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what do you think?

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what do you think? - Thu Oct 10, 2013, 09:27 PM
(#1)
Grade b's Avatar
Since: Jun 2010
Posts: 3,604
http://www.boomplayer.com/en/poker-h...238_0FE515993C

What do you think? Villain 3 was very vocal about how bad villain 1's play was without once thinking that a shove here was a poor move?

The play is from octobers knock out cash tourniment in the PSO series


Grade b


I am always ready to learn although I do not always like being taught. ~Winston Churchill

13 Time Bracelet Winner


 
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Thu Oct 10, 2013, 10:12 PM
(#2)
Sandtrap777's Avatar
Since: Jun 2010
Posts: 3,310
LOL.... that will teach the AK player to go all in
There was no reason for him to go all in
There's lots of plays fish do and that's one of them
And those that lose with AK are the one's that cry

LOL
 
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Thu Oct 10, 2013, 11:22 PM
(#3)
JWK24's Avatar
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Posts: 24,832
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That one defines the term value-owned... you're only going to get called by a better hand.. which they did.

They should have made a standard raise to 3X the previous bet. AK has potential, but overbet shoving, especially an unmade hand.. is a BIG problem.

Villain 1 was ahead. If they had villain 3 labeled as a maniac, it's risky, but it's a hyper turbo.

John (JWK24)


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Fri Oct 11, 2013, 06:48 AM
(#4)
ArtySmokesPS's Avatar
Since: Oct 2011
Posts: 7,355
I can't decide what's worse, to be honest. The shove and the call are both pretty terrible. Shoving AKs is bad, because nothing worse calls. Calling with 22 is bad, because you're only just ahead of AK/AQ, but you're crushed by 33+.
In short, I don't want to be making a big shove when nothing worse calls, and I don't want to be calling when I'm either flipping or crushed. Neither play is +EV in the long run.

That being said, if these guys routinely get it in with a range that is precisely 22+/AK, ace king is the better hand to have. It has 44% equity against 22+/AK, whereas the deuces only have 25%.


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Fri Oct 11, 2013, 07:15 AM
(#5)
GamblingProp's Avatar
Since: Jan 2013
Posts: 714
Shoving AK is enormously more unexploitable than calling a shove with deuces 200BB's deep.
That being said, at least villain 1 made a solid read.
 
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Fri Oct 11, 2013, 08:51 AM
(#6)
Grade b's Avatar
Since: Jun 2010
Posts: 3,604
ty Guys,

It was early and so I didn't have read on villian 3. At first I was little shocked by both hands but mostly by Villians 3 reaction to someone playing 22 when he felt it was ok to Shove AK.

I did get to use the information later to range villian 1 and bust him with JJ against his pocket 44's

was a fun game (finally cash one in October 2nd to Effsea)

Grade b


I am always ready to learn although I do not always like being taught. ~Winston Churchill

13 Time Bracelet Winner


 
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Fri Oct 11, 2013, 03:17 PM
(#7)
Moxie Pip's Avatar
Since: Aug 2010
Posts: 3,853
At this depth of money BOTH plays are terrible.
 
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Fri Oct 11, 2013, 05:12 PM
(#8)
TrustySam's Avatar
Since: Aug 2010
Posts: 8,291
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Hey Moxie, do you have a Full Tilt refund due to come your way? There's a fun thread over at 2+2 of everybody talking about how they plan on spending their refund

How im going to spend my FTP Refund

 
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Fri Oct 11, 2013, 06:34 PM
(#9)
Moxie Pip's Avatar
Since: Aug 2010
Posts: 3,853
Quote:
Originally Posted by TrustySam View Post
Hey Moxie, do you have a Full Tilt refund due to come your way? There's a fun thread over at 2+2 of everybody talking about how they plan on spending their refund

How im going to spend my FTP Refund


Never played there too much. The horrendous video game graphics tilted me (I went with pissed off penguin as my default avatar...).

Think I free-rolled enough for a 6-pack of headache inducing beer,not even the good stuff.
 
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Sat Oct 12, 2013, 01:25 PM
(#10)
TrustySam's Avatar
Since: Aug 2010
Posts: 8,291
BronzeStar
lol!!

The penguin's very intimidating looking :o


Looking forward to the day we get to hear that you've taken the return and used it to build up a bankroll - because online poker's legal again

On Stars though, so you don't have to look at the penguin while u play


 
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Wed Oct 23, 2013, 02:19 PM
(#11)
LittleBigBet's Avatar
Since: Oct 2013
Posts: 6
1st hand of a deepstacked tourney of a micro MTT i assume ? So 1st hand we see a lot of players just pushing so they have an early lead and try to build big stack from the start by just gambling. Then there are players who will do this with monsters as it looks a lot weaker.
Both their plays are bad, but the 22 call is way way way way worse than the AK 3bet shove, which is bad, but is ok to do as it's the 1st hand of a micro MTT and will get called a lot of times by worse. In an MTT it's important to build the biggest stack at the table. AK push is unexploitable and does well against a large pool of players who are just gambling with worse the first hand. 22 u just flipping at best or completely dominated by higher pocket.
If u can't decide what's worse, well then i have some bad news for u...
 
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Wed Oct 23, 2013, 04:09 PM
(#12)
Grade b's Avatar
Since: Jun 2010
Posts: 3,604
Quote:
Originally Posted by LittleBigBet View Post
1st hand of a deepstacked tourney of a micro MTT i assume ? So 1st hand we see a lot of players just pushing so they have an early lead and try to build big stack from the start by just gambling. Then there are players who will do this with monsters as it looks a lot weaker.
Both their plays are bad, but the 22 call is way way way way worse than the AK 3bet shove, which is bad, but is ok to do as it's the 1st hand of a micro MTT and will get called a lot of times by worse. In an MTT it's important to build the biggest stack at the table. AK push is unexploitable and does well against a large pool of players who are just gambling with worse the first hand. 22 u just flipping at best or completely dominated by higher pocket.
If u can't decide what's worse, well then i have some bad news for u...
This is the third level of pso,s private series I think we had 33 runners in this one.

Oh no what's the bad news

Grade b


I am always ready to learn although I do not always like being taught. ~Winston Churchill

13 Time Bracelet Winner


 
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Thu Oct 24, 2013, 03:10 AM
(#13)
LittleBigBet's Avatar
Since: Oct 2013
Posts: 6
Eh..., how can this be 3rd level, everyone stacks is the same, looks like 2nd hand to me..
The bad news is, u should quit poker now before u lose it all. Nah, it just means u really unexperienced and have at least 1 big leak.

Last edited by LittleBigBet; Thu Oct 24, 2013 at 03:13 AM..
 
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Thu Oct 24, 2013, 05:09 AM
(#14)
TweedleBeetl's Avatar
Since: Aug 2013
Posts: 1,146
Quote:
Originally Posted by LittleBigBet View Post
In an MTT it's important to build the biggest stack at the table.
No it is not, specially in the first hands of a MTT
 
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Thu Oct 24, 2013, 06:50 AM
(#15)
LittleBigBet's Avatar
Since: Oct 2013
Posts: 6
LOL
 
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Thu Oct 24, 2013, 07:35 PM
(#16)
Grade b's Avatar
Since: Jun 2010
Posts: 3,604
Quote:
Originally Posted by LittleBigBet View Post
Eh..., how can this be 3rd level, everyone stacks is the same, looks like 2nd hand to me..
The bad news is, u should quit poker now before u lose it all. Nah, it just means u really unexperienced and have at least 1 big leak.
The boom replayer clearly says Grade b - The Fall Classic - Level III (25/50)
Hand uploaded on October 10 2013, 21:20 ET


(it was a turbo) We have very similar stacks because
a.this things tend to be full of fairly good players who dont go off in the first level (but did in the 3rd

or

b. we all late regged.

or

c. It was a statistical blip and we all lost more or less the same as we won to this point.

Can't really remember which one it was correct answer but I'm guessing it was a.

Par of the reason that I cannot decided which play was worse is because We don't know if either player has a read here. It is a big possibility as PSO has put on 80 of these games each month (40 cash and 40 play money) and several players (such as myself play as many as we can.


Grade b

just looked up the game I was in at the start but was sitting out for first 5 minutes rest of table was active.


I am always ready to learn although I do not always like being taught. ~Winston Churchill

13 Time Bracelet Winner


 
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Fri Oct 25, 2013, 06:42 AM
(#17)
LittleBigBet's Avatar
Since: Oct 2013
Posts: 6
Ok thx for information, maybe tourney starts of at 25/50 coz so deepstacked , i dont know these tournaments, never played it. But nevermind, it's not important.

Just remember, u need a much better hand to call a push with for all your chips than if you were the one who pushes.
a 22 call is way way way way worse than 3bet pushing AK. A preflop push with 200bb deep is always a bad play, so im definetely not saying AK is a good push, it's bad, but not even close as bad as 22call.
22 is only flipping at best or completely dominated by higher pair. AK can get a call by worse, flipping or KK/AA at worse. Only 2 hands really beat AK, that is KK and AA, which is only a small chance openraiser has KK or AA.
So if u can't figure this out what is worse, then u really have a big leak in your game and i would be suprised if u win money from poker in long term.
 
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Fri Oct 25, 2013, 10:32 AM
(#18)
Grade b's Avatar
Since: Jun 2010
Posts: 3,604
Thanks Littlebig bet I do agree with most of what you say except this line.

Only 2 hands really beat AK, that is KK and AA, which is only a small chance openraiser has KK or AA.

Read more: what do you think? - PokerSchoolOnline Forum http://www.pokerschoolonline.com/for...#ixzz2ikCi08Xz.

The any pair is curretly beating AK (although we say its a flip), therefore this deep its not good play all round.

Grade b


I am always ready to learn although I do not always like being taught. ~Winston Churchill

13 Time Bracelet Winner


 

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