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$16.5K 15K : Final 2 tables : AK vs UTG Raise (AGG Chip Leader) : 3B jam vs 3B

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$16.5K 15K : Final 2 tables : AK vs UTG Raise (AGG Chip Leader) : 3B jam vs 3B - Mon Jan 06, 2014, 12:47 AM
(#1)
Marc Rae's Avatar
Since: Aug 2013
Posts: 505
Last night, this villain had been running over this table since it formed down to the final 18, and prior to that I was on his table where he using his stack to take down pots post flop (rightly so). Gameflow for villain was definitely with him during the last few tables.

Villain stats: 39 hands, 110BB
39/38/0.0
Fold to 3bet 75%.
TOT Agg 6.0
UTG RFI 75% Not surprising, all other positions were between 60-100% anyway.

Villain may have had stats reading me as:
16/14
3Bet 30%
Fold 3bet 50%

Although he had a high fold to 3bet, previous to that, most plays against villain during (this) final 2 and 3 tables were passive (no 3 betting action). This would be my first pot against him. I do understand that because he is essentially now raising any 2, and I want to keep his range wide entering the pot.... but If I gave him the chance to see a flop, I don't have that much space to move around on post-flop. I'm also factoring somewhat on gameflow here as a pre flop decision to jam against him, whereas I would possibly be making harder decisions post-flop.

Regardless of his holdings, Is there a case to choose any other line than jamming here vs this kind of villain at these late stages of the tourny? Considering that I am looking at spots to double up / chip up and be with a decent chip count leading to the FT.


Thanks for the feedback.



Last edited by Marc Rae; Mon Jan 06, 2014 at 01:00 AM..
 
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Mon Jan 06, 2014, 03:04 AM
(#2)
Shichi-77's Avatar
Since: Jul 2012
Posts: 607
I think 3bet to 35000-40000 and call his shove would be better. Just a cooler .
 
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Mon Jan 06, 2014, 04:24 AM
(#3)
Roland GTX's Avatar
Since: Jan 2012
Posts: 1,905
I'll chime in on this one too. Your hand does great against the utg range. You are in position and the blinds are short. I would actually consider flatting pf hoping to induce a shove from one of the blinds. If they fold or call, you still have position, have kept utg's range wide and can reevaluate on the flop. This may be a bit more high risk, but it might be a better way to maximize your profit in this spot.

Roland GTX
 
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Mon Jan 06, 2014, 05:13 AM
(#4)
Shichi-77's Avatar
Since: Jul 2012
Posts: 607
Quote:
Originally Posted by Roland GTX View Post
I'll chime in on this one too. Your hand does great against the utg range. You are in position and the blinds are short. I would actually consider flatting pf hoping to induce a shove from one of the blinds. If they fold or call, you still have position, have kept utg's range wide and can reevaluate on the flop. This may be a bit more high risk, but it might be a better way to maximize your profit in this spot.

Roland GTX
Could you write more details about what to do IP with 25 bb deep post flop ?
 
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Mon Jan 06, 2014, 08:47 AM
(#5)
Roland GTX's Avatar
Since: Jan 2012
Posts: 1,905
Keep in mind that I'm not a tourney expert Shichi-77.

My thought was that AK is a premium hand. We are nearing the FT and need to double up if we want to make a deep run. For me AK is strong enough to want to encourage action. I would be quite happy calling on the btn if it might enduce a shove from the sb or bb since they might try to 3b squeeze with a ton of Ax and Kx hands that we dominate or pocket pairs that we have two overcards to.

If one of the blinds shoves I would call even if utg moves ai as well. If the blinds fold we are still heads up against a very agro villain and have position on him. We can reevaluate on the flop, but I would intend on calling or raising ai most c-bets from the villain. If we get a horrible flop and are forced to fold, we have gone from a 25bb stack to a 23bb stack. This shouldn't make a difference to our tourney prospects.

Imo we are crushing his range and this line seems to give us more chances of maximizing our profit than 3b jamming pf. Since 3betting pre stops the blinds from 3betting AJs, AQ, KQs hands that we dominate, and 3betting also stops the utg villain from c-betting with hands that we are beating. In other words, if we are crushing utg's range (and presumably the blinds), let them hang themselves and build the pot. I want to give myself the best chance of doubling up here.

Just my two cents

Roland GTX
 
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Mon Jan 06, 2014, 08:57 AM
(#6)
Shichi-77's Avatar
Since: Jul 2012
Posts: 607
Quote:
Originally Posted by Roland GTX View Post
Keep in mind that I'm not a tourney expert Shichi-77.

My thought was that AK is a premium hand. We are nearing the FT and need to double up if we want to make a deep run. For me AK is strong enough to want to encourage action. I would be quite happy calling on the btn if it might enduce a shove from the sb or bb since they might try to 3b squeeze with a ton of Ax and Kx hands that we dominate or pocket pairs that we have two overcards to.

If one of the blinds shoves I would call even if utg moves ai as well. If the blinds fold we are still heads up against a very agro villain and have position on him. We can reevaluate on the flop, but I would intend on calling or raising ai most c-bets from the villain. If we get a horrible flop and are forced to fold, we have gone from a 25bb stack to a 23bb stack. This shouldn't make a difference to our tourney prospects.

Imo we are crushing his range and this line seems to give us more chances of maximizing our profit than 3b jamming pf. Since 3betting pre stops the blinds from 3betting AJs, AQ, KQs hands that we dominate, and 3betting also stops the utg villain from c-betting with hands that we are beating. In other words, if we are crushing utg's range (and presumably the blinds), let them hang themselves and build the pot. I want to give myself the best chance of doubling up here.

Just my two cents

Roland GTX
Thanks, great answer.
 
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Mon Jan 06, 2014, 12:29 PM
(#7)
JWK24's Avatar
Since: Jun 2010
Posts: 24,836
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Hi Marc Rae!

I think Greg's idea is perfect here. I'm looking for action and want to keep lesser hands in from the blinds, plus I'm well ahead of the raiser's range.

The other thing is that if I see a HU pot with the initial raiser, especially if I hit the flop, I could very easily get the opp to lead into me (if they are likely to c-bet and looking at their flop c-bet % is a key stat for me here) and if they bet, it's an easy jam for me.

If I was going to raise here preflop, I'm going to make a standard 3-bet to 40k and not jam here. For me, it's too many chips to jam and can cause me to get value-owned... where I fold out all the worse hands that I want action from and will only get called by hands that are ahead of me.

Hope this helps and good luck at the tables.

John (JWK24)


Super-Moderator



6 Time Bracelet Winner


 
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Mon Jan 06, 2014, 04:30 PM
(#8)
Marc Rae's Avatar
Since: Aug 2013
Posts: 505
Thanks JWK, et al for the comments. Maybe I should have pointed out that the blinds were nitting it up and more than likely to be blinding down (before this table formed) to get into the FT - not my style.


And I do understand the points to play the hand to see the flop.


But back OT, Just to point out that in these situations, I am using FE to steal chips uncontested... and if I am jamming at the top of my range, I will be also jamming at the bottom of my range (extremely wide) as well. I'm not necessarily (definitely not) looking for action, when I squeeze.


I just think in these very late stages, picking these chips uncontested is the easiest way to pick build a stack, in these specific spots. (I'm not jamming all the time).


I thought that since the table just formed, and being long handed, we would have 3-5 orbits before the table started getting short handed. If big stack were to call (and lost), players would see my (top end) hand to showdown. For the remainder of those orbits, this is an image I want to stick with the players left at the table to jam/steal wide... especially with the other big stack to my right.

Last edited by Marc Rae; Mon Jan 06, 2014 at 04:33 PM..
 
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Mon Jan 06, 2014, 04:34 PM
(#9)
JWK24's Avatar
Since: Jun 2010
Posts: 24,836
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Hi Marc!

I'm going to be shoving wide at this point in the tourney too, but the key point is that I need to shove based on my chip stack and here, it's too many chips to shove. I'm all for getting uncontested chips, but what I don't want to do is to value-own myself by shoving too many chips.

John (JWK24)


Super-Moderator



6 Time Bracelet Winner


 
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Mon Jan 06, 2014, 04:48 PM
(#10)
Marc Rae's Avatar
Since: Aug 2013
Posts: 505
Point taken John


Don't want you to think that in my explanation that I am playing a shoving line between 5-29BB the same way. It's very different, maybe polar opposite.
 
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Tue Jan 07, 2014, 05:54 AM
(#11)
spand42's Avatar
Since: Sep 2010
Posts: 1,496
I'm not a huge fan of flatting preflop - we're going to miss the flop so often that I think we'll lose value when villain can bluff CBet into us. Furthermore if villain does have a decent PP and it comes with an A high flop - we're also not going to get much action there either, we might get a flop CBet and that's it.

I'd prefer to 3Bet to say 40K with the intention of getting all in.
 
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Tue Jan 07, 2014, 11:57 PM
(#12)
Marc Rae's Avatar
Since: Aug 2013
Posts: 505
Agree, in a vacuum AK plays far superior in 3bp's.
 

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