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Question about multi-tabling.

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Question about multi-tabling. - Sun Jan 13, 2013, 05:37 AM
(#1)
Shodan388's Avatar
Since: Sep 2011
Posts: 75
Hey,

I am considering playing more than one table at a time; (I have played more than one at a time before, though not regularly).

My question is this : I've noticed that I've made some good calls / reads when playing just the one table, and I don't think I would have been so inclined to have made that call if I was juggling several tables (time / pressure constraints). For anyone here that plays more than one table regularly, do you find that you're more likely to avoid these marginal decision situations, or not?

Thanks.
 
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Sun Jan 13, 2013, 08:46 AM
(#2)
Ovalman's Avatar
Since: Feb 2011
Posts: 1,778
Notes, notes, notes!

You should only multi table when you can't avoid it or you know all your basics and can play profitable poker.

Try not to get your games to clash ie. don't be playing a league game and then start up a $1 tourney at the same time. If you can't avoid it then try and make as many notes as you can.

Some quick tips, if possible buy Holdem Manager or Poker Tracker and use the HUD supplied. Make notes on players and their holdings, a note is your best friend on players. I also use Table Ninja which automates a lot of the processes for multi tabling.

You can also use software to position your tables to make decisions easier, for instance I have table ninja set up where it places my final tables separate from my other tables. I can then give them better focus than my other games.
 
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Sun Jan 13, 2013, 09:36 AM
(#3)
Shodan388's Avatar
Since: Sep 2011
Posts: 75
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ovalman View Post
Notes, notes, notes!

You should only multi table when you can't avoid it or you know all your basics and can play profitable poker.

Try not to get your games to clash ie. don't be playing a league game and then start up a $1 tourney at the same time. If you can't avoid it then try and make as many notes as you can.

Some quick tips, if possible buy Holdem Manager or Poker Tracker and use the HUD supplied. Make notes on players and their holdings, a note is your best friend on players. I also use Table Ninja which automates a lot of the processes for multi tabling.

You can also use software to position your tables to make decisions easier, for instance I have table ninja set up where it places my final tables separate from my other tables. I can then give them better focus than my other games.
Thanks for the reply.

I'm not sure what you meant in the first paragraph by 'you can't avoid it'.

I am profitable and believe I have a good grasp of the basics, though I haven't yet really ventured into using a table tracker. Are these hard to use? I've tried a few free trials before, but they did seem fairly complicated to me.

Cheers.
 
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Sun Jan 13, 2013, 09:54 AM
(#4)
Ovalman's Avatar
Since: Feb 2011
Posts: 1,778
Don't purposely schedule games if they clash. If you like playing say a daily dollar game and also like SnGs then keep the 2 separate and don't play them at the same time. It will confuse you.

A HUD is essential but you're right they are pretty complicated and it's a skill in itself learning to use one. It took me roughly a year to use mine properly and I'm still learning. Saying that I can now 10 table at a decent ROI so it's worth the effort. There's no way I could achieve that with no HUD.

I still keep loads of notes, a HUD can only help you so far. I note things like "K2s utg (under the gun), then no fold bp (bottom pair) to a pb (pot bet) on f (flop)."

A year ago I could 4 table, now I can play 10. As I said you need to be confident in your own ability because if you lose overall then you're just multiplying those losses quicker by multi tabling.

I would start by Tiling tables if I were you but if you have any more than 4-6 open then it's better to cascade. I currently cascade but stacking seems to be my next step. You have only so much room on your screen so you really have to think about using it wisely.

Take things small steps at a time, if you try and do too much then your game will suffer.
 
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Sun Jan 13, 2013, 09:58 AM
(#5)
Shodan388's Avatar
Since: Sep 2011
Posts: 75
Thanks, dude. I will continue to, as you say, take things one step at a time. One thing about my game, is that I am systematic and disciplined.
 
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Sun Jan 13, 2013, 12:34 PM
(#6)
RockerguyAA's Avatar
Since: Feb 2011
Posts: 1,089
BronzeStar
I like to play 8-12 tables of NL 6-max at a time (micros). It gets harder and harder to read players with each table you add. In my experience I would not try multitabling without a HUD at around 7 or more tables. Also if you prefer to stack the tables rather than tile you should be more inclined to use a HUD.

To answer your question, for me I would say 'sometimes'. I often don't allocate a lot of my concentration and time to smaller decisions. So if a small decision is a tough one in a marginal situation, I will often just take the least-risk option and check or fold. With bigger decision where much of my stack is at risk, I am able to isolate a specific table (I stack my tables) and spend as much time and concentration as I need to make a tough decision. This strategy can result in some small mistakes though while the majority of my concentration is temporarily focused towards one table.

Also, I prefer tiling tables if playing 6 or less. You can get better reads as you can see the action in context. More than 6 I change to a style I learned from Frosty's videos here on the PSO of stacking all the tables in center and using hotkeys to move tables to the corners of the screen as needed. It is a much more efficient style, but you do lose a lot of reading ability due to the loss of context. I would only try this style with the help of a HUD.
 
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Sun Jan 13, 2013, 01:21 PM
(#7)
Shodan388's Avatar
Since: Sep 2011
Posts: 75
Quote:
Originally Posted by RockerguyAA View Post
I like to play 8-12 tables of NL 6-max at a time (micros). It gets harder and harder to read players with each table you add. In my experience I would not try multitabling without a HUD at around 7 or more tables. Also if you prefer to stack the tables rather than tile you should be more inclined to use a HUD.

To answer your question, for me I would say 'sometimes'. I often don't allocate a lot of my concentration and time to smaller decisions. So if a small decision is a tough one in a marginal situation, I will often just take the least-risk option and check or fold. With bigger decision where much of my stack is at risk, I am able to isolate a specific table (I stack my tables) and spend as much time and concentration as I need to make a tough decision. This strategy can result in some small mistakes though while the majority of my concentration is temporarily focused towards one table.

Also, I prefer tiling tables if playing 6 or less. You can get better reads as you can see the action in context. More than 6 I change to a style I learned from Frosty's videos here on the PSO of stacking all the tables in center and using hotkeys to move tables to the corners of the screen as needed. It is a much more efficient style, but you do lose a lot of reading ability due to the loss of context. I would only try this style with the help of a HUD.
Thanks for your input.

When you say 'HUD', I take it you mean something like a table manager?
 
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Sun Jan 13, 2013, 01:37 PM
(#8)
Ovalman's Avatar
Since: Feb 2011
Posts: 1,778
A HUD is a Heads Up Display. Its an app that attaches itself to a table and tells you past histories on a player. It tells you things like how often they enter a pot and how often they raise. From this info you can gauge the type of player you are up against.

It won't tell you what hands they play but it will give you an indication on their range, for example I had a player with a 2% PFR, this normally indicates they only raise with AA and KK only but they raise with J2o. Totally strange and why you should combat a HUD with notes as well.
 
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Mon Jan 14, 2013, 09:36 AM
(#9)
Shodan388's Avatar
Since: Sep 2011
Posts: 75
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ovalman View Post
A HUD is a Heads Up Display. Its an app that attaches itself to a table and tells you past histories on a player. It tells you things like how often they enter a pot and how often they raise. From this info you can gauge the type of player you are up against.

It won't tell you what hands they play but it will give you an indication on their range, for example I had a player with a 2% PFR, this normally indicates they only raise with AA and KK only but they raise with J2o. Totally strange and why you should combat a HUD with notes as well.
Thanks.
Speaking of strange ranges, yesterday, someone went all in against my KK with 85o/s...and hit a straight on the river.


Btw, what is the difference between tiling and stacking tables?

I assume I need to purchase something like TableNinja or HoldemManager to get hold of a HUD app?
 
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Mon Jan 14, 2013, 09:55 AM
(#10)
wiltshireman's Avatar
Since: Aug 2010
Posts: 1,572
(Moderator)
If you decide to get Holdem Manager as you UHD software, dont forget that the self analysis tools it has are also essential learning tools.

I believe that Holdem Manager are offering a free trial, just go to their site and download, if you like after the trial you can purchase.

http://http://www.holdemmanager.com/


Moderator
 
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What i use... - Tue Jan 15, 2013, 02:56 AM
(#11)
etipac's Avatar
Since: Nov 2011
Posts: 116
Best of all my friend is to have a hud like Holdem Manager 2.. take notes and open a 2nd table and so on a 3 rd after some more notes... when you have a lot press Ctrl9.

Effective notes
Hud
Elimination of mobile, Facebook, and other things are a musttttttttttttttttttttttttttt!!!!!!
Nutrition
Break every 45/60mins
And check whom you can bluff or play position against.


For best results to know what's happening don't play more than 4 tables or you ll get into stupid spots.

Last week I opened by mistake too many tables at once and ended up call down to showdown with a pair of Kings when he had 4of a kind!!!!!

Remember that a penny not spent is a penny saved!!!

Hope I was a bit helpful.

Etienne
 
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Tue Jan 15, 2013, 02:01 PM
(#12)
ArtySmokesPS's Avatar
Since: Oct 2011
Posts: 7,359
A HUD is pretty much mandatory if you plan on playing 20,000 hands or more in the next 6 months, but 2-tabling without one shouldn't be too difficult, especially if you play full ring (9-handed). Unless you're very loose (bad), then you'll rarely have more than 2 live hands at the same time. And even when you do, you actually have a lot more time to think about the hand than you think. (Timebank exists for a reason).
While you have 2 tables open, try and get good notes on one of them, and use the hand replayer so you can see what got shown down on the other table. Good luck!
 
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Tue Jan 15, 2013, 02:44 PM
(#13)
Shodan388's Avatar
Since: Sep 2011
Posts: 75
Thank you both very much for your advice.
 
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Multi-Tabling - Wed Jan 16, 2013, 03:45 PM
(#14)
ImpactPoint's Avatar
Since: Jan 2012
Posts: 213
Multi-tabling,

Always a hot topic, for me it depends on a few points.

1) what game your playing.
2) what is your goal.
3) comfort level.
4) keep atrack on amount of tables v hourly rate.
 
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Sun Jan 20, 2013, 04:07 AM
(#15)
kallindown's Avatar
Since: Jan 2010
Posts: 27
I play around 20 tables at the lowest stake and have kept profitable by dropping the worst 25-30% of the worst of my starting hands and emphasis on position.

Im no expert but if you need any specific advice just ask and will do my best to help or at least point you in the right direction (there are 3 great vids on here from frosty about mass multi tabling if this is the direction you are heading)
 
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Tue Jan 22, 2013, 06:40 PM
(#16)
Shodan388's Avatar
Since: Sep 2011
Posts: 75
Quote:
Originally Posted by kallindown View Post
I play around 20 tables at the lowest stake and have kept profitable by dropping the worst 25-30% of the worst of my starting hands and emphasis on position.

Im no expert but if you need any specific advice just ask and will do my best to help or at least point you in the right direction (there are 3 great vids on here from frosty about mass multi tabling if this is the direction you are heading)
Very interesting post. I'm assuming you play very tight? I can see how someone might play more tables that way (no marginal hands at all, so something like A-rag suited on the cut off?)

I'll watch those frosty videos before I start playing tomorrow. Thanks for the offer of help, I may well take you up on that.

Last edited by Shodan388; Wed Jan 23, 2013 at 06:27 AM..
 

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