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Bet Sizing

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Bet Sizing - Tue May 13, 2014, 07:07 AM
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baud2death's Avatar
Since: Nov 2012
Posts: 1,249
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There are so many conflicting points on bet sizing

Some people suggest 3/4 pot, some 1/2 pot, its recognized that 1/4 or full pot is too much.

So the question is, which is right 3/4 or 1/2?

I feel like there are spots I am being outdrawn on and spots where I am losing value, I am mainly talking about HU situations and am following the line of 50% per street, every street (unless i want to remove a street for Pot Control)

What are anyones thoughts and what evidence/backup do you have have to suggest your way is profitable?
 
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Tue May 13, 2014, 09:10 AM
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mytton's Avatar
Since: Oct 2010
Posts: 181
Obviously there is no simple single answer to this.

Some key rules are:
1 Value bet the highest amount you can expect to get called.
2 Bluff only as much as you need to get a fold.
3 Bet bigger in multiway pots.
4 bet bigger on wet boards, smaller on dry ones
5 don't vary bet size by hand strength or observant players will exploit this.

Of course 1 and 2 can conflict with number 5, so there are compromises to make.

I found coming back to cash games from tournament play, I needed to make a conscious effort to increase my bet sizes as I was missing value by making the smaller bets that had been working for me in the shorter stacked tourney situations.

In a standard flop c bet situation against one opponent, my starting point is 1/2 pot, but I will adjust upwards for a wet board or a loose passive villain. Against a very loose passive fish I will often be potting every street with top pair good kicker or better. On a dry flop against a reg I would bet just over 1/2 pot for both value and bluffs.
 
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Tue May 13, 2014, 09:18 AM
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braveslice's Avatar
Since: Feb 2013
Posts: 568
Great answer.
 
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Tue May 13, 2014, 11:23 AM
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baud2death's Avatar
Since: Nov 2012
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mytton View Post
In a standard flop c bet situation against one opponent, my starting point is 1/2 pot, but I will adjust upwards for a wet board or a loose passive villain. Against a very loose passive fish I will often be potting every street with top pair good kicker or better. On a dry flop against a reg I would bet just over 1/2 pot for both value and bluffs.
I like this part.
Start with 50% and go from there.

I think that I am getting stuck in a few specific scenarios

1) I am looking to pot control a big pair, i should be getting more value and focusing on pot control only with 2nd pair or a big pair that as an over.
2) I am not betting enough to discourage draws
3) I am not getting enough value from hands that will call me for more (ie a set vs TPTK, flatting the flop bet rather than raising it and flatting opponents weak bets rather than raise

I think that I am protecting myself from getting stuck in way-behind situations but I am not taking value advantage of way-ahead situations.

I love the idea of turning up the heat when I have a hand but am working off old education that has me getting the minimum out of opponents rather than getting the maximum. I am acting like 50% per street is aggressive when really full pot would be aggressive.

I came to the conclusion when I thought what I found myself calling when I had a draw.
I was insta-folding to 3/4 - full pot bets to a draw but I found myself seeing 1 more card with a 1/2 bet, its a bad call from a Pot Odds point of view but sometimes its a gamble I will take to take a shot at chipping up in a tournament.

So why on earth am I betting to draw 50% on a draw heavy board and giving my opponents the same "might as well" gamble.

Overall.. I realize that as long as I can avoid scenario's that the Baluga Theorem potrays and be disciplined enough to fold if my strong bets get strong action. In the short-term I might lose some money with being pushed off my bloated pot, I may get stuck in situations where I just can't fold and get stuck behind a cooler but I need to change something and this could be it. But in the long-term the losses, knockouts and bad spots i get myself in are weighed against the ones where i soar into a strong chip lead, then thats +EV

Bet sizing is something I thought I had down but think I have some work to do
 
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Tue May 13, 2014, 12:49 PM
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JWK24's Avatar
Since: Jun 2010
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Bets postflop need to be sized based on the size of the pot, number of opps and board texture.

HERE is a link to a blog that I wrote on the subject.

John (JWK24)


Super-Moderator



6 Time Bracelet Winner


 
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Tue May 13, 2014, 02:47 PM
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baud2death's Avatar
Since: Nov 2012
Posts: 1,249
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JWk24

I have read your article before.. was looking for some different perspectives.
 
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Tue May 13, 2014, 03:40 PM
(#7)
Sandtrap777's Avatar
Since: Jun 2010
Posts: 3,310
Quote:
Originally Posted by JWK24 View Post
Bets postflop need to be sized based on the size of the pot, number of opps and board texture.

John (JWK24)
More to it than that, those are just some of the basics
You must also include, player type, notes on players, stack sizes and also the stake you play at.

None of those rules are a must, you need to adjust
I have my normal bet sizes, but sometimes I lower them or raise them depending on all of the above.

There's NO right sizing, but if you're new to the game, than it's a start

GL
 

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