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How to play an overpair

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How to play an overpair - Sun Apr 07, 2013, 01:15 PM
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mike2198's Avatar
Since: Jan 2013
Posts: 1,485
so you got pocket aces and villain raises, you 3 bet him and he calls then shoves all in on the flop, normally vs a good player you might put them on trips or 2 pair but vs a fish do you call or fold?
 
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Sun Apr 07, 2013, 01:19 PM
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Sorry, this hand was deleted by its owner

Here is an example he had a small stack so it was an easy call but vs a big stack im gonna be folding here
 
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Sun Apr 07, 2013, 05:09 PM
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Grade b's Avatar
Since: Jun 2010
Posts: 3,607
Its one of those things that is read dependant, What does your opponent have or at least what range could they have, Do we beat that range or are we crushed.

Against a loose player I'm happy to call if i think they can do this with 1 pair. Against a tight player I am far more curious wanting to get to the river as cheap as possible with 1 pair.

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Sun Apr 07, 2013, 07:16 PM
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ArtySmokesPS's Avatar
Since: Oct 2011
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You're looking for a standard answer when there isn't one. The only correct answer (as with most generic poker strategy questions) is "It depends". Stack sizes are very important, but reads/notes help the decision too. One of the most crucial notes I have on players is how they play their sets. I have things like "donks small with set", "CRAI with set", "slowplays set on wet board" and stuff like that. Those notes have saved me a lot of money.

By the way, most "good" players don't call a 3-bet out of position and then shove the flop, because it misses value when they have the best hand. Bad players might donkshove quite often, but their range for doing so can be quite wide (any pair, any draw, total air) or super narrow (bottom set only).

How I'd play the aces would also depend on the flop texture. If the board was something like 742tt and I have the ace blocker to the flush, I'd be more inclined to call a shove, because I'd be crushing all the overpairs KK-88 (36 combinations) and only be losing to 9 combos that have a set.


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Mon Apr 08, 2013, 03:37 PM
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mike2198's Avatar
Since: Jan 2013
Posts: 1,485
Quote:
Originally Posted by ArtySmokesPS View Post
You're looking for a standard answer when there isn't one. The only correct answer (as with most generic poker strategy questions) is "It depends". Stack sizes are very important, but reads/notes help the decision too. One of the most crucial notes I have on players is how they play their sets. I have things like "donks small with set", "CRAI with set", "slowplays set on wet board" and stuff like that. Those notes have saved me a lot of money.

By the way, most "good" players don't call a 3-bet out of position and then shove the flop, because it misses value when they have the best hand. Bad players might donkshove quite often, but their range for doing so can be quite wide (any pair, any draw, total air) or super narrow (bottom set only).

How I'd play the aces would also depend on the flop texture. If the board was something like 742tt and I have the ace blocker to the flush, I'd be more inclined to call a shove, because I'd be crushing all the overpairs KK-88 (36 combinations) and only be losing to 9 combos that have a set.


Hmm wouldnt that mean you would be calling preety much all the time on a flop like that because you will always have more combos beat with aces than there are trips i can understand if AK10 was on the flop because then you would be beat by alot more combos, so its a good thing to use then and comparing to pot odds
 
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Mon Apr 08, 2013, 04:19 PM
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Grade b's Avatar
Since: Jun 2010
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mike2198 View Post
Hmm wouldnt that mean you would be calling preety much all the time on a flop like that because you will always have more combos beat with aces than there are trips i can understand if AK10 was on the flop because then you would be beat by alot more combos, so its a good thing to use then and comparing to pot odds

Again would depend on the villain type.

Grade b


I am always ready to learn although I do not always like being taught. ~Winston Churchill

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Mon Apr 08, 2013, 04:30 PM
(#7)
ArtySmokesPS's Avatar
Since: Oct 2011
Posts: 7,362
Quote:
Originally Posted by mike2198 View Post
Hmm wouldnt that mean you would be calling preety much all the time on a flop like that because you will always have more combos beat with aces than there are trips i can understand if AK10 was on the flop because then you would be beat by alot more combos, so its a good thing to use then and comparing to pot odds
In general, yes, I'm more likely to stack off with a big overpair on a low board, because there are more combos that I beat.
On 742, I can stack off and be ahead of KK-88, as I said.
On Q97, I'll generally be less likely to stack off, because there is only one other overpair (KK, 5 combos) I beat, but 9 combos (QQ, 99, 77) that have me crushed.

But, as grade b points out, it's villain dependent. I know some nits/tags that would never get it in with JJ on 742. They only raise with sets, so I can fold fairly easily when they let me know I'm beat.

There's also the matter of stack sizes. In a single-raised pot (I open with AA and get called), the pot on the flop is too small for me to commit to stacking off with one pair. But if there's a raise, a call, and then I make a big 3-bet squeeze with AA in the SB, the pot will be very large if I see a flop, and remaining stacks will be relatively small. With 100bb starting stacks, it's rarely a huge mistake to be getting all in on the flop with an overpair in a 3-bet pot, because the stack to pot ratio means villains are similarly committed to trying to win the hand by shoving the flop with any piece of it.


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