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Late stages $4.50 180 man.

Late stages $4.50 180 man. - Thu Sep 05, 2013, 08:27 PM
chillipops's Avatar
Since: Aug 2011
Posts: 1,090
Hi guys.

I'm not sure if I played this badly or not, I don't like the villain calling my flop shove with no pr but I cant help thinking if I checked the flop and called his semi-bluff I could see the turn I could still get away from it? maybe I'm just over thinking the spot ??


Hand Analysts be as critical as you can please !

Thanks in advance.



Last edited by chillipops; Thu Sep 05, 2013 at 08:28 PM.. Reason: removed bracket
Fri Sep 06, 2013, 01:33 AM
Shichi-77's Avatar
Since: Jul 2012
Posts: 607
I think 4bet shove PF after 3bet is a better game, because of stack size. After calling 3bet you are pot committed.
Fri Sep 06, 2013, 10:33 AM
raccy's Avatar
Since: May 2013
Posts: 130
I don't think there was any way you were going to win that pot.

The way the big stack played was the way they were expected to play. The shove on the turn looked like an attempt to steal the pot so it was an easy call with an AK. It may have looked like you missed the flop and in that case AK would be ahead but even if not, they still had a few outs. They also had the chips to call your shove.

If you want to speculate: 1. Check the flop. The big stack will probably think you missed the flop and shove. The outcome wouldn't change. 2. Shove preflop. I guess there might be some fold equity there but given their stack size, I would expect them to call.

My verdict is that it was just bad luck. I would play aggressively against big stacks but sometimes it comes with a cost.
Sat Sep 07, 2013, 06:59 AM
ChewMe1's Avatar
Since: Jan 2012
Posts: 574
Hey chillipops

This is definitely a shove or fold spot preflop. Calling the 3bet out of position with this stack size is a big leak but as played I'd check shove the flop.
Villain is very likely to either shove the flop or bet an amount which commits him to the pot if you was to reraise all in and by doing this we will get value from hands that villain may fold if we open shove the flop.

Ultimately I think this is a tough one because it's very unlikely that villain is 3betting our UTG+1 raise lightly and we JJ doesn't play too well against most players value range so any reads we have on villain would help tremendously.

Villains call on the flop is standard and it would be a huge mistake for him to fold. You're only shoving a little over a pot sized bet and in his eyes you could be shoving a ton of hands that wiffed the flop so with two overs and a straight draw it's a very easy call.

Cheers, Chris.
Sat Sep 07, 2013, 07:13 AM
GamblingProp's Avatar
Since: Jan 2013
Posts: 714
I think shoving pre is the best line.
I am folding pre only versus a super nitty opponent.
As played on the flop we can't really fold our hand, so shoving or checking to induce a shove are both good.
I would also prefer a check on the flop, but again that is opponent relevant.
Sat Sep 07, 2013, 08:44 AM
McBoomswitch's Avatar
Since: Jul 2013
Posts: 3
You overplayed your pocket pair, you had to figure he had two overs to your hand including the ace so on that board he has a gutshot, two overs to yours and he's already committed to that pot so his always calling that shove. You have to remember that JJ aren't premium pockets so dont play them like they are

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