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good bluff

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good bluff - Mon Dec 23, 2013, 07:40 AM
(#1)
NaturoSasuki's Avatar
Since: Dec 2013
Posts: 348
dunno wut i was making him fold OTR, prob some AX and KQs and AXs
but im glad it worked, lol, prob i could make smaller river bet i guess in case he reraise

btw i was just calling cuz we know like we all likez getting it allin with our nut flush draw on the flop, so i just like flatting it and look if TURN & RIVER comes safe, before firing my bluff

btw i should not be playing 10NL zoom, dont have BR for it , just went there to stalk TrustySam *lulz* #stalker

Last edited by NaturoSasuki; Mon Dec 23, 2013 at 07:43 AM..
 
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Mon Dec 23, 2013, 12:48 PM
(#2)
mike2198's Avatar
Since: Jan 2013
Posts: 1,485
Well hes obviously got nothing but im trying to work out what hands you check back the turn with then bet so big on the river with two flush draws on the board, im guessing thats nothing and you might check back Ax hh on the river so when you bet it looks like you got missed draws.

Last edited by mike2198; Mon Dec 23, 2013 at 03:51 PM..
 
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Mon Dec 23, 2013, 01:11 PM
(#3)
TommyGun369's Avatar
Since: Nov 2012
Posts: 340
I am really surprised it worked I would call you with any A high hand, especially for that sizing. I think you have way too many KQ,KJ,QJ and missed FDs in your range compared to value hands like a ten or JJ to ever consider folding. You are representing exactly what you have and I would never give you credit here to do this value bet with something like 88 or 98 to get called specifically by a pure bluffcatcher.

That said I do not know how often people at 10NL make these calls since I almost always bet turn once checked into on that board. No reason for him to stop betting with JJ+ and turn check shove with big pairs there is super rare at these stakes as far as i remember (although it becomes a very cool play once you know people will bet in position with KQ,KJ,QJ a high % of the time). By not betting the turn you take out most value hands from your range and leave it full of draws and floats which is generally a very unfavorable situation for you.
 
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Mon Dec 23, 2013, 01:16 PM
(#4)
mike2198's Avatar
Since: Jan 2013
Posts: 1,485
Quote:
Originally Posted by TommyGun369 View Post
I am really surprised it worked I would call you with any A high hand, especially for that sizing. I think you have way too many KQ,KJ,QJ and missed FDs in your range compared to value hands like a ten or JJ to ever consider folding. You are representing exactly what you have and I would never give you credit here to do this value bet with something like 88 or 98 to get called specifically by a pure bluffcatcher.

That said I do not know how often people at 10NL make these calls since I almost always bet turn once checked into on that board. No reason for him to stop betting with JJ+ and turn check shove with big pairs there is super rare at these stakes as far as i remember (although it becomes a very cool play once you know people will bet in position with KQ,KJ,QJ a high % of the time). By not betting the turn you take out most value hands from your range and leave it full of draws and floats which is generally a very unfavorable situation for you.
Yh i would bet the turn as well but lets say i never and i decided to bet the river for say half pot would you be less likely to call?
 
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Mon Dec 23, 2013, 01:25 PM
(#5)
TommyGun369's Avatar
Since: Nov 2012
Posts: 340
Quote:
Originally Posted by mike2198 View Post
Yh i would bet the turn as well but lets say i never and i decided to bet the river for say half pot would you be less likely to call?
Only if I had a specific read on you telling me otherwise

Half pot bet is a bit more scary because you can have a few more thin value hands in your range but still, you only need to be bluffing 25% OTR for me to start breaking even with my calls. A random 10NL villain is probably bluffing close to 40-50% (maybe even more) even for a half pot bet

For a 2 x pot bet I would start thinking
 
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Mon Dec 23, 2013, 07:12 PM
(#6)
PSO-xflixx's Avatar
Since: Jun 2011
Posts: 1,119
(Live Trainer)
Hey Naturo,

I like both your pre and flop play, dislike raising flop as the 3bettor will probably be bet/calling off his overpairs here and your equity is a little diminished by the flushdraw on board.

OTT I would bet halfpot as it looks like villain is going to check/fold a lot. If he shoves you can still fold as his equity will probably have yours crushed (two FDs on board that are not your suit).

You can also check back ofc, in that case I would usually only bet the best rivers that you can represent more strong hands on. Betting blank rivers, especially ones that pair the board could sometimes work but after checking I don't like it too much as people tend to put you on a busted draw a lot. If I were to bet I think we could get away with less as that is more congruent with our weak valuerange (mostly 1 pair hands trying to get value from A high).


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