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Fullhouse vs fullhouse

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Fullhouse vs fullhouse - Tue Jan 21, 2014, 01:58 PM
(#1)
Pokermancer8's Avatar
Since: Jan 2014
Posts: 35


1. In hero position would you feel what villain has?
2. Was villain overcautious or a trapper?
3. Did villain played well?
4. Did villain knew he might lose?
5. Did villain tried to trap me?

6. Was my play at minimum loss when bidding good enough?
7. Was i carefull enough? Despite lucky river card?
8. Where would you folded or tried all-in as hero and at which time?
 
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Tue Jan 21, 2014, 02:16 PM
(#2)
ArtySmokesPS's Avatar
Since: Oct 2011
Posts: 7,359
Most of your "problems" in this hand stem from you playing passively pre-flop. You should be raising to isolate the first limper. When you do that, you don't have to worry about hands like 95 being in the pot. With a pre-flop raise, you seize the initiative and can win the pot with a continuation bet on the flop even if you don't hit the board.


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Tue Jan 21, 2014, 03:17 PM
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JWK24's Avatar
Since: Jun 2010
Posts: 24,836
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Hi Pokermancer8!

This hand is played very passively by all involved. Passive poker is not a winning long-term strategy. I want to be playing TAG (tight-aggressive) poker.

With AK and a limper in front of me, I need to make a standard raise, which for this blind level is to 2.2BB+1BB for each limper. Due to this, I will raise to 6400. I don't want to bet less than this or I can be giving the opp the correct odds to try to outdraw me. If I do so and lose, it's my own fault that I lose the hand.
The villain preflop, whether it's limped or raised... 95o is a junk hand and should be mucked preflop.

The flop misses my AK, but the villain flops a full house. With AK, when it checks to me, I'm going to check behind, as I have nothing but A high in a 4-way flop.
If I flopped the full house, I absolutely cannot check here. I need to make a standard value bet. Bets postflop need to be sized based on the size of the pot, number of opps and board texture. With 3 opps in the pot, with a full house, I cannot bet less than 3/4 pot. Once again, if I bet less than 3/4 here, I'm possibly giving the opps the correct odds to outdraw me and if they do so, it'd be my own fault that I lose.

The turn completes the flush, but does give me two pair. Now, an opp makes an abnormally small bet. I'm just going to call here, as I do have a hand with showdown value, but may not be the best hand. If I raise here, since a standard bet is 3/4 pot, I would need to raise by 3/4 pot and my hand is not strong enough to do so. Once again, I cannot raise to less.
The opp now raises (smaller than normal, but still a considerable bet. With this wet of a board, I need to fold my AK here, as I am most likely not the best hand. I want to be putting my chips into the pot when I'm ahead, not when I'm most likely behind.
I definitely do not want to re-raise, as a standard re-raise amount is to between 3X the previous bet and a pot-sized bet. Any of these will pot-commit me (make me put over 1/3 of my remaining chips into the pot), so I would need to shove... and I don't want to shove when I can easily be behind.

On the river, with the top full house, I'm going to bet whatever I think the other guy will call.

The key here is to make standard bets and raises and not to play passive poker. 59 should have folded to the preflop raise that AK should have made and AK should have folded to the pot-sized bet that 59 should have made on the flop.

Hope this helps and good luck at the tables.

John (JWK24)


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Tue Jan 21, 2014, 03:32 PM
(#4)
Pokermancer8's Avatar
Since: Jan 2014
Posts: 35
THanks! I will have to start making notes on my passive strong hands getting outdrawn list so i can feel this statement being a reality where you make others fold medium hands to get those lucky draws later..

You and those poker courses telling the same story - dont be passive. Where i do always am in fear not to get all-in by other guys and to stay in the safe zone by lossing minimum with great gand vs good hand.

And secondly im just afraid of scaring* everyone with raising preflop or after flop when i the last 10-20 hands only 5raises were made total by all players combined preflop.(All players passive)

* dont want to get few BB in pot with great preflop hands. So sometimes i ven hope/cheer for other to have something so i can milk him with my checks(as if dont have anything) And if i get very very small pot with strong hand that just makes me anxious to play wider hands and risk more afterwards.. And i am not sure if only beginners feel that way?
 
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Tue Jan 21, 2014, 03:51 PM
(#5)
JWK24's Avatar
Since: Jun 2010
Posts: 24,836
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Hi Pokermancer8!

Slowplaying hands in NLHE is a recipe for disaster. Players will stay in with garbage hands and keep outdrawing us, because they will get the correct odds to do so, by slowplaying.

It's something that I avoid, unless I have a specific read on the opp that they will continue to make the bets for me (which will only be a very, very small % of the time).

John (JWK24)


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