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16NL 6-Max: TPTK vs 3 Barrels

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16NL 6-Max: TPTK vs 3 Barrels - Sat Nov 02, 2013, 07:03 PM
(#1)
Low Rated's Avatar
Since: Mar 2012
Posts: 114
Hey guys.

PokerStars No-Limit Hold'em, $0.16 BB (4 handed) - PokerStars Converter Tool from http://flopturnriver.com

Button ($22.32)
SB ($8.68)
Low Rated (BB) ($20.79)
UTG ($19.96)

Preflop: Low Rated is BB with A, K
UTG raises to $0.48, 2 folds, Low Rated calls $0.32

Flop: ($1.04) 10, 4, A (2 players)
Low Rated checks, UTG bets $0.80, Low Rated calls $0.80

Turn: ($2.64) 5 (2 players)
Low Rated checks, UTG bets $2.08, Low Rated calls $2.08

River: ($6.80) 5 (2 players)
Low Rated checks, UTG bets $5.92, Low Rated folds

Total pot: $6.80 | Rake: $0.31

Results below:
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Villain is a tight reg and so I feel the best way to get value from my TPTK on this dry board texture is to play it as a bluff catcher. I think I can probably get 2-3 bets out of some Ax combos in his range if the board runs out favourably.

However, his big bets make me believe that he may have me beat with a stronger 2P or a set. I have never really seen this guy get out of line but their are still some Ax combos that he can open with UTG that I am ahead of.

I really don't know if I should have followed through with my plan till the end. Could this just be a case of scared money on my part?
 
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Sat Nov 02, 2013, 07:25 PM
(#2)
Mikey_Luggs's Avatar
Since: Jul 2011
Posts: 138
Not many good players will try and get 3 streets of value out of another good player with a top pair hand. Saying that you have tried to under rep your hand. So you are doing this for him to?? Over play his hand? Maybe he did what you wanted only after setting him up you folded?
What range does he open UTG with? Is he capable of a treble barrel bluff? How does he play his 1 pair hands? how does he view you? So many things can alter if you should call or fold on the river. If your taking shots at a new level it is normally best to keep your lines simple so you don't get yourself into difficult spots like this until you have more info on the player your up against
 
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Sat Nov 02, 2013, 07:48 PM
(#3)
Low Rated's Avatar
Since: Mar 2012
Posts: 114
Thanks Mikey_Luggs. As you said, 3 streets with a TP hand vs a thinking player can be pretty thin at times which is what lead me to a fold.

1. Yes, I want him to overplay weaker hands.

2. I am not really sure if I did make the right fold or not.

3. He is pretty tight and thus his UTG range is probably something like AJo+/A9s+/77+/KJs+/KQo+QJs+

4. He is probably capable of it but he isn't one to do it very often. I had seen him semi-bluff 2 streets and bet the river when his draw bricked earlier.

5. Usually aggressively from what I have seen. Have not seen him go overboard yet.

6. I was playing somewhat loosely as I usually do. Not really sure if he fully respects me or not.

7. Not taking shots, these are my stakes.

EDIT: we are 4 handed here so he is technically playing with his CO range which is wider.

Last edited by Low Rated; Sat Nov 02, 2013 at 07:54 PM..
 
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Sat Nov 02, 2013, 08:06 PM
(#4)
spand42's Avatar
Since: Sep 2010
Posts: 1,496
You've not shown any strength in the hand at all, so it's possible he's trying to value bet Ax lower than AK.

I would definitely 3bet Preflop. By not doing so, you have much less idea about his range and this can be very difficult to deal with Out of Position. The 3Bet is also for value as you are ahead or flipping with a lot of his range and your hand is one of the easiest to play post-flop.

I agree with your instinct that big bets at these stakes normally mean they have something big, maybe a flopped set. However if you've been playing pretty loose, he might just see your calling down as weakness and feels that a big bet will scare you off the river if you hold a crappy Ax. Most regs don't triple-barrel with nothing, I suppose that he might have JJ-KK but I doubt he would fire the river with these holdings.

Therefore I would probably fold the river as you did.
 
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Sun Nov 03, 2013, 12:53 AM
(#5)
birdayy's Avatar
Since: Sep 2012
Posts: 1,179
Ahh this is a snap call guys.

If he is tight we beat everything in his value range except TT and AA (which is unlikely due to card removal)

We chop with AK (which is actually pretty likely the way he played it) and beat any other Ax in his UTG opening range.

We are near the top of our range and folding would be a leak imo.

edit: 4 handed? even more of a snap call

Last edited by birdayy; Sun Nov 03, 2013 at 01:05 AM..
 
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Sun Nov 03, 2013, 06:19 AM
(#6)
spand42's Avatar
Since: Sep 2010
Posts: 1,496
Don't forget UTG pre-flop range should be the same as his CO pre-flop range 4-handed. A4 or A5 are also possible as is 44. So I don't think it's a snap-call even if maybe the call is correct.

I've just been burned so many times by calling with what I think is a strong holding against players to bet huge only to find out they have close to the nuts.
 
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Sun Nov 03, 2013, 07:19 AM
(#7)
birdayy's Avatar
Since: Sep 2012
Posts: 1,179
Quote:
Originally Posted by spand42 View Post
Don't forget UTG pre-flop range should be the same as his CO pre-flop range 4-handed. A4 or A5 are also possible as is 44. So I don't think it's a snap-call even if maybe the call is correct.
We counterfeit A4 OTR.

That means the only Ax combos we lose to are AT or A5 (which is unlikely due to card removal).
 
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Sun Nov 03, 2013, 07:46 AM
(#8)
bhoylegend's Avatar
Since: Jun 2012
Posts: 2,261
Tend to agree with birdayy here. Can't fold such a strong hand, raising for value would be too thin and risk value owning ourselves, leaves the option of calling.
 
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Mon Nov 04, 2013, 03:23 AM
(#9)
GarethC23's Avatar
Since: Nov 2011
Posts: 1,273
boy oh boy. I think this is a close spot and by definition it won't matter too much what you do either way (because the Expected Value of call v fold are similar). I would call in game but his flop size has me worried. I think we might see more bluffs here than you, but I also doubt we see AQ that much, if ever. Tough spot and good logic in your post. Shows a strong player to fold river here whether it was the best play or slightly second best

Also like your preflop decision in theory, without seeing any HUD numbers, but remember four-handed he is really opening in the cutoff. That's one of the reasons I would ultimately call river.
 
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Mon Nov 04, 2013, 03:25 AM
(#10)
Praydk's Avatar
Since: Mar 2012
Posts: 504
utg open with TT and 44 is pretty standart, shouldn't we be worried about those too?
 
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Mon Nov 04, 2013, 03:13 PM
(#11)
GarethC23's Avatar
Since: Nov 2011
Posts: 1,273
Of course, those are the main hands we are worried about, along with AT, in terms of villain's value range.
 

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