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QQ - Fri May 03, 2013, 10:35 AM
(#1)
mike2198's Avatar
Since: Jan 2013
Posts: 1,485


Villain has vp42/23pfr/2af

He was shoving it all in on flop with 2pair plus 3 hands i saw him do this do you think i should be folding a set here?
 
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Fri May 03, 2013, 11:46 AM
(#2)
TheLangolier's Avatar
Since: Jun 2010
Posts: 13,501
(Head Trainer)
I am never folding top set here against this villain as described. Unless I fist pump too much first and accidentally time out.

Edit: You are a 60-40 favorite over 2 pair+

Board: Qc Ts 9h
Dead:

equity win tie pots won pots tied
Hand 0: 59.605% 58.51% 01.10% 30700 575.00 { QhQs }
Hand 1: 40.395% 39.30% 01.10% 20620 575.00 { TT-99, KJs, QTs-Q9s, J8s, T9s, KJo, QTo-Q9o, J8o, T9o }


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Last edited by TheLangolier; Fri May 03, 2013 at 11:49 AM..
 
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Fri May 03, 2013, 11:53 AM
(#3)
Croyd93's Avatar
Since: Jul 2011
Posts: 639
If your read is solid that he has done this 3 times with 2pair+ then I'm never folding. Think about it, there are way more combos of 2 pair, and worse sets that you crush compared KJ and J8.

Against a range of 2 pair, sets and straights we have 60% equity.

Text results appended to pokerstove.txt

52,470 games 0.001 secs 52,470,000 games/sec

Board: Qc Ts 9h
Dead:

equity win tie pots won pots tied
Hand 0: 61.783% 60.76% 01.02% 31880 537.50 { QhQs }
Hand 1: 38.217% 37.19% 01.02% 19515 537.50 { TT-99, KJs, QTs-Q9s, J8s, T9s, KJo, QTo-Q9o, J8o, T9o }


Remember we play against a range not a hand.

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Last edited by Croyd93; Fri May 03, 2013 at 11:56 AM..
 
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Fri May 03, 2013, 11:59 AM
(#4)
Croyd93's Avatar
Since: Jul 2011
Posts: 639
Download pokerstove and play around with ranges when reviewing hands to get yourself familiar with equities for common situations. It's free and Dave has a video in the library to teach you how to use it.


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Fri May 03, 2013, 12:07 PM
(#5)
ArtySmokesPS's Avatar
Since: Oct 2011
Posts: 7,346
Anyone that even thinks about folding top set on the flop 105bb deep needs their head tested, frankly.

I'm going broke with 99 here, let alone queens.


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Fri May 03, 2013, 01:26 PM
(#6)
mike2198's Avatar
Since: Jan 2013
Posts: 1,485
I actually snap called then i thought about the fold button after lol, every time they shove me all in they win.
 
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Fri May 03, 2013, 01:37 PM
(#7)
TheLangolier's Avatar
Since: Jun 2010
Posts: 13,501
(Head Trainer)
Quote:
Originally Posted by mike2198 View Post
I actually snap called then i thought about the fold button after lol, every time they shove me all in they win.
If you use a tracker, filter for this (opponent bets all in, you call) and see your results. It only feels like every time, it's psychological, our brain remembers the pain of the loss more succinctly than the the joy of the win, especially if we got it in good because we were "supposed to win" (in our minds eye).

If you filter for this and find you're losing money, then review the hands... what kind of ranges are various villain types shoving with and what are you calling off with?

Since it's unlikely you have even remotely enough sample size to judge this specific scenario, I'll go out on a limb and guarantee you are making money calling off with top set vs. a wildly aggressive player with reads such as you had, even on coordinated flops.

Although it may not take the specifics of this spot into consideration, if you filter generically for all times you got all in on the flop with top set, you'll wish you could do that a lot more often. (even though you no doubt did not win 100% of those hands, the over all results will be phenomenal)


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Fri May 03, 2013, 02:25 PM
(#8)
mike2198's Avatar
Since: Jan 2013
Posts: 1,485
Ive had these sort of players shoving two pair plus, ive been shoved once by a reg and i had pocket KK on a J high board i posted it up it was on 5nl, i actually folded because of the pre flop action he could of easily made a set of jacks.

I thought about it after and thought he just made a move on me i don't think a good player would shove a $5 stack with the nuts there were no straight or flushes possible, i folded because my stack was to big to lose with my bankroll which was why i went back 2nl even though i was doing decent at 5nl.
 

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