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calling 2 bet with monsters

calling 2 bet with monsters - Tue Nov 26, 2013, 08:21 AM
Villmann's Avatar
Since: Feb 2012
Posts: 35
Hi. Should i sometimes call 2 bet with monsterhands like AA, KK... to make my callingrange stronger and harder to read? If so then how often should i do that, 20%?
Tue Nov 26, 2013, 08:51 AM
spand42's Avatar
Since: Sep 2010
Posts: 1,496
In poker I would usually prefer to take the aggressive approach rather than the passive approach.

Therefore I would almost always 3bet with AA/KK, however I 3Bet a wider range of hands in order that villain's can't just assume that I've got premiums whenever I 3Bet.

This approach has several advantages over just calling 2Bets with premiums to balance your range:
  1. You get more money in the pot preflop when you do have a premium holding, making it easier to win a big pot.
  2. You will get a lot of value with your fold equity
  3. When your 3Bets get called and you don't have a premium holding, you have the initiative in the hand and can often take down the pot with a Cbet on the flop
  4. When you don't have a premium, you might still flop big and get stronger pre-flop holdings to pay you off
Tue Nov 26, 2013, 08:52 AM
bhoylegend's Avatar
Since: Jun 2012
Posts: 2,261
In cash I would never do this.

Against 3 and 4 bets I think there are times it can be good if you are against some kinds of opponents as it can mean more money going into the pot such as when they have a worse overpair etc.

If we just call an initial raise and we are not last to act we could invite everyone along to play with us.
Sun Dec 08, 2013, 08:45 PM
DemzMahChipz's Avatar
Since: Feb 2013
Posts: 67
(Just realised this thread was specific about calling 2bets, I thought the topic was calling raises with monsters.)

I do occasionally. Take this hand for example, this is actually the most money I've ever won on a single hand at any stakes. EP open MP 3bet LP 4bet and I'm in the SB with AA. I chose to flat the 4bet because:

1. I'm happy with the pot size in just a 3bet hand with AA, and this pot is already 4 bets deep.

2. Even though it's going to lead to a lot of variance, (I'm not 100% sure of this, so someone correct me if I'm wrong). I think knowing I have the best hand, I don't really want to push anyone out of this pot. But maybe having dead money in a bloated pot against less opps is statistically more profitable. Again, IDK for sure.

3. With everyone going crazy in this pot already, I'm nearly 100% sure that this one is coming back to me, and I'll get another chance to shove here, which it does, and I do.

(Just noticing that the replayer doesn't show the opps hands, which are QJo, TT, KK in order of the betting.)

Last edited by DemzMahChipz; Sun Dec 08, 2013 at 09:16 PM..
Mon Dec 09, 2013, 07:47 AM
ArtySmokesPS's Avatar
Since: Oct 2011
Posts: 7,316
Originally Posted by Villmann View Post
Hi. Should i sometimes call 2 bet with monsterhands like AA, KK... to make my callingrange stronger and harder to read? If so then how often should i do that, 20%?
I don't think there's a specific percentage you should be aiming for. You should be looking for particular spots* where flatting might be the best way to maximise value. In microstakes, the best policy is to usually 3-bet for value with your monsters, because villains will call with worse so often.
Flatting instead of 3-betting is kind of fancy play syndrome, and is best avoided until you have solid reads on your opponents and understand the reasons for deviating from the standard line. Making yourself "harder to read" isn't necessary in the micros, imo. Many villains aren't capable of reading you even if you make it obvious you have the nuts, so just go ahead and make it obvious!

* Example. A TAG opens UTG, you flat on the button with AA, because you expect a loose aggressive player in the blinds to squeeze. Flatting here is also good because if you 3-bet vs the UTG open, the TAG might fold most of his range, so you only pick up 3bb. If you just call, you'll get a c-bet out of him too.

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