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25NL ZOOM, JJ on the btn preflop play

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25NL ZOOM, JJ on the btn preflop play - Wed Jun 04, 2014, 01:30 PM
(#1)
dirt eh's Avatar
Since: Jun 2010
Posts: 1,274
Villains are both unknown. Preflop I'm not sure about my 4-bet.
Obviously hand plays itself PostF.

SB(7): 29/29/0.0
BB(5): 40/0/3.0

 
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Wed Jun 04, 2014, 08:54 PM
(#2)
birdayy's Avatar
Since: Sep 2012
Posts: 1,179
I like pre. You could possibly go a little bigger ($6.50-$7.00).

Sizing is wayyyyy too big otf though. I would bet $4 and call off if he shoves.

Just goes to show the value of 4betting to isolate the weaker player when they cold call 25s twice
 
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Thu Jun 05, 2014, 06:45 AM
(#3)
spand42's Avatar
Since: Sep 2010
Posts: 1,496
I agree with birdayy.

Especially on the flop, you have to look at the effective stack size and SPR. You can bet much smaller on the flop and still get it in on the turn. Betting smaller makes your bluffs cheaper, encourages villain to call wider while not affecting your ability to play for stacks.
 
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Thu Jun 05, 2014, 11:47 AM
(#4)
geoVARTA's Avatar
Since: Oct 2010
Posts: 1,306
I'm actually going to keep this one open to hear more opinion, but I personally would flat with JJ here.
I'm not too happy 4betting when the BB cold calls the 3bet. Usually if they have some crappy hand they would cold 4bet if they suspect the SB to be 3betting wide in this spot. With QQ+, sometimes AK we can also expect a 4bet so really the hands that cold call in this spot are JJ, TT, 99, sometimes AK/AQ. When we 4bet we look very strong since I don't suppose we should have many, if any, 4bet bluffs in our range and I don't expect TT/99 to stick the rest in so we end up flipping with AK and folding worse. So I feel flatting might be more EV than 4betting.
 
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Thu Jun 05, 2014, 09:19 PM
(#5)
TheLangolier's Avatar
Since: Jun 2010
Posts: 13,512
(Head Trainer)
Hey all,

I generally flat here too readless. It's not a button v blind war anymore once the BB cold calls, and I feel like if we 4b and get 5b our hand stinks, while at the same time the action looks so strong that we wind up folding out all the SB's light 3b's and just make it harder to get action from worse hands.

As played, I agree on the sizing being too unnecessarily big. Also, if we had already observed this hand or had a similar read/note on V3, then I very much favor the 4B/get it in line. 52s is wowbad.


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Thu Jun 05, 2014, 09:35 PM
(#6)
dirt eh's Avatar
Since: Jun 2010
Posts: 1,274
What? 52s is bad? I'll have to adjust my cold calling range OOP after someone 4-bets vs. two opponents. LOL.

Note taken on the sizing. I just bet the amount that I did because I wasn't folding and I put the villain on a PP smaller than Jacks. However, I see why a smaller bet would and can induce smaller pocket pairs to shove over my cbet and then I am obvs still calling.
 

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