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2nl zoom overpair on dry board

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2nl zoom overpair on dry board - Tue Apr 08, 2014, 10:03 AM
(#1)
Praydk's Avatar
Since: Mar 2012
Posts: 504

14/9 AF 1.26; raise flop 10%
1k+ hands
Didn't want to 3bet the UTG nit cause I will have to fold to a 4b.
So I kept his range wide, now how can I extract value on the flop? or get away from my KK?
 
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Tue Apr 08, 2014, 10:18 AM
(#2)
bhoylegend's Avatar
Since: Jun 2012
Posts: 2,261
Quote:
Originally Posted by Praydk View Post
Didn't want to 3bet the UTG nit cause I will have to fold to a 4b.
I don't understand why we donk flop if we aren't 3betting pre, unless we were just looking to avoid an Ace and then stack off on flop?

If we are scared of his nittiness then I think, given the reason we just called pre, we should just call down depending on his further action. We can get value from QQ/JJ that isn't deterred by an Ace flopping and possibly avoid losing a stack to AA. We're going to be OOP so its going to be difficult to play without initiative.
 
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Tue Apr 08, 2014, 11:43 AM
(#3)
dirt eh's Avatar
Since: Jun 2010
Posts: 1,274
Why did we DONKout into a "nit" if we didn't want to 3bet them? As played... I don't know. It's 2NL! Just get the money in preflop with KK.

OTF: I don't know, I don't like it. I would probably just call after it goes bet, raise, raise, raise to 0.62. Then shove turn I guess.
 
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Tue Apr 08, 2014, 01:48 PM
(#4)
CrazYJohnnie's Avatar
Since: Apr 2012
Posts: 641
So you want to keep his range wide preflop, but try to narrow it down to only hands that beat you postflop. You do not want to 3bet because villain will 4bet, but if you assume that villain only does this with AA(if you are so willing to fold KK) then i guess we can 3bet this villain very wide and perfect since when he does not 4bet his range is capped.
 
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Tue Apr 08, 2014, 02:16 PM
(#5)
PSO-xflixx's Avatar
Since: Jun 2011
Posts: 1,119
(Live Trainer)
If you assume his 4bet means aces all the time and he will call with worse, why not 3-bet for value?

What I mean is: Since villain seems to be really tight on a decent sample you have a pretty easy game against him mostly. If you only call KK pre and then escalate the pot postflop the situation is not gonna get a whole lot better than preflop (a tad worse even as he now can have 44/88 too).

So if you still feel like deviating from the standard preflop play I would think about how to make most money postflop from his worse hands. If he only continues by calling worse against your raises then you can easily get away from the hand if he comes back over the top.


Live Trainer



 
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Tue Apr 08, 2014, 02:56 PM
(#6)
Praydk's Avatar
Since: Mar 2012
Posts: 504
Quote:
Originally Posted by PSO-xflixx View Post
If you assume his 4bet means aces all the time and he will call with worse, why not 3-bet for value?
Idk, everyone is saying don't 3b if you're gonna fold to a 4b, so that's what I did. This is confusing.
So do I just call down if I decide to call the flop, and if I decide to raise - fold to a 3b?
 
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Tue Apr 08, 2014, 03:11 PM
(#7)
CrazYJohnnie's Avatar
Since: Apr 2012
Posts: 641
Quote:
Originally Posted by Praydk View Post
Idk, everyone is saying don't 3b if you're gonna fold to a 4b, so that's what I did. This is confusing.
So do I just call down if I decide to call the flop, and if I decide to raise - fold to a 3b?
I dont know if everyone is saying that, but this is not entirely correct+anyone can post their opinion in forums/blogs wherever.
This is how i see it. Say you never fold to 3bets, now i can play value heavy range vs you and you are crushed, if you call your whole opening range. Since you will miss flop very often, you will fold majority flops thus i make money.
When you fold to 3bets often and only 4bet QQ+, AKs, i can 3bet vs you pretty wide and have bluffing range, say complete junk like 96 or blockers, like A5s. I make money when you fold, if you call OOP with AQ and not 4bet you still gonna miss flop a lot and fold.
In between there is a thin line, but if you never 3bet higher level thinker, with bluffs then you become very easy to play against. One play is very profitable vs nitty, not adjusting regs, try to spot villains who will only 4bet or fold, start 3betting them more often.
Nice thread on 3 betting light http://archives1.twoplustwo.com/show...ue#Post7886535
And 3 bet bluffing http://forumserver.twoplustwo.com/15...heory-1153359/

There are number of good discussions on 2+2 about 3 betting simply google it or whatever. Sure, in zoom this is impossible to do, but when i sit down at a regular table i also 3bet some more/less standard playing villains first chance i have some kind of a hand, to see how they react to them.

Last edited by CrazYJohnnie; Tue Apr 08, 2014 at 03:18 PM..
 
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Tue Apr 08, 2014, 03:13 PM
(#8)
A Beatmaker's Avatar
Since: Mar 2013
Posts: 74
Well if his 3bet range is 1% and he folds to 3bet 85% (means tha he just 4bets KK+ or folds) then callling is the best way. He is a nit and he might have problems folding overpairs like 99-QQ why not to x/raise then. As played x/c x/c x/c

Last edited by A Beatmaker; Tue Apr 08, 2014 at 03:19 PM..
 
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Tue Apr 08, 2014, 03:23 PM
(#9)
bhoylegend's Avatar
Since: Jun 2012
Posts: 2,261
Against this guy (Found out who it was), as played, I am folding to the raise of our donk bet.

He calls with the probable nuts, raises with the absolute nuts (And AA/KK) post-flop).

We have two Kings, narrows it down a lot for me to what he has.

I'd still have called down (Not having donked) post-flop just in case he had AA/QQ. If he starts making PSB at any points I am folding.
 

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