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10Nl 6-max Zoom JJ

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10Nl 6-max Zoom JJ - Fri Jan 24, 2014, 01:17 PM
(#1)
fp_boss77's Avatar
Since: Jan 2012
Posts: 490
Hi, villain is a Reg playing 28/18/5 over 1113 hands.
vs 3B (25 hands):
Call 24%
Fold 64%
raise(4B) 12%

I've 3B a few hands the day before. I think he knows I'm quite aggressive.

It's ok to stack in this spot ? What about calling the 4B?



Cheers!
 
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Fri Jan 24, 2014, 01:59 PM
(#2)
mike2198's Avatar
Since: Jan 2013
Posts: 1,485
Whats his CO open?
 
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Fri Jan 24, 2014, 02:08 PM
(#3)
spand42's Avatar
Since: Sep 2010
Posts: 1,496
Given the dynamic, I like your play and I'm willing to stack off with JJ.

4B of 12% is ridiculously high and that way more than QQ+. Against top 12%, JJ is 60% favourite and you've probably got a ton of fold equity, so well played.
 
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Fri Jan 24, 2014, 02:30 PM
(#4)
mike2198's Avatar
Since: Jan 2013
Posts: 1,485
You know his 4bet is 12%, that dont mean his 4bet range is 12%?

His calling 24% of hands as well is that CO vs BU so he is calling 24% OOP so his 4bet range surely cant be that wide.
 
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Fri Jan 24, 2014, 02:51 PM
(#5)
spand42's Avatar
Since: Sep 2010
Posts: 1,496
Quote:
Originally Posted by mike2198 View Post
You know his 4bet is 12%, that dont mean his 4bet range is 12%?
Yes you're spot on, I misinterpreted the stats he gave. TheLangolier also picked up on this and I've spoken about this hand with him.

12% of 25 hands is 3/25 hands. Like Mike asked in his earlier question, knowing his CO steal stat would be helpful to draw up a more accurate 4Bet range.

If we assume his CO steal range is 18% (i.e. no different from his normal PFR), then 12% of this range is only premiums which JJ does really badly against, so just calling the raise in position would be a better way to go as we can't continue profitably vs a 4Bet.

However if he is stealing pretty wide from the CO (like 45%+), then you can consider 3Betting and stacking off especially with the dynamic you described.
 
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Fri Jan 24, 2014, 03:05 PM
(#6)
mike2198's Avatar
Since: Jan 2013
Posts: 1,485
Ok cool, you know his call is 24% if his vp was 28% in CO then would that mean hes flatting nearly 7% of hands OOP so maybe all pocket pairs and suited broadways.

So to get that 7% i took 28 * 24 =6.72 hands he calls with and his 4bet range is 3%.

Is that right?
 
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Fri Jan 24, 2014, 03:55 PM
(#7)
Shichi-77's Avatar
Since: Jul 2012
Posts: 607
I think it's 12% of PFR18% it's 2.16%.or you can take 4bet by position stat, it's more accurate . because in PT4 4bet stat is calculated that way, he raised PF, got 3bet and after he 4bet.

Last edited by Shichi-77; Fri Jan 24, 2014 at 03:57 PM..
 
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Fri Jan 24, 2014, 04:02 PM
(#8)
mike2198's Avatar
Since: Jan 2013
Posts: 1,485
Quote:
Originally Posted by Shichi-77 View Post
I think it's 12% of PFR18% it's 2.16%.or you can take 4bet by position stat, it's more accurate . because in PT4 4bet stat is calculated that way, he raised PF, got 3bet and after he 4bet.

Cheers yh it would help that im using PFR and not VP lol.
 
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Fri Jan 24, 2014, 08:04 PM
(#9)
fp_boss77's Avatar
Since: Jan 2012
Posts: 490
Hi, his CO open is 25%.

All the notes I have on him is that he called a 3B OOP lol
and that he called a 3B IP on BT vs blinds 3B with TT (which doesn't help much I guess).
 
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Sat Jan 25, 2014, 07:37 AM
(#10)
fp_boss77's Avatar
Since: Jan 2012
Posts: 490
I guess that if he's 3B range is 3% I can shove JJ here for profit.
 
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Sat Jan 25, 2014, 08:25 AM
(#11)
Shichi-77's Avatar
Since: Jul 2012
Posts: 607
Quote:
Originally Posted by fp_boss77 View Post
I guess that if he's 3B range is 3% I can shove JJ here for profit.
I wouldn't
MP2 54.86% 53.29% 1.57% 99+, AKs
MP3 45.14% 43.56% 1.57% JJ
 
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Sat Jan 25, 2014, 09:43 AM
(#12)
birdayy's Avatar
Since: Sep 2012
Posts: 1,179
Tonne of fold equity? Really?

He 4b (a horrid sizing) $4.

Lets be clear. You have no fold equity.

That being said I think as regs get more aggressive you have to start having a wider range of value hands you are willing to go with btn vs co, and if we don't have JJ in that range we won't be able to bluff 3b enough.
 
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Sat Jan 25, 2014, 03:51 PM
(#13)
GarethC23's Avatar
Since: Nov 2011
Posts: 1,273
Quote:
Originally Posted by fp_boss77 View Post
Hi, his CO open is 25%.

All the notes I have on him is that he called a 3B OOP lol
and that he called a 3B IP on BT vs blinds 3B with TT (which doesn't help much I guess).
but it does help. it means he would have called your 3b with TT. Which means you are never getting it in 80/20 favourite here.

I wouldnt have expected you to without that read, but that read reinforces the read you should have.

When a villain 4x's in the CO and they aren't a known recreational/weak/maniac player, I would be very worried about 3b AK/QQ for value and facing a 4b. So as mentioned above, the play preflop is call and facing the $4 four-bet we shoud just give it up.

Re 4b range and 4b % are different

as its been mentioned above,

4b range = raise 1st % * 4b % (in that spot to be precise, or just generally to be imprecise)

So 4b range = 0.25 * 0.12
= 0.03%
= JJ+AK

But since we block JJ it effectively equals QQ+AK. Against which we have 36% equity and we have no fold equity v $4. So def a fold.

Hope this makes sense to everyone
 

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