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50nl - Triple w/ QJs

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50nl - Triple w/ QJs - Fri Apr 04, 2014, 11:30 AM
(#1)
birdayy's Avatar
Since: Sep 2012
Posts: 1,179
Stats

BB: $50.00 - VPIP: 22, PFR: 19, 3B: 9, AF: 4.0, Hands: 122
UTG: $61.20 - VPIP: 34, PFR: 16, 3B: 5, AF: 9.5, Hands: 119
MP: $137.29 - VPIP: 35, PFR: 30, 3B: 10, AF: 1.9, Hands: 114
CO: $50.41 - VPIP: 28, PFR: 22, 3B: 0, AF: 3.1, Hands: 124
BTN: $46.25 - VPIP: 19, PFR: 15, 3B: 5, AF: 4.5, Hands: 100



Pre is not standard (for me). I 3b because BB was very squeeze happy and the CO had a >75% f3b. Because of this I would tend to 3b most of my continuing range.

I think QJ is one of the best bluff candidates on this board possible. We block villains main bluff catchers (AQ, AJ), and I would expect (80% certainty) that this villain would 4b/GII with AK.

I have AK, AQ, A5s, A4s and 99 for value here, so i'd say that QJs is a pretty good candidate to have in my bluffing range.

Thoughts?
 
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Fri Apr 04, 2014, 12:37 PM
(#2)
bhoylegend's Avatar
Since: Jun 2012
Posts: 2,261
Everything you've said in your post makes sense.

And, I like the line, if we are confident he is the sort of player who can find a fold with strong hands here, then following through on the river seems sensible.

What hands were you trying to get to fold apart from air?
 
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Fri Apr 04, 2014, 01:07 PM
(#3)
GarethC23's Avatar
Since: Nov 2011
Posts: 1,273
I think everything you said in your post makes sense as well. However I don't think you should have a bluff range in this spot without a deeper read on villain's tendencies. People really don't like folding top pair in three-bet pots.

Also, what is his turn calling range? If you block AJ/AQ, what does his range then become heavier in if you block it?

What I mean by that is if his entire turn calling range were to be AJ/AQ the fact that you block some % of those hands would not be pertinent in justifying a bluff since it would not affect the proportions of his range.

Therefore, let's think of what his total turn calling range is in this spot and then what we want to do against it. Bluffs have to be believed to get through.
 
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Fri Apr 04, 2014, 02:32 PM
(#4)
NaturoSasuki's Avatar
Since: Dec 2013
Posts: 348
main question dere iz if u will betz OTF so small amount if u had AK/AQ/A5/99?
 
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Fri Apr 04, 2014, 03:11 PM
(#5)
spand42's Avatar
Since: Sep 2010
Posts: 1,496
Quote:
Originally Posted by birdayy View Post
CO: $50.41 - VPIP: 28, PFR: 22, 3B: 0, AF: 3.1, Hands: 124

I would expect (80% certainty) that this villain would 4b/GII with AK.
If this villain has never 3Bet over a small, but fairly significant sample, what makes you so confident that he'd 4Bet AK in position against an aggressive opponent who's going to show up with a fair bit of crap?
 
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Fri Apr 04, 2014, 03:12 PM
(#6)
ArtySmokesPS's Avatar
Since: Oct 2011
Posts: 7,346
Naturo, half pot on the flop is fairly standard for your entire range in 3-bet pots once you get beyond 5NL.

I like this hand up til the river. I think we should check and give up there, instead of firing $30 into the abyss.
It would be nice in theory to have an unexploitable/balanced range on the river of something like 66% nuts, 33% air, to make it impossible for villain to make money in the long run, whether he calls or folds, but for one thing it's hard to construct a range containing that much air on this board, and for another, you have almost no fold equity, so it's kind of pointless/spewy to have any bluffs in your range in this spot.


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Fri Apr 04, 2014, 04:59 PM
(#7)
mike2198's Avatar
Since: Jan 2013
Posts: 1,485
What do we think of the turn barrel vs this guys 3bet calling range? I cant see enough of his hands folding to a turn barrel.

Would you say that this looks like his flatting range IP? 88-JJ AJ+ ATs KQ KJs

So i just figured his flatting around 5% of hands, im not quite sure what he is actually flatting but just thought that on the turn were not folding much of anything apart from JJ TT ?and we block JJ as well. Obviously he is folding some of that range on the flop as well.

Basically what im getting at is we shouldn't be barreling backdoor draws OOP 24/7? We still need some fold equity to barrel profitably unless we knew he is folding the river a high % of the time. So vs me that would be very profitable shipping the river if your unknown to me or very tight because i would fold pretty much everything.

Last edited by mike2198; Fri Apr 04, 2014 at 05:01 PM..
 
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Fri Apr 04, 2014, 04:59 PM
(#8)
mike2198's Avatar
Since: Jan 2013
Posts: 1,485
Double post
 
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Sat Apr 05, 2014, 01:29 AM
(#9)
NaturoSasuki's Avatar
Since: Dec 2013
Posts: 348
Quote:
Originally Posted by mike2198 View Post
What do we think of the turn barrel vs this guys 3bet calling range? I cant see enough of his hands folding to a turn barrel.

Would you say that this looks like his flatting range IP? 88-JJ AJ+ ATs KQ KJs

So i just figured his flatting around 5% of hands, im not quite sure what he is actually flatting but just thought that on the turn were not folding much of anything apart from JJ TT ?and we block JJ as well. Obviously he is folding some of that range on the flop as well.

Basically what im getting at is we shouldn't be barreling backdoor draws OOP 24/7? We still need some fold equity to barrel profitably unless we knew he is folding the river a high % of the time. So vs me that would be very profitable shipping the river if your unknown to me or very tight because i would fold pretty much everything.
i guess he barrels small bluff OTT as blockbet so he doesnt need to checkcall bigbet with his drawz
 
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Sat Apr 05, 2014, 09:03 AM
(#10)
ArtySmokesPS's Avatar
Since: Oct 2011
Posts: 7,346
Quote:
Originally Posted by mike2198 View Post
What do we think of the turn barrel vs this guys 3bet calling range? I cant see enough of his hands folding to a turn barrel.
I think we can fold out any hand worse than AK on the turn. Indeed, I think it's probably a mistake to call the turn barrel with AQ, let alone QQ-TT.

All that said, (and contrary to typical TAG advice about stacking off top pair in 3-bet pots) I'd often be checking the flop with all my aces, because I want to keep worse hands (especially QQ/JJ) in the pot. Any c-bet here is gonna be quite polarized, with several bluffs in it, so you might get floated often.


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