Posts: 114
2nl zoom is mostly full of uber nit regs who wont shove with anything less than two pair, some loose short stackers who sometimes shove 22+ AK,AQ and a few fish who sometimes shove 22+ or ATC. Other than that it comes down to HUD stats, 3 bet people who have high PFR and 4 bet those with high 3 bet stats etc, slowly win small pot after small pot and stack aces, kings and sometimes TPTK when you finally hit a set or better. Everyone slow plays everything value betting is always value owning even thin value never seems to work out if I have jacks they have queens, if I have 3's they have 4's etc this has happened so often in zoom it sometimes feels like pokerstars shuffle algorithm is screwed up. But i'm probably just not adapting right or am uncomfortable with being that nitty.
 

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