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10NL RUSH, AKo 4Bfold

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10NL RUSH, AKo 4Bfold - Wed Apr 16, 2014, 06:59 PM
(#1)
dirt eh's Avatar
Since: Jun 2010
Posts: 1,274
Just seeing how my sizing looks here on this 4Bfold. Please comment, thanks. Not sure what else I could have done in this hand...



saw flop | saw showdown

CO ($13.19) VPIP: 30, PFR: 22, 3B: 3, AF: 0.4, Hands: 90
Button ($16.76) VPIP: 25, PFR: 18, 3B: 13, AF: 7.0, Hands: 44
SB ($10)
BB ($9.63)
Hero (UTG) ($10.39)
MP ($15.49) VPIP: 25, PFR: 16, 3B: 8, AF: 0.0, Hands: 32

Preflop: Hero is UTG with A, K
Hero raises $0.30, MP calls $0.30, CO calls $0.30, Button raises $1.65, 2 folds, Hero raises $2.95, 2 folds, Button raises $14.95, 1 fold

Total pot: $7.25

Results below:
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Wed Apr 16, 2014, 10:24 PM
(#2)
TheLangolier's Avatar
Since: Jun 2010
Posts: 13,487
(Head Trainer)
Hi dirt,

Well, your sizing on the 4b is small, I think we should be around 3.75 here tbh.

As to what else you could have done differently, you could have 5 bet all in, or not 4 bet... either is better than 4b/folding imo.


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Wed Apr 16, 2014, 10:56 PM
(#3)
dirt eh's Avatar
Since: Jun 2010
Posts: 1,274
Pretty sure stacking off there is -EV to the villains 5BAI. I guess I could have 4BAI and maybe won with fold equity. I thought CCing would be bad with 2 players behind to act.
 
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Thu Apr 17, 2014, 11:03 AM
(#4)
TheLangolier's Avatar
Since: Jun 2010
Posts: 13,487
(Head Trainer)
Don't be pretty sure, do the math.

You are essentially turning AK into a bluff by 4-betting then, putting this much money in preflop and folding with a premium hand is rarely the best option. If we were deep stacked it would be ok, but on 100bb's, don't 4-b to 30 of them and fold a premium... math wise this works out to be bad because of the price we're now getting with all the dead money out there.

We have to call 7.44 into a pot of 14.09, almost 2-1 on our money. We need 34.5% to break even on getting in at this point. So how tight is his 5b AI range? If it includes AK, we are always priced in now. QQ+/AK we have 38.8%. Even if you take QQ out, we still have 37% vs. KK+/AK.

If we feel like we have to fold to a 5bet shove here, then we must feel confident he is only getting it in with KK/AA. That's unlikely, but if he's one of those villains that only stacks off AA pre, then 4-betting isn't great because if he's that conservative he will fold a lot of hands we dominate to the 4b, and his 4b calling range will be narrow and heavy in strong hands like AKs, JJ-KK.

It is generally always better to flat a 3B with AK than to 4b/fold it on 100bb stacks. We don't necessarily like having a 4 way pot, but we can't always have everything be perfect. It's really not as bad as it looks though, as there's no guarantee the 2 players behind will over-call us, and some of the range they do so with will include dominated hands like AQ/KQs, etc.


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Thu Apr 17, 2014, 11:40 AM
(#5)
dirt eh's Avatar
Since: Jun 2010
Posts: 1,274
Dave, once again you're right... you're always right! Here's where I was confused. Please read Gareth's comments from this hand.

http://www.pokerschoolonline.com/for...-CO-gotta-dump
 
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Thu Apr 17, 2014, 12:24 PM
(#6)
TheLangolier's Avatar
Since: Jun 2010
Posts: 13,487
(Head Trainer)
I'm certainly not always right! And I can be swayed by a good argument for sure.

Yeah, different spot in the hand Gareth replied to, the small 5b just screams AA imo, players tend to 5b jam with QQ/KK/AK. If we can put the villain squarely on AA then we clearly have a fold at this decision point. And even in that hand Gareth suggests we may have put too much in to fold now as we'll see something stupid like 64s once in a while.


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