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any way to see this coming?

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any way to see this coming? - Tue Feb 26, 2013, 06:18 PM
(#1)
hendo30's Avatar
Since: Sep 2012
Posts: 101

Last edited by hendo30; Tue Feb 26, 2013 at 06:20 PM..
 
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Tue Feb 26, 2013, 09:21 PM
(#2)
lostsoulpart's Avatar
Since: Oct 2012
Posts: 2
man that's pretty harsh and it makes it worse that it was rivered! At least your hand was fairly earned from the flop position,

Lostsoulpart.
 
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Tue Feb 26, 2013, 11:30 PM
(#3)
ForrestFive's Avatar
Since: May 2011
Posts: 2,036
Hi hendo30,

Any way to see this coming? Probably no. But...

1) I prefer to 3-bet KQs because we are oop and a better hand may call or 4-bet - so we know now hand ranges pre-flop playing oop.

2) As played I'm 60/40 to check raise and not lead. We want to see the original raiser in the pot heads up and remove the sb from the equation.


IMO the sb should not have called pre-flop.
 
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Wed Feb 27, 2013, 02:20 PM
(#4)
Guido-bomb's Avatar
Since: Feb 2011
Posts: 545
Hi hendo,

I think you could make your bets bigger, both on flop and turn. I agree with forrest about check raising the flop, but leading is not that bad imo just make your bets bigger since that flop connects with a lot of hands. correct betzing would have prevent this situation and make it +EV if you got all in by the turn.

Agree also, very bad pf call by the sb
 
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Wed Feb 27, 2013, 04:51 PM
(#5)
TheLangolier's Avatar
Since: Jun 2010
Posts: 13,491
(Head Trainer)
Hi Hendo,

I think you know the answer, no chance.

So we have 2 half stackers with no other reads. I would pretty much always flat call here preflop, if we connect in some way we'll look to commit vs. them, if we don't I'd be fine giving up. I think KQs is the exact kind of hand we do not want to 3b preflop here, as we will generally fold out a lot of hands we dominate (Kt, QJ, etc) and get action from a range of hands that KQ does not play well against (AQ, AK, big pairs).

I agree on bigger bet sizing. I would bet at least .15c if not full pot of .18c on the flop... the board is very wet and hits both their ranges well, we will often get action. If we bet .18c and get called, the pot would be .54 and the SB would have .69 behind and we could just put him all in on the turn.

Regarding check-raising if we had a read that V1 cbets a high % I'd definitely do that, but readless I prefer not to risk it and just bet out. The reason is if he checks it through a free card is a disaster, there are so many cards that could coordinate with the board and scare away action. I think it's essential to start getting money in now, and unless I'm pretty confident V1 will get that ball rolling for me, I'll do it myself, it's too important in spots like this to chance imo.

Agree with everyone on the SB's preflop call, it's horrible.


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Thu Feb 28, 2013, 09:11 AM
(#6)
hendo30's Avatar
Since: Sep 2012
Posts: 101
the see it coming thing was all though not the J5 when he calls the flop and turn got to put him on some kind of made hand so when river pairs the bored is that time to check...

thanks for the heads up on the betting will have a look at my bet sizing
 
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Thu Feb 28, 2013, 10:13 AM
(#7)
TheLangolier's Avatar
Since: Jun 2010
Posts: 13,491
(Head Trainer)
Quote:
Originally Posted by hendo30 View Post
when he calls the flop and turn got to put him on some kind of made hand so when river pairs the bored is that time to check...
Not in this case. As you played it the pot contains .78c and he's only got .57 left. While a full house is certainly possible, it's actually not very likely (if he flopped a set for instance he probably raises earlier in the hand), and there are a lot of worse hands that he can hold as well... examples: AJ, KJ, QJ, J8s, 78, Q8s are the strong ones.


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Thu Feb 28, 2013, 07:38 PM
(#8)
nanonoko's Avatar
nanonoko
(nanonoko)
Since: Jun 2010
Posts: 350
Supernova
if you can see that coming then by all means let me know how you can do that! hahaa but all jokes aside, i like betting the river even though the board paired as i think you will have the best hand a lot of the time although I would probably just put him all-in instead on the river to get max value.

Think about it this way too, if he's calling J5 in the sb, then he's probably calling a whole lot of other jacks too like j6 j7 etc which you beat.
 

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