Home / Community / Forum / Poker Education / Texas Hold'Em Cash Games /

2NL AKs line of play

Old
Default
2NL AKs line of play - Sat Dec 14, 2013, 08:49 AM
(#1)
IBNash's Avatar
Since: Oct 2013
Posts: 177
Should I have re raised/shoved the Turn?

 
Old
Default
Sat Dec 14, 2013, 11:00 AM
(#2)
spand42's Avatar
Since: Sep 2010
Posts: 1,496
You've flopped a really strong board here. Bearing in mind villain's short stack - I'd be looking to try and get all his chips in the middle ASAP.

Your flop CBet is way too small - I'd make it something like $0.30 - there are several reasons for this:
  • There is a good chance we have the best hand and we want to bet for value
  • We want to build a pot in case we hit our flush
  • We might fold out hands that are currently better than ours e.g. small pocket pairs.

We are betting intending to call a shove. If he has Jx, we are still a coin-flip. If he has flopped a set , our equity is not so good but still pretty decent.
 
Old
Default
Sat Dec 14, 2013, 12:00 PM
(#3)
ArtySmokesPS's Avatar
Since: Oct 2011
Posts: 7,353
Using standard bet sizes of between half pot and 3/4 pot, this is a clear bet-bet-shove scenario. I have no idea why you checked the nuts on the turn, but it looks like "fancy play syndrome" to me. Just bet your hand and print money.


Bracelet Winner
 
Old
Default
Sat Dec 14, 2013, 01:49 PM
(#4)
TheLangolier's Avatar
Since: Jun 2010
Posts: 13,510
(Head Trainer)
Hi Nash,

-C-bet the flop bigger (and shove if we get raised)

-Bet the turn (don't risk a free card that might kill any action like a 4th spade)

-Raise his turn bet (he tried to bypass a free card and we basically gave it to him anyway, .08c into .53c)

Slowplaying will cost you a lot of money in the long run, if you don't have clear reasons on how it's going to be more profitable, then just play your big hand fast... it nets you a lot more $$ in the end.


Head Live Trainer
Check out my Videos

4 Time Bracelet Winner



 
Old
Default
Sat Dec 14, 2013, 07:52 PM
(#5)
IBNash's Avatar
Since: Oct 2013
Posts: 177
Quote:
Originally Posted by spand42 View Post
You've flopped a really strong board here. Bearing in mind villain's short stack - I'd be looking to try and get all his chips in the middle ASAP.

Your flop CBet is way too small - I'd make it something like $0.30 - there are several reasons for this:
  • There is a good chance we have the best hand and we want to bet for value
  • We want to build a pot in case we hit our flush
  • We might fold out hands that are currently better than ours e.g. small pocket pairs.

We are betting intending to call a shove. If he has Jx, we are still a coin-flip. If he has flopped a set , our equity is not so good but still pretty decent.
Looking at the hand again I can't fathom why I bet 8c into that pot, I usually hit the 55/60% pot bet button to cbet the flop. I slow played the Turn and the effective nuts at that point to see if he'd bet the turn to raise him big on the River.
At showdown, it took me a second to look at the runout again to figure out why those chips weren't coming my way and I felt I should cry me a river. I did not think of a set making a full house with a paired board
 
Old
Default
Sat Dec 14, 2013, 07:54 PM
(#6)
IBNash's Avatar
Since: Oct 2013
Posts: 177
Quote:
Originally Posted by ArtySmokesPS View Post
Using standard bet sizes of between half pot and 3/4 pot, this is a clear bet-bet-shove scenario. I have no idea why you checked the nuts on the turn, but it looks like "fancy play syndrome" to me. Just bet your hand and print money.
So you'd be okay with shoving to a re raise on the flop? And this will be an EV decision over time considering I won't make my flush most of the times?
 
Old
Default
Sat Dec 14, 2013, 08:28 PM
(#7)
braveslice's Avatar
Since: Feb 2013
Posts: 568
I think it’s because he is short stacked and you have to count correct sized CB.

If he shoves, you need to call around 0.9, giving you pot odds around 34. Against sets you are only 26 to win, BUT he will shove lots of other hands too, you can’t give him range containing only sets. Against QQ you are 54 to win, KJ 47 to win.

Short stacked players usually are really wide.

Last edited by braveslice; Sat Dec 14, 2013 at 08:33 PM..
 
Old
Default
Sun Dec 15, 2013, 05:47 AM
(#8)
ArtySmokesPS's Avatar
Since: Oct 2011
Posts: 7,353
Quote:
Originally Posted by IBNash View Post
I slow played the Turn and the effective nuts at that point to see if he'd bet the turn to raise him big on the River.
FPS (fancy play syndrome), like I thought.
There are several reasons why you should bet the turn.
1. For value. He will call with worse hands, including pair+draw, 2 pairs, sets. Sets in particular are the only hands with decent equity against you. They have 10 outs to a boat or quads, so try and get maximum value NOW, while the villain is still drawing.
2. The river card could kill your action. If another spade hits the board, villain is never putting in another cent unless he also has a decent flush, which is somewhat unlikely.
3. Villains at these stakes are quite passive in general. They won't build the pot for you, so you should be doing the betting yourself.
4. To disguise the strength of your hand. You should be betting here with any hand that has equity, and also a few bluffs. If you bet with the nuts, villain won't know it, since you'd be betting with much worse too. If you decide to go for the check-raise, that basically turns your hand face up as the nuts, which could get worse hands to fold.
5. If you check the turn, it's a disaster when villain checks behind, because you lose a whole street of value. If he has a draw, then he won't pay you off on the river if his draw doesn't hit, so you'll end up winning just the 8c that he paid on the flop.

Fancy play is basically the opposite of how you should play in the micros. If you look back at this hand, you check-called a really small bet when you had the actual nuts, and then you bet big when you no longer had the nuts. I'd recommend you do the opposite: Bet big (for value) when you have the nuts, and only slow down when there's a chance you're beat.

Quote:
Originally Posted by IBNash View Post
So you'd be okay with shoving to a re raise on the flop? And this will be an EV decision over time considering I won't make my flush most of the times?
If you bet half pot on the flop and get raised, you're priced in to stack off against this short stack. With two overs and the nut flush draw, you are pretty much flipping with any pair (and are sometimes a favourite), and you're only in bad shape against a set. Once you've made a decent bet on the flop though, the pot odds dictate that folding would be a mistake, because you've always got at least 25% equity and often much more.


Bracelet Winner

Last edited by ArtySmokesPS; Sun Dec 15, 2013 at 05:50 AM..
 
Old
Default
Sun Dec 15, 2013, 06:35 AM
(#9)
IBNash's Avatar
Since: Oct 2013
Posts: 177
Quote:
Originally Posted by braveslice View Post
I think it’s because he is short stacked and you have to count correct sized CB.

If he shoves, you need to call around 0.9, giving you pot odds around 34. Against sets you are only 26 to win, BUT he will shove lots of other hands too, you can’t give him range containing only sets. Against QQ you are 54 to win, KJ 47 to win.

Short stacked players usually are really wide.
I'm not calculating pot odds at all
 

Getting PokerStars is easy: download and install the PokerStars game software, create your free player account, and validate your email address. Clicking on the download poker button will lead to the installation of compatible poker software on your PC of 51.7 MB, which will enable you to register and play poker on the PokerStars platform. To uninstall PokerStars use the Windows uninstaller: click Start > Control Panel and then select Add or Remove programs > Select PokerStars and click Uninstall or Remove.

Copyright (c) PokerSchoolOnline.com. All rights reserved, Rational Group, Douglas Bay Complex, King Edward Road, Onchan, Isle of Man, IM3 1DZ. You can email us on support@pokerschoolonline.com