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25NL 6-max zoom: playing AA postflop OOT vs 2 kings on board

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25NL 6-max zoom: playing AA postflop OOT vs 2 kings on board - Fri May 31, 2013, 01:32 PM
(#1)
killcani's Avatar
Since: Jan 2013
Posts: 4
Hi all this will be my first time posting here and hopefully I can get some help with this hand.

I have pretty much no info on him (20/20, 5hands).

First off this is not my usual way of playing AA with this kind of flop but I like to change it up sometimes and thought I could get value from king hands by check-raising the flop. I also did this to possibly make him think i was bluffing and not to have so many people raising me after i check postflop.

When he calls my reraise I am putting him on AK,KQ-(Js maybe) and most small pairs(more likely to raise here with 1010-AA?). After thinking about the flop was my reraise too small? Can he profitibly call his pairs just to hit his 2 outs if I raise this small?.

After the turn came another king I think I was behind his range and was going to check/fold but when he checks aswell how much should I take this as a sign of weakness?. I have seen alot of players slow playing their kings in a spot like this and I think its more likely that he checks than bets with kings especially since if he has kings he will be pretty sure I am bluffing and would fold to a bet.

I was thinking he was going to check his pairs and bet his kings on the river so i was planning to check/fold here as well but his raise was kinda small and I couldnt decide if it was better to call or not.

How often do players bluff on the river in this case? Can I call?.

Last edited by killcani; Fri May 31, 2013 at 01:36 PM.. Reason: Grammar
 
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Fri May 31, 2013, 01:57 PM
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Since: Dec 2010
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Fri May 31, 2013, 02:14 PM
(#3)
TheLangolier's Avatar
Since: Jun 2010
Posts: 13,510
(Head Trainer)
Hi kill,


Several things going on here, nice hand for discussion!

Quote:
First off this is not my usual way of playing AA with this kind of flop but I like to change it up sometimes and thought I could get value from king hands by check-raising the flop. I also did this to possibly make him think i was bluffing and not to have so many people raising me after i check postflop.
I think I would mix it up like this once in a while in a more defined spot. Like against an aggro guy who alwasy bets when checked to... then we can get value from his air as well as an extra street from Kx. As for looking for value from a king, we can get that by just c-betting. And the dynamic consideration (making them think twice about betting light when you check), this doesn't apply so much in zoom, more so at regular tables. V1-4 are probably not even watching, they're on another table already.

Quote:
When he calls my reraise I am putting him on AK,KQ-(Js maybe) and most small pairs(more likely to raise here with 1010-AA?). After thinking about the flop was my reraise too small? Can he profitibly call his pairs just to hit his 2 outs if I raise this small?.

I think his range after calling the raise includes what you said plus TT-QQ... players will sometimes flat these hands (in fact he should be flatting TT not 3-betting here imo). But TT-QQ and AK sometimes flats, sometimes 3-bets pre. He's not getting a correct price to call and hit his 2 outs. He may think it's correct with the 2 outs plus being good some of the time, if the action has successfully confused him.

Quote:
After the turn came another king I think I was behind his range and was going to check/fold but when he checks as well how much should I take this as a sign of weakness?. I have seen alot of players slow playing their kings in a spot like this and I think its more likely that he checks than bets with kings especially since if he has kings he will be pretty sure I am bluffing and would fold to a bet.
I agree with you that a check here doesn't mean weakness. A hand like KQ isn't sure what's going on with your flop line, bluffing? Big pair? etc... but now he beats all of it and doesn't care, so slow plays. Not uncommon.

Quote:
I was thinking he was going to check his pairs and bet his kings on the river so i was planning to check/fold here as well but his raise was kinda small and I couldnt decide if it was better to call or not.

How often do players bluff on the river in this case? Can I call?.
I don't think he's ever bluffing personally. (never say never, but the chance is small I would say). However that doesn't mean we are beat either. The smaller bet sizing can be designed to get paid light, so he can show up with 99-QQ and think he's good and value betting... we did check twice to him after all.

I think given this, and the unorthodox line we took, I'd look him up for this price. Although it is probably close and if so doesn't make a big difference in the long run either way. If close though, I generally like to make the decision that, if wrong, is the smaller mistake. Losing a $3.70 call here is a smaller mistake than folding the best hand in an $11.55 pot.


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Fri May 31, 2013, 02:54 PM
(#4)
killcani's Avatar
Since: Jan 2013
Posts: 4
Quote:
Originally Posted by TheLangolier View Post
The smaller bet sizing can be designed to get paid light, so he can show up with 99-QQ and think he's good and value betting... we did check twice to him after all.
Is it not more common to check 99-QQ in his spot because there's nothing that I can call that he beats?. Or he is counting on me folding a higher pair?.

Last edited by killcani; Fri May 31, 2013 at 03:02 PM..
 
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Fri May 31, 2013, 03:12 PM
(#5)
TheLangolier's Avatar
Since: Jun 2010
Posts: 13,510
(Head Trainer)
Quote:
Originally Posted by killcani View Post
Is it not more common to check 99-QQ in his spot because there's nothing that I can call that he beats?. Or he is counting on me folding a higher pair?.
Some players would check down for that perceived reason. Then again others would think they have the best hand for sure after checked to twice and make a thin value bet to get paid by smaller pairs and ace high. He doesn't know how light you're willing to call here and is confused about your range the way the hand played (assuming he's ranging you).


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