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I know it's a cooler !

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I know it's a cooler ! - Sat May 24, 2014, 03:25 AM
(#1)
adikumar2010's Avatar
Since: Mar 2011
Posts: 1,094
It's Big $3.30, 10 mins blind level regular structure game.

This was his first hand at my table, so no reads!

I don't think I can ever fold this cooler hand coz he didnt had much left on the turn behind in his stack for me to get away with this hand.

But I want to know how differently should I have played this hand other then shoving on the turn.

PS: Ignore my turn and river bet size, I did it deliberately to entice him to make the call or shove on the turn. Regardless I was pushing all-in on the turn anyhow if I hadn't made baby bet on the turn.

Sorry, this hand was deleted by its owner

STATS :
 
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Sat May 24, 2014, 09:01 AM
(#2)
JWK24's Avatar
Since: Jun 2010
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The hand shows 'no data found'.. please put the hand back in or a correct link.

John (JWK24)


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Sat May 24, 2014, 09:10 AM
(#3)
adikumar2010's Avatar
Since: Mar 2011
Posts: 1,094
It's working for me. Here I will repost it:

 
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Sat May 24, 2014, 09:14 AM
(#4)
JWK24's Avatar
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that hand was already posted here.. is that one wrong then? http://www.pokerschoolonline.com/for...ally-fold-here


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Sat May 24, 2014, 09:16 AM
(#5)
adikumar2010's Avatar
Since: Mar 2011
Posts: 1,094
Yes I posted the cooler hand there by mistake but then it's not letting me edit my post, so I reposted the correct hand on the same thread below if you scroll down a bit.
 
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Sat May 24, 2014, 09:55 AM
(#6)
JWK24's Avatar
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Hi adikumar2010!

I absolutely CANNOT ignore the bet sizes. They are the entire key to the hand, as they are a tell for what the cards are and another example of fancy play syndrome. If I was the opp and did not see your cards in this hand, due to the bet sizes, I basically know exactly what your hand is.

With 45s, when the opps limp, I'm more than happy to check and hope to hit the flop.

I flop bottom pair with a flush and gutshot straight draw. I'm going to make a value bet here and the key is the sizing of it. With 3 opps in the pot, I need to bet 3/4 pot (1046 chips).. no more, no less. Betting less here is a tell for a draw and since I checked preflop, it's either for a straight or a low flush draw, as a high flush draw would have raised preflop. This is critical information for the opp and MUST be taken into consideration.

The turn completes my flush and I once again need to make a standard value bet and since there is one opp, I need to bet 1/2 pot (1448 chips). Here again, the small bet says one of two things. Either I'm on a straight draw that missed or I'm intentionally slowplaying a small flush. This again is critical for the opp because if they are an observant player, they now know that they're ahead! Due to this, if I'm the opp, I'm calling and then getting it in on the river.

The river pairs the board, which is not a good card. The opp here has two pair in their range (although if I was them and had two pair, I'd be raising the flop to price out the draw). The problem now, is that the way this hand played out, the opp also knows that I don't have a full house nor quads, as 2 pair or a set has to bet more on the flop. A vulnerable hand like 2 pair needs to bet the flop to price out the straight and flush draws, so this is NOT a part of my range.. unless I've got no idea on pot odds.

With a flush, I'm getting it in here, but when I do, the opp absolutely knows they're ahead due to the bet tells, so it's an easy call for them.

The problem with this hand is that my cards were turned face-up due to the bet sizes preflop/flop and turn... so the opp knew that they were ahead.

I also don't want to shove the turn, because of two reasons. First, the bet does not pot-commit me (it does the opp, if they know that they are, but does not commit me). Secondly, I can then get off the hand if another club hits, as I'll be beat by a higher flush.

Hope this helps and good luck at the tables.

John (JWK24)


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Sat May 24, 2014, 10:14 AM
(#7)
adikumar2010's Avatar
Since: Mar 2011
Posts: 1,094
If I do the same bet size as u suggested, my turn bet will be an all-in for him.

I bet 1034 on flop and he calls. Pot will be 3487 and he will be left with 1674. Now you said bet 1448. Which means on turn it is basically all-in for him or fold. Coz he will be left with 226 on river. Which neither he is folding if I shove to nor I am folding to if he shoves on river.

Quote:
Originally Posted by JWK24 View Post

I also don't want to shove the turn, because of two reasons. First, the bet does not pot-commit me (it does the opp, if they know that they are, but does not commit me). Secondly, I can then get off the hand if another club hits, as I'll be beat by a higher flush.
I don't understand why turn shove is any different from turn 1448 bet (As he will have 1674 on turn only)
 
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Sat May 24, 2014, 10:33 AM
(#8)
JWK24's Avatar
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If I make a standard bet on the flop, then I would shove the turn... because then the play would be a standard bet.

As played, the bet does not pot-commit me, so I'm not shoving.

When playing, I want to keep all of my bets and raises standard, as this helps to conceal the strength of my cards. Players that make abnormal bets are basically turning their cards face-up to an observant opponent.. something that I need to avoid.

John (JWK24)


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Sat May 24, 2014, 10:45 AM
(#9)
adikumar2010's Avatar
Since: Mar 2011
Posts: 1,094
Thanks for clearing my doubt I now understood what I did wrong.
 

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