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AQ - Sun Jan 19, 2014, 10:17 AM
(#1)
mike2198's Avatar
Since: Jan 2013
Posts: 1,485


Do you think we can raise this turn for thin value?

He checks the flop so he isnt going to be betting TT if he decided to check and i doubt he checks Jx, so when he bets the turn i think he has Qx and some heart draws and straight draws.

So i decided to raise because if he re raises i can fold and i get value from worse Qx and draws that wont put another cent in the pot when they miss so i am basically giving him a free turn to suckout by calling the turn.
 
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Sun Jan 19, 2014, 03:50 PM
(#2)
tonydolphin's Avatar
Since: Aug 2013
Posts: 75
I don't raise the turn here small hand small pot.Call the turn.Re evaluate the river.
 
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Sun Jan 19, 2014, 11:17 PM
(#3)
birdayy's Avatar
Since: Sep 2012
Posts: 1,179
Too thin.
 
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Mon Jan 20, 2014, 03:45 AM
(#4)
ArtySmokesPS's Avatar
Since: Oct 2011
Posts: 7,359
Quote:
Originally Posted by mike2198 View Post
So i decided to raise because if he re raises i can fold
Sounds like you're "raising for info", which I think is a leak. Just call and let villain continue to value-bet or bluff with worse. If he's ahead, you lose the minimum by keeping the pot under control. In short, don't bloat the pot with one pair.


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Mon Jan 20, 2014, 08:59 AM
(#5)
mike2198's Avatar
Since: Jan 2013
Posts: 1,485
Fair enough its the 1st time ive tried it, im not raising for info i think i have the best hand and seen as he checked the flop and bet the turn i thought he has a Q at best which i beat and i can charge his draws.

On the river i bet small and he folded so he must of had a draw like i thought but just because i was right this time doesn't mean it was a good play which was why i posted the hand, if he bet flop and barreled the turn i defo wasn't raising it was based purely on his flop check and the texture of the board.

Spose il only get another 40c out of Qx if i call when he bets the river anyway, i guess this line is no good then.
 
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Mon Jan 20, 2014, 10:48 AM
(#6)
CaRLoS_DZ87's Avatar
Since: Jul 2011
Posts: 184
BronzeStar
IMO depends a lot vs who are you playing, and the range you give him from that position. The looser he is from that position the more reasons you have to CR with your TPTK.

If he is a TAG reg, I don't see him having that many draws that you could charge with a CR that didn't cbet, diamond flush and straight draws are likely to cbet, maybe AKh ATh are the few draws that can call a CR. Also I would expect the worst Q he could have is KQ, some player will check JQ on the flop to pot control with their bad kicker.

If he is betting TT 99 QK JT, you are better just calling turn and value betting river if he checks to you, and you will get called often specially on blank rivers, since is a draw heavy board, you represent a lot of draws by just calling turn and you are in the BTN with a wider range.

If this were vs a loose player or vs a reg from CO, there would be more reasons to re-raise TPTK. It matter a lot when villain could be opening 67s and Q8s+ than only JTs+ and KQ+, what range has more draws and worst Qs?

Last edited by CaRLoS_DZ87; Mon Jan 20, 2014 at 10:55 AM..
 
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Mon Jan 20, 2014, 11:24 AM
(#7)
geoVARTA's Avatar
Since: Oct 2010
Posts: 1,306
I think the guys have sum it up nicely here. I think calling is better than raising because TPTK might not warrant a raise. We have to think what type of hands would call our raise. We are also not giving them a free card because they are betting for us anyways. And when we call our hand sometimes might look like a draw to them and they might x/c river on blanks with weaker hands that might be more inclined to fold to a raise.
 
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Mon Jan 20, 2014, 11:32 AM
(#8)
mike2198's Avatar
Since: Jan 2013
Posts: 1,485
Yh he was a fish opening alot of worse Qs than QJ and he has alot of draws on the turn that he might bet but i didnt know for sure but like i said hes got alot of worse Qx i can get value from.

I didnt think anyone would check QJ on that flop i would rather bet it vs BU and charge all his draws myself.

I think i would just flat vs a reg because im not entirely sure how they would play there KQ or backdoor hearts on this flop, so if they did bet those hands on the flop then i have know idea what they would be leading the turn with after checking the flop, i think vs the BU though i would check this flop with those hands and lead the turn and i would bet flop vs other position that i doubt flat stuff like 67 and 9T and what not.
 
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Wed Jan 22, 2014, 08:21 AM
(#9)
pekmansick's Avatar
Since: Oct 2013
Posts: 95
Quote:
Originally Posted by ArtySmokesPS View Post
Sounds like you're "raising for info", which I think is a leak. Just call and let villain continue to value-bet or bluff with worse. If he's ahead, you lose the minimum by keeping the pot under control. In short, don't bloat the pot with one pair.
what is raising for info? why is it so bad? I think I am doing it a lot when I'm not sure what my opponent is doing...
I know this is out of subject but...
 
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Wed Jan 22, 2014, 08:27 AM
(#10)
ArtySmokesPS's Avatar
Since: Oct 2011
Posts: 7,359
Dave's blog explains it better than I can. http://www.pokerschoolonline.com/blo...or-Information


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Wed Jan 22, 2014, 10:05 AM
(#11)
pekmansick's Avatar
Since: Oct 2013
Posts: 95
thanks Arty
 
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Wed Jan 22, 2014, 10:56 PM
(#12)
pockettones's Avatar
Since: Mar 2013
Posts: 151
I believe this is situational. If the player is unknown or a good reg, I think calling here is best as we dont want to be put in a tough spot with tptk, but against a fish I do think making a raise here is +ev as he can call with worse queens and a lot of draws, and if he reraises I think this is an easy fold especially if he is the passive sort.

Last edited by pockettones; Wed Jan 22, 2014 at 11:18 PM..
 

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