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50NL 6-Max: calling 3b oop

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50NL 6-Max: calling 3b oop - Wed Nov 20, 2013, 03:38 AM
(#1)
Roland GTX's Avatar
Since: Jan 2012
Posts: 1,905
This hand is from a regular 50NL 6-Max table. The btn is not a 50NL reg. He is single tabling and has been very nitty preflop and fit or fold postflop. He was the opponent I had been trying to play against all hour. This was the first time he 3-bet at the table (about 50 hands). That and the small sizing lead me to believe that he had a big hand QQ+.

Normally, I don't call 3bets oop, especially when I assume I'm facing an overpair; however, here I thought it was a good spot. It didn't cost much to see a flop. Moreover, J10s plays well against his range, and I expected to be able to stack this opponent if I made a strong hand. I expect him to overplay an overpair. His stack is a bit short, but I still seem to be getting good enough implied odds to call.

This hand worked out perfectly, but does the pf call seem ok? What if any hands can we call with oop in a preflop spot like this?

http://www.boomplayer.com/en/poker-h...464_37A3716486

Thanks

Roland GTX
 
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Wed Nov 20, 2013, 05:49 AM
(#2)
bhoylegend's Avatar
Since: Jun 2012
Posts: 2,261
If, as you say, he has a well defined range of premiums only then I think we can call with the sort of hand you did here. Suited connected hands that can make flush/straight or combo draws. Our hand should be easy to play post flop. We either miss and can get away from it easily or we flop a strong hand and can stack him when he isn't able to get away from his hand.

There is the fact that he is short stacked to take into account but he more or less min-raised and with the blind money in there the price feels attractive.

Maybe not something to do every time but I think there were sounds reasons for making the move you did here.
 
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Thu Nov 21, 2013, 10:02 AM
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TheLangolier's Avatar
Since: Jun 2010
Posts: 13,512
(Head Trainer)
Hi Greg!

I think this is a bit too thin preflop given his stack size. We're only getting 18-1, with a suited connector I like more than 25-1. It's very tempting to call given the solid level of read, but he's just not deep enough imo. These implied odds would be good for set mining with small pairs vs a player marked with a premium pair who we think can't let it go post flop on a shorter stack. A suited connector is different from a small pair in a couple ways:

-The pocket pair is clear cut as is our investment on it... we will invest 1.75 more to see a flop which will leave us with a very strong holding, or a very weak one. Thus we will only further our investment post flop when we have a very high equity share vs his range. The suited connector flops a lot of draws. Even assuming we are planning to get away quickly from J high or T high flops, the draws will compel us to invest more in a much more equity neutral and usually underdog situation.

-Part of the strength of suited connectors is the ability to semi-bluff those draws in a profitable manner. It's also a part of the reason the higher implied odds are important... against villains who are loose fish, we need the big odds to insure we are properly rewarded for the investments we'll need to make pre and post flop to make our hand. Against villains such as this, we need them because they indicate a depth of money against which we can expect some measure of fold equity on scary boards and with big draws. As per the read, we don't think this guy is going to be able to get away from his probable premium pair post flop because he's more shallow... so that works against the strength of a suited connector in that it takes away one of it's weapons, the semi-bluff.


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Thu Nov 21, 2013, 10:04 AM
(#4)
TheLangolier's Avatar
Since: Jun 2010
Posts: 13,512
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bhoylegend View Post
We either miss and can get away from it easily or we flop a strong hand and can stack him when he isn't able to get away from his hand.
Just read this after my reply... this is precisely pocket pairs, not suited connectors which flop a lot of medium strength equity hands like flush draws, straight draws, pair+gut shot, etc.


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Thu Nov 21, 2013, 11:26 AM
(#5)
bhoylegend's Avatar
Since: Jun 2012
Posts: 2,261
Quote:
Originally Posted by TheLangolier View Post
Just read this after my reply... this is precisely pocket pairs, not suited connectors which flop a lot of medium strength equity hands like flush draws, straight draws, pair+gut shot, etc.
Well it's not something I do all that often I think.

Was trying to see a justification for it in this particular scenario where we can nail down a pretty solid range for the villain, and he has more or less clicked it back and made it cheaper to call (I'm writing this from memory so not sure but I think it was 25c more than a min-raise), we are out of position and if we don't flop the nuts and just a draw or marginal hand then we likely call at least once before giving up, losing more than just the initial call. So I accept why we shouldn't do it and that's why I don't usually do it.
 
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Thu Nov 21, 2013, 11:48 AM
(#6)
Roland GTX's Avatar
Since: Jan 2012
Posts: 1,905
Thanks Dave

You correctly inferred that I was looking at these sc as being the same as a small pair. Thanks for a very clear and educational response!

Greg
 

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