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QQ facing min3bet preflop vs 180bb deep

QQ facing min3bet preflop vs 180bb deep - Mon Oct 07, 2013, 05:59 AM
morduk666's Avatar
Since: Aug 2011
Posts: 84

Hey A bit uncomfortable spot. Do you think that 4betting so small preflop is a mistake(for keeping weaker holdings in a pot)? What range would you apply for villain with big stack? He was 30/18 AF 0 3b 0 after 76hands. Thanks in advance.
Mon Oct 07, 2013, 06:33 AM
Shichi-77's Avatar
Since: Jul 2012
Posts: 607
You need to know there stats as cold call 3bet and 4bet + pots. V1 hand range is something like AhJh+ , TT-JJ, V2's hand range PP 's and I think it's 55 or TT. I wouldn't cbet OTT , for me it's x/f in a 3way pot. and yes it's mistake 4beting so small against two opps . against one opp I might choose smaller bet sizing .

Last edited by Shichi-77; Mon Oct 07, 2013 at 06:39 AM..
Mon Oct 07, 2013, 12:26 PM
TheLangolier's Avatar
Since: Jun 2010
Posts: 13,476
(Head Trainer)
Hi Morduk,

Since we have no reads, are out of position vs. the 3-bettor, and it's multi-way, I would 4b larger for sure with the QQ or simply flat call. This sizing only serves to bloat the pot and keep them both in, which makes QQ a lot trickier to play on this depth of money and the sizing invites them to take a shot at our stack (for instance, they can profitably set mine with small pairs or take a flyer with suited connectors now). Either call and keep the pot smaller, or 4b to like .35c-.40c. Yes we do want to keep worse hands in the pot and not blow those out, but vs. 2 random unknowns at 2NL I would expect them to call a lot anyway after they had either 3b (V1) or cold called a 3b (V2). I strongly prefer 4-betting here to about .38c, simply because I do think they will call with worse, and if we get 5b I'm pretty comfortable folding QQ going on the assumption that random unknown 2NL players pretty much always have KK+ when they 5-bet, especially this deep stacked.

Post flop your sizings are too small imo, just under half the pot on the flop and only 25% pot on the turn, on a wet board, is sort of asking for trouble. We probably still have the best hand (especially when we don't get raised on the flop).

As played I would get the money in on the turn here when V2 shoves. It seems unlikely V1 has us beat at this point as he's only called twice and not raised. He's probably got a lot of smaller pairs, and AJ+. V2 can easily be shoving with worse hands as well imo since our bet sizings look so weak, we look like AK a lot here just following through I think. If V2's got a set then I guess he's going to stack through me as played. With the sizings I would have chosen his sets would have stacked through me anyway as I'd have been betting an amount on the turn that was an all in wager for V2.

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