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Analyse please!

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Analyse please! - Thu Nov 07, 2013, 06:59 AM
(#1)
uzbektosh's Avatar
Since: Jun 2013
Posts: 80


PSO tourney.
Have I bad played?
I thought to bet 3bb UTG with AcKc while having short stack, but got forced to go all in. Maybe I should have gone all in instead bet? The villian next to me called with A8o (which is donky play on my point of view).
Never mind!
Your thoughts would be appreciated regarding this hand.
 
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Thu Nov 07, 2013, 09:31 AM
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HokyPokyToo's Avatar
Since: Jun 2010
Posts: 4,903
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Thu Nov 07, 2013, 10:02 AM
(#3)
spand42's Avatar
Since: Sep 2010
Posts: 1,496
Just raise all in straight away, don't waste your time raising 3x, all your chips are going to go in regardless and the worst thing you want is three callers and you have to see a flop.

Also by just going all in, you are likely going to get yourself heads-up with someone rather than be in a multiway pot.
 
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Thu Nov 07, 2013, 11:14 AM
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JWK24's Avatar
Since: Jun 2010
Posts: 24,862
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Hi uzbektosh!

If this were a cash tourney, then I'd agree with spand42 and I would need to open-shove this preflop... BUT... this is a league game. In a league game, I cannot take any chances, as the one and only thing that matters is to last as long as possible in order to accumulate more league points. Due to this, I cannot open-shove.

With AKs from UTG, I'm going to make a standard raise, which for this blind level is to 2.5BB+1BB, so I will raise to 1000.

I then get a call, an abnormally large raise and a call. With this being a league game, I need to last as long as possible without taking any risks. Due to this, I need to muck AKs here and look for a better spot or if I have to... to blind out to get more league points. I do not ever want to be all-in unless I know that I'm going to have the best hand after all 5 cards are on the board or I'm blinded in.

This hand is a very good example of how the league strategy differs from a standard cash tourney.

Hope this helps and good luck at the tables.

John (JWK24)


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Thu Nov 07, 2013, 06:57 PM
(#5)
spand42's Avatar
Since: Sep 2010
Posts: 1,496
John, I don't really understand where you're coming from.

Surely the best way of accruing league points is to finish higher in the tournament, so I don't see why this goal is any different from a normal MTT unless there is a big pay jump in the points that hasn't been mentioned.

If you're going to raise to 2.5BB and fold on a crappy flop, you might as well just auto-fold to until you blind out!


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Thu Nov 07, 2013, 07:10 PM
(#6)
JWK24's Avatar
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Each player that I outlast gets me more points. I'm going to play the hands that I do play aggressively (minus going all-in), but I cannot be all-in unless I'm going to have a super-premium hand preflop or will be ahead after all 5 are on the board.

John (JWK24)


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Thu Nov 07, 2013, 09:09 PM
(#7)
Moxie Pip's Avatar
Since: Aug 2010
Posts: 3,853
Quote:
Originally Posted by spand42 View Post
John, I don't really understand where you're coming from.

Surely the best way of accruing league points is to finish higher in the tournament, so I don't see why this goal is any different from a normal MTT unless there is a big pay jump in the points that hasn't been mentioned.

If you're going to raise to 2.5BB and fold on a crappy flop, you might as well just auto-fold to until you blind out!


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But every tournament is connected to each other in the cumulative points,positive or negative,received in each entry. So yes,acquiring points matters,but points lost are more penal once certain "choke" points for the month are reached.

WHEN it is in the month and where we are on the leader board makes a big difference in these types of decisions. Never played this Open League,nor the Premier,but I get the gist of it from my experience in the old Skill League pre-Black Friday. And I had pretty good success there.

Considerations in league games,if one is competing for the monthly prizes,are far outside the realm of normal MTT play.

Quote:
Originally Posted by JWK24 View Post
Each player that I outlast gets me more points. I'm going to play the hands that I do play aggressively (minus going all-in), but I cannot be all-in unless I'm going to have a super-premium hand preflop or will be ahead after all 5 are on the board.

John (JWK24)
Yes and no for me here I think. Not surprising,I seem to remember that you and I differed on this type of hand when we both played in the old league.

Yep,we want to guard against points lost first and foremost,mainly calamitous high double digit losses. But if I have the "rhythm" of these Open League games right (and I think I do,someone who plays them please correct me if I'm wrong...),then at this blind level,number 7,we're coming up on 1 hour into the tourney and with the mass exodus parameters of these things in the first 3-5 levels we're near the +/- break even point already. So even if we get bounced here,it may be a negative score but it will be a low enough number that it's basically a wash.

Given that...I'm either folding here straight off,or shoving. I'm NOT making any other type of raise as that will invite players to come along and could lead to me folding...either pre-flop to raises,or post flop to a missed flop. Either way is a big bag of "meh"...I'd rather push for the chip up and get bounced for a slight minus score,knowing that the chips I'll accrue the times I carry the day in a like spot will get me far enough to easily make up for the misses,or I'll just open fold and know that the chips I didn't lose by raise/folding are likely enough for 2+ more rotations of stalling/folding than I would otherwise have.

With a hand like AKs here and first to go...IF I'm right about this being a spot where I would lose 3-4 points or less on a bust then I'm shoving here. 3-4 points is no biggie,especially early in the month.

I'm with spand42 on this one JW...I just like any type of raise/call and then fold play here the least. Not at this stage and with this hand.
 
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Thu Nov 07, 2013, 09:15 PM
(#8)
JWK24's Avatar
Since: Jun 2010
Posts: 24,862
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Moxie,

the pts in the new leagues are different from what we played. ours were very small increases until you hit ITM.. in the ones now, it's more linear (minus really early exits)... so busting earlier toward the middle of the tourney costs you more in the monthly standings than it did when we played.

John (JWK24)


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