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Vote: Open League Tournament Access to PokerSchool Members ONLY.

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Vote: Open League Tournament Access to PokerSchool Members ONLY. - Sun Feb 16, 2014, 03:46 PM
(#1)
TrippyTricks's Avatar
Since: Dec 2013
Posts: 33
Vote: Open League Tournament Access to PokerSchool Members ONLY.

Hi All,

Just a small introduction, my name is Josh and live in Toronto, Canada. I've been playing PokerSchool tournaments only since January 2014, but do have 5 years of experience playing poker behind me.

I am creating this thread to address this concern, I have for the Open League Tournaments with Poker School. My objective this month is to make the top 10 in the leader board and have been playing around 40 tournaments since the beginning of the month and currently sitting on 2249 points which puts me in 100th position. As you know the league is tough, many of you spend countless hours trying to accumulate those precious points and make it in the leader board. You try to play your best, even try to play the ''Simplified Strategy'' by fear of loosing those precious points. On the other hand you have careless players not even members of the PokerSchool moving all in pre-flop with weak hands and eating your blinds if you fall on the rong table, and leaving you no space to play in the tournaments because they are full within 5min. If I can resume this, it's not fair for the people that are trying to earn points trying to play their best and learn the game.

The tournaments are a great challenge, the algorithm is great, I think the website is amazing, stats are very cool too. But to my firm belief of the success of the Open League Tournaments, I think we should limit access to none PokerSchool member for the three following reasons.

1. Careless allins 75% of the time from non-members, punishing good league players and their hard earned points. (Because they have nothing to loose, but not us.)
2. Leaving no space for players in the tournament trying to make it in the leader board.
3. For the number of hours we spend in these tournaments, and efforts you make for the PokerSchool look great. It's rewarding to nobody promoting carelessness of players that aren't members and believe that poker is like lottery.

So I will vote YES, for those three reasons why I think we should limit the access to non-member.

PLEASE POST YOUR VOTES: NO if you think we should keep the league to non-members open, YES if you think members of the PokerSchool only can play in the tournaments.

Think right, and good luck to all.

----------------------------

I also posted in the Pokerschool Open League Thread
http://www.pokerschoolonline.com/for...545#post489545


Facts:
- 2-3/9 of players are sitting out in these tournaments, some of them probably not even members at PokerSchool.
- The very first hand of the tournament your garanteed at least two allins, within the first 10 played hands you garanteed 5 allins, within the 40-50min your garanteed 25-35% all ins plus an additional 5-10% 10-bets preflop.
- Within 15-25min nearly half of the 10k players are gone.
- It takes aprox. 45-55min to reach 2500players in which most the people sitting out are blinded out slowly after that, by that time blinds are high enough if you havn't won a hand your out before them. Which in a general rule, you gotta play to win and not the other way around.
- The range of an all in donkey is anywhere from 72 to AA, and YES they are willing to commit their stacks.
- If you are lucky enough to have reached 10k within 5min of the tournament with allins, 2/4 chances are you will 4-bet bluff, leaving no chance for the average stack to compete without committing his stack to the pot.
- The final table is usually for the lucky and skilled, to reach the Open League Tournaments final table you need to go all in 10/100.
- When a bad player looses a big pot, you are guaranteed 1.5/2 times the following hand an all in from him.
- It takes 5hours to finish the tournament, 5hours of insanity! The average top 500 player in the leader board of the Open League will play an average of 4 tournaments per day, 2hours per tournament which is the average 8hours a 9 to 5 worker those, except only the 1st place: gets rewarded his monthly salary. 2nd place: has been left a salary after tax. 3rd: a full-time job paid part-time. 4th & 5th: just the tips. And all the rest: payed the bills and left with PEANUTS!

Plus we are supporters of PokerSchool, not our guest.

Now explain me why we shouldn't have any privileges? Plus it will only encourage people to join the PokerSchool and bring more to the community.

Proposal for the Open League Tournaments:
Option 1: 10000 entries max, Turbo, 3000 stacks, PSO members only.
(I believe this will make improvements)

Option 2: 15000 entries max, Hyper-Turbo, 300 stacks, Open to all.
(If people want to play all in, then I really think this is the best option)

Option 3: 10000 entries max, Hyper-Turbo, 1500 stacks, Open to all.

Option 4: 5000 entries max, Slow, 1500 stacks, PSO members only.

Last edited by TrippyTricks; Mon Feb 17, 2014 at 04:13 PM..
 
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Sun Feb 16, 2014, 03:47 PM
(#2)
TrippyTricks's Avatar
Since: Dec 2013
Posts: 33
YES
 
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Sun Feb 16, 2014, 03:50 PM
(#3)
joshloo's Avatar
Since: Feb 2014
Posts: 1
YES

PS: No more eating my blinds
 
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Sun Feb 16, 2014, 04:35 PM
(#4)
Spartan642's Avatar
Since: Jul 2011
Posts: 74
I am currently 12th and it is now a nightmare trying to get points ! YESSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSS.
 
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Sun Feb 16, 2014, 05:00 PM
(#5)
GamblingProp's Avatar
Since: Jan 2013
Posts: 714
I am usually for openness in everything, especially in learning poker, but I don't really understand why players who don't compete in the skill league should play the tournament so...
Yes
 
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Sun Feb 16, 2014, 05:52 PM
(#6)
TrippyTricks's Avatar
Since: Dec 2013
Posts: 33
Quote:
Originally Posted by Spartan642 View Post
I am currently 12th and it is now a nightmare trying to get points ! YESSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSS.
It's a nightmare for everyone..including me. And competition is getting much tougher compared to a few years ago from what I hear because more people are competing, it's about time they change their policy. NO MORE CARELESS AND ABUSIVE INTRUDERS, WE'VE HAD ENOUGH!!! Leave the space for the real players here, theres enough freerolls on PokerStars to play.

Last edited by TrippyTricks; Sun Feb 16, 2014 at 06:31 PM..
 
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Sun Feb 16, 2014, 05:59 PM
(#7)
Grade b's Avatar
Since: Jun 2010
Posts: 3,604
No.

We do have series with added prizes for members only, not to mention Other non poker playing competitions, one of the Goals of the leagues as I understand it is to send players to PSO.

1. What is a careless all-in? How does it punish good players? It means you need to be more aware of who you are playing rather than everyone playing the ABC TAG style that many players think everyone should play As for it makes it hard for you to get points......then you need to adapt.

2.set an alarm

3. See point 1

Grade b


I am always ready to learn although I do not always like being taught. ~Winston Churchill

13 Time Bracelet Winner



Last edited by Grade b; Sun Feb 16, 2014 at 06:05 PM.. Reason: answered the 3 key points in OP
 
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Sun Feb 16, 2014, 06:03 PM
(#8)
HAPPYSAP's Avatar
Since: Apr 2010
Posts: 458
I say NO It's A MINE FIELD OUT THERE. Get through that AND U GET THROUGH ANYTHING and its a learning in its self. I think thats the point of it. gl in all guys. Life is not easy and neither is the open. just me i think . HAPPY
 
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Sun Feb 16, 2014, 06:54 PM
(#9)
sparkes25's Avatar
Since: Feb 2013
Posts: 645
make your mind up... you say the players go all in to much and then say you have to play for 9 hours a day to win..... if there was only league members playing it would take far longer to get points as players would not be playing so badly.


the idea of the league is not to win, its to get promoted to the prem, where all players are league members and the games are far more like real mtt's, also the money is a lot more.

i say leave the leagues as they are.
 
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Sun Feb 16, 2014, 07:16 PM
(#10)
SasoriHayate's Avatar
Since: Mar 2012
Posts: 101
BronzeStar
Playing with pso non members is definetly +EV for me. I say NO.
 
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Sun Feb 16, 2014, 07:29 PM
(#11)
EdinFreeMan's Avatar
Since: Feb 2010
Posts: 4,540
I would say NO at the moment.

When the USA get back in here I would probably say YES then.

For now I am happy with the fields that turn up - 2 tourneys per day usually don't fill up to 10K.

Once the US contingent are back in the fold I think there will be large enough fields to exclude the non-registered with PSO/Intellipoker etc members.

For now the status quo suits.

Ed


4 Time Bracelet Winner


 
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Sun Feb 16, 2014, 08:29 PM
(#12)
666_Gunnar's Avatar
Since: May 2013
Posts: 24
I vote NO!

The open league, even how frustrating it might be at times, teaches patience, position, and even teaches you that you can not always expect to win with monster hands... These hands will not win 10/10 times, and when you sitting at the tables for tournament after tournament and hour after hour in the open league you actually have a chance to learn this - That's what this league should be about!

Trippy, If you have 5 years of poker experience in you bag and don't have the patience for the open league, there are lot's of other tournaments, sit-n-god and cash games out there.

My tip is that you continue with your current league play here in the open to win a ticket to the PL - In the PL you will have almost exactly what you are asking for with your vote with a max number of 1500 players...

Good luck
 
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Sun Feb 16, 2014, 09:07 PM
(#13)
TrippyTricks's Avatar
Since: Dec 2013
Posts: 33
Quote:
Originally Posted by 666_Gunnar View Post
I vote NO!

The open league, even how frustrating it might be at times, teaches patience, position, and even teaches you that you can not always expect to win with monster hands... These hands will not win 10/10 times, and when you sitting at the tables for tournament after tournament and hour after hour in the open league you actually have a chance to learn this - That's what this league should be about!

Trippy, If you have 5 years of poker experience in you bag and don't have the patience for the open league, there are lot's of other tournaments, sit-n-god and cash games out there.

My tip is that you continue with your current league play here in the open to win a ticket to the PL - In the PL you will have almost exactly what you are asking for with your vote with a max number of 1500 players...

Good luck
Quote:
Originally Posted by HAPPYSAP View Post
I say NO It's A MINE FIELD OUT THERE. Get through that AND U GET THROUGH ANYTHING and its a learning in its self. I think thats the point of it. gl in all guys. Life is not easy and neither is the open. just me i think . HAPPY
I respect all your opinions on these matters. I don't necessarily agree with the fact that enduring all in's all the time helps improve your over all skill, your patience perhaps but you can do without it as well (Play The Big 4.40 or 2.20 during 7hours, same deal). Open League is unusual, so the practice you have here is almost applicable no where else except in other free roll which won't help you make a living. It's probably the objective behind the Open League, what I'm trying to point out is maybe if we had more people actually caring about scoring it would be better, more rewarding.

There is a saying, ''To become a better player, you must compete with better players.''
(Better players care, bad players don't care)

A other point, playing lottery teaches you nothing! It's just pure fun. That fun turns into frustration for other players, meaning only the bad players are rewarded even if they loose the pot.

The lessons I can pull from this is: know your range of hands, not play too many hands with an average stack, not bluff with an average stack to much, built your stack slowly and of course patience. Odds are stacked against you considering the majority of players don't understand this, not very rewarding to be a good player in these circumstances. For the beginners with lots of time on their hands, maybe.

I firmly believe, it would improve the overall game if you could play a hand until the river without an all in. No need to bet all your stack like most people do.

All the best
 
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Sun Feb 16, 2014, 09:20 PM
(#14)
666_Gunnar's Avatar
Since: May 2013
Posts: 24
Trippy,

I believe that even if you stopped playing the open league today, your current score could award you a ticket to the PL for march..! The PL is exactly what you are asking for, so why not be happy with that?

You can rest you mind for two more weeks then go at it with the 1500 PSO members who will compete for the PL top places. Just make sure to make 150 VPPs this months if you want to compete in the higher price range..

You see, in the end this is what it all is about - to motivate you to spend money on PokerStars.. If you play well and make the right choices you might use it to your benefit and win some as well - isn't that what we all want..?

Cheers and good luck
 
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Mon Feb 17, 2014, 03:55 AM
(#15)
GamblingProp's Avatar
Since: Jan 2013
Posts: 714
How about we do the exact opposite?
We make the Premier open to anyone who has got 150vpps and finished in the top x of the qualifiers, while not requesting from them to be part of a pokerschool.
If it is +EV in the Open it should be +Ev in the Premier as well, right?
Or no we just leave it as it is, because we fear change and stuff.
I think the Open League is a bad place to learn poker at the moment and anyone who supports the counter argument is on denial, or has a subjective opinion on the matter.
Patience should not be learned in a turbo tournament and we can all agree that the Open League tournament is not a deep stacked, slow structured one.
But then again the articles and the training in the various pokerschools is more than enough to cover that, and you can find a lot of information on how to beat that League.
Although the top players in the leaderboard probably won't be the most skilled ones, but those who can take the most advantage of making points by slow folding and etc.
But if the majority of the pokerschool players has no objection to that, I guess the Open League is perfect the way it is.

TLDR cliffs: Just leave it that way.

Last edited by GamblingProp; Mon Feb 17, 2014 at 03:58 AM..
 
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Mon Feb 17, 2014, 04:52 AM
(#16)
TrippyTricks's Avatar
Since: Dec 2013
Posts: 33
Just to expose a little more the reality here, I was able to find the stats of someone sitting out 100% of the tournaments, and my own.
I have spent countless hours trying to earn my points and on the other hand you could just sit out and earn points without a problem, and thats when you realize things aren't right.


My own stats spending countless hours trying to earn 2201 points




Stats of someone sitting out spending 0 hours and earning 1844 points



Last edited by TrippyTricks; Mon Feb 17, 2014 at 05:01 AM..
 
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Mon Feb 17, 2014, 05:01 AM
(#17)
bhoylegend's Avatar
Since: Jun 2012
Posts: 2,261
My own personal preference would be to see the leagues abolished entirely and the $44,000 used for other promotions.

I know a lot of people do set a lot of importance in the leagues but frankly, I don't see the attraction, and the format of them seems to annoy a lot of people.

I can't remember the last one I played. It's so much time and effort and as shown above, you dont even have to play at all to make a decent stab, fair enough the sitter outter might not actually progress to the premier but they do affect the in game dynamics.

I think the money could be aimed at attracting recreational players to games.

So I guess I abstain on this particular question and spoil my ballot by writing what I have above.
 
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Mon Feb 17, 2014, 05:03 AM
(#18)
royalraise85's Avatar
Since: Jul 2011
Posts: 26,024
(Community Coordinator)
Quote:
Originally Posted by TrippyTricks View Post
Just to expose a little more the reality here, I was able to find the stats of someone sitting out 100% of the tournaments
How exactly did you 'find' this? The 'My Stats' feature is only visible to the owner of the account?

Raiser


Moderator

Bracelet Winner


 
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Mon Feb 17, 2014, 07:18 AM
(#19)
666_Gunnar's Avatar
Since: May 2013
Posts: 24
Trippy,

You have played your tournaments, and as I mentioned before, you have made points enough to qualify for the PL (approximately 2000). The guy who is only sitting out have only made 1844 points, which will not take him to the PL. Since the scoring changes when you climb the ranks, the player only sitting out will not have a chance of getting close to the PL, and he/she is therefor not a problem.

I say it again - if you don't like the open league, then stay out of it. You can do this in two ways: Win a seat in the PL, or just don't play it. Spend a buck or two and win some cash instead of chasing some measly points here in the open. You seem to believe that Pokerstars should just through some free cash at you without having to work for it...

Yes, if you want to reach the high ranks in the PSO open league you have to adapt to the somewhat crazy format. You have to play your game different from what a normal poker tournament might enable you to. So what - adapt! In any tournament, cash game, texas no limit, omaha, you have to adapt to the format. The format of the open is fairly clear - you have tons of fish and donks - you know that slow playing will help you over time - you know that making it into the top 10 is much about being lucky with the few hands you play - you know a lot about the open league - so ADAPT...

Here is a challenge for you - I am currently close to your rank after bad day with a few bad beats (and a major tilt...). Let's see who makes it the furthest up the leaderboard from here on! We will both most likely be in the PL next week, so then we have a chance to battle it out there as well - You have 5 years experience, and I feel that I have learned one or two things through PSO since I started with poker last year. Have you got what it takes to adapt? ;-)

Cheers,
Gunnar
 
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Mon Feb 17, 2014, 07:41 AM
(#20)
BUZZLIYEAR's Avatar
Since: Mar 2011
Posts: 217
is it hard to come 1st in the open. yes is it hard to get to the prem. no. i can show eny one how to do it is tag a good way to play the open ? yes play tight and good reeds as for the yes or no . pso will not change the open so let the free roll show go on.
 

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